Huge row with neightbour, AIBU?

[Nikki3009]

Hi,

I moved into a small shared-ownership house on a new-ish build estate to get away from domestic abuse and I'm very thankful for my home, but tonight I have had an awful row with a neighbour, and I feel so upset.

Adjacent to my house, is a row of houses that are LHA - I want to preface this by saying that I have no issue with this, and I'm only putting in this detail because I think it's relevant. I'm not trying to throw shade on people in local authority housing.

When I moved in, one of the fence panels at the side of my house had a load of scaffolding poles leaning against it. The fence panel was buckling under the weight and bits of it were breaking off so I popped round to let them know (thinking it was their fence). The women basically said, it's your fence, your problem. But to give them their due they did remove the scaffolding poles. And I've not mentioned it since even though they've damaged it. I've just had to accept that it'll be down to me to replace it at some point.

They have 5 children, I think, and they are loud which you would expect but hearing them playing in the garden doesn't bother me. My garden is often very noisy because there are lots of houses in close proximity so I just don't use my garden very often.

The kids from this house are always kicking their balls into my garden and they'd come and knock at my door and I'd have a chat with them and then throw their balls back over. Or, if I found a ball in the garden I'd put it back over the fence for them. Again, no problem.

The issue started when I realised that the kids were coming into my garden whilst I was at work (my daughter caught them when she was staying). I think they were climbing over the fence onto my bin, because I noticed my bin lid was damaged one day and then the following day it was worse. The bin hadn't been moved, so I don't know how it had spontaneoulsly crumpled. When I tried to get a new bin my local council wanted to charge me for it, so in order to get a new bin I had to file a criminal damage report. The police did say they would go and speak to them, but I said not to worry as long as I got a new bin, it would be fine.

One day I was working from home, and I was on a teams call with a really high value client. I could hear the kids banging on my front door but I couldn't go and answer it. Then I heard them rattling my side gate and shouting 'oi we want our ball back'. I had to mute my call and ask them to stop shouting and that I'd be there when I could!

There's been lots of this sort of thing going on, it's irritating but nothing I've complained about. They flooded my side alley way by emptying their swimming pool at the bottom of their garden. They're (the parents) just generally just a bit laissez faire I think and don't really have any respect for their neighbours or their neighbours property.

Roll on this evening and I'm sitting in my lounge with my DD and all we can hear is the fence being smashed by a football. A bit later I'm doing a bit of clearing up and I go out to my side alley to take some rubbish and SMASH the ball hits the fence, the fence panel which is hanging on by a thread anyway looks like its going to fall on me.

I shouted "Excuse me, could you not hit the fence like that please". Now, I hold my hands up, I was stern when I said it but I think it was the shock of the noise. When they shouted back 'we're shooting goals', I replied 'perhaps you could move your goal'? I personally think the parents should be telling their children not to kick a football at their neighbours fence or am I just a bit old school?

The next thing I know, there is hammering at my front door and I mean absolute bashing my door. I wasn't going to answer it, but whoever it was, clearly wasn't going to stop. So I opened the door and it was the mum from the house adjacent to mine.

She shouted "who the fck do you think you are, if you've got a problem you come to my door, you don't speak to my children". It was so aggressive, so I said hold on, the kids are smashing a ball into the fence. And she said "you and that fcking fence....just because you're too tight to f*cking fix it". So, I said why should I pay to fix the damage you caused? And then she went a bit mental.

I thought she was going to hit me. The women's husband had come along and he was holding her back! I was really trying to calmly explain to him why I had said something.

She was going ballistic screaming and shouting about the fence being damaged before I even moved in and so I said well they've damaged it even more by climbing over it to get into my garden. She said 'what's your problem with them getting their ball back"? I said, because if I'm not here, they don't have permission to come onto my property. She laughed and said 'Oh you're a fat fucking bitch". At which point my daughter got involved and told her to f*ck off.

I made my daughter go inside, she was so angry, but she's seen me being verbally abused by her Dad so many times that I think it just triggered her.

The women then said that the kids don't climb over the fence, they come in at the side gate (which I do leave unlocked when it's bin day). She was sneering at me, saying they're just kids, whats the problem. She's lived there 8 years and never had any problems until I moved it (what?)

I was mortified by all the shouting and screaming on the street. I was having a reasonable conversation with her husband but even as she was walked off she shouted "I'm going to tell them to kick your fence even harder".

I feel a bit gaslit...am I being unreasonable? How would you feel if strangers' kids just came into your garden when they felt like it? How would you feel about your fence being used as goal and being damaged? Maybe I'm not cut out for being in close proximity to people with younger kids.

And the 'f•cking fat b*tch' comment has just brought back so many horrible memories of all the verbal abuse and the constant put downs. I kow I'm overweight (I'm a menopausal woman, size 16 and struggling to shift the meno weight). I just didn't really need that being sceamed in my face in my safe space. My daughter got it on video and I'm so tempted to make a police complaint, but I don't want to make things any worse.

What would you do in my situation? I don't want any animosity. Clearly she has different ideas of being neighbourly, respecting neighbours property etc.

I'd been feeling so good recently, I'm having CBT, I'm trying to re-build my life and this has made me feel so small and I'm embarrassed because I'm sure the other neighbours heard it all.

Thank you for listening and letting me vent... xx

I don't know what i would do in your shoes.
Our neighbours kids kick their ball into our garden. We chuck it back when they knock, if we are free. It wouldn't bother me if they came and got it when we are out.
I think that you can only control what you can.
Realistically you can't stop them climbing over when you are not there. I would stop worrying about that. I might lodge a complaint about her anti social behaviour with her landlord.

The fact she's LHA is relevant because you can raise a complaint with them i'd also suggest cameras and a video doorbell , eufy do a good set up not too expensive and no subscription. We had people using our alley for all sorts and surprisingly now there's a camera they go elsewhere.
If you don't want to go to the police yet (gives you an escalation route if the HA action isn't sufficient) keep hold of that video.

Report to their housing association. That's what I would do

I would move house. They sound absolutely vile.

this. all of this.

What a nightmare! So I have some ideas for you:

Move the bin much further into your garden. Lock the gate (why does it need to be unlocked on bin day?) Put something behind the gate that’s easy for you to move but difficult to land on - for example, you could keep a large bucket full of branches there (place 2 bricks in the bucket so it can’t easily be pushed over or poked aside. Very cheap and simple and effective.

In the short term, I’d find something that makes it very uncomfortable to land on your side of the fence too.

For longer term plant holly, a climbing rose (mine has vicious thorns), pyracantha etc along the boundary of your garden. You could also use a few things that grow fast and large and just “too hard to climb over” - we have some red robins, it took a few years to get big but they get large and bushy (and will piss off your neighbours dropping leaves once tall enough, double bonus). Maybe a hawthorn if you like or as pp said a blackthorn. Lovely hedge plant will look pretty and grow up as a good defence. (holly is very slow growing so if you can’t find a large cheap one don’t bother.) It will take time for the plants to grow up all the way along, so meantime buy some short bamboo canes or gather some branches from a local woodland (very cheap) and poke them into the soil - landing on a load of spiky sticks will make them think twice. I did this and it has entirely stopped the local foxes jumping over my fence!

I might consider getting a needle and when the ball comes over, carefully make a small hole somewhere unnoticeable. It’s hard to slam a soggy ball so hard at a fence.

I would definitely get a spy hole for your front door and stop answering to her. Don’t return the balls for 3 days when they come over.

I’d simultaneously drop a note through the door of your neighbour and say very nicely “Hi, I’m sorry we ended up in an argument the other day, I would like us to be on friendly terms! Please ask your kids to kick their ball in the other direction in future. I don’t want to end up in a situation where the fence falls down and you owe me money to replace it. Please also let the kids know that I will always return their ball but as I am working from home and very busy, I won’t be always be able to return it immediately. So it’s best if they kick their ball the other way so that there’s less chance it comes over my fence. Please let your kids know that they do not have permission to enter my garden, and it is not safe for them to climb over my fence to get in. Best regards.”

Send complaint to the HA detailing the damage to your fence.

Going against the grain here OP but if you go to the police things are just going to escalate
The husband sounds more reasonable could you approach him about sitting down with both of them to try and find a solution?
As others have said why not leave the side gate open and say it is OK for the children to retrieve their ball without disturbing you when the gate is open.
However if the gate is locked it is not acceptable for them to gain access to your garden by climbing into it.
I would try and move bins, replace fencing, as a priority to also make it difficult for them to do so.
The only way forward with this is mediation and trying to find a solution which works for everyone

This has taken away your peace of mind and you need to do whatever is necessary to get it back

You are not being unreasonable but you are dealing with people who are and who have the ability to make your life difficult. I would do the necessary (even if it really grates) to bring about some level of harmony and living together without conflict.

Good luck OP, I feel for you x

Yes, plant a prickly hedge, also get the fence raised if possible and put cat spikes along the top.

Any balls get kicked away and are returned once a week, by you throwing them over, no kids on your property. If they try to come onto your property, oops, somehow the ball got damaged. Must have landed on a knife.

Unfortunately I would also start stabbing the balls before return. Footballs arent that cheap if you have to repeatedly have to buy new ones.

Strengthen existing fence then build another. Put thick hedging up (preferably prickly to deter attempts to climb) so there’s at least 6/7ft of height.

Move the bin and don’t leave your gate unlocked.
Instal a Ring doorbell and camera down your garden.

Unfortunately ignorant people will take no notice of any polite requests.

She knows she's at fault, she knows her kids are in the wrong so she leaps to the defensive, if that's any consolation. She's yelling at you to distract you from being right and to try to scare you into stopping being assertive.

Move anything the kids can use to get over into your garden, Can you put trellis or something on top of your fence to make it higher? If not then try something else to make the fence unpleasant and difficult to climb. If you've got a broken fence panel try to get it replaced (one less thing for her to complain about). Cameras and - and I know this is difficult - utter icy calm if you can manage it. It's very very hard for someone to scream, rant and lose it against a person who just stares them down and repeats something like 'I'm sorry you feel that way, but this is MY garden.'

Yeah, she would have called you fat even if you were a size 10. Don't let it get to you.

Was her DH being reasonable?

If so I would consider a time when he is in, she is out, and knock on the door, with your Dd.

Say you do not want to be having upset with your neighbours and would like to resolve things.

Explain that you are happy to throw balls back when you are in but never to have the kids in your property when you are out, and they cannot knock during the working day.

Also say you cannot afford new fences and the scaffolding and now the balls have made your fence really fragile so can they please not kick balls against it : that is all you are asking.

Be nice, be explanatory… but direct and calmly , pleasantly assertive.

Also, are you 100% sure it is your fence?

Really good point here OP about errecting a new fence inside the old one. Don’t give her the benefit of your new fence. I wish I’d done this.

Live near shit. Deal with shit.

I just wanted to say, well done you for saying relevant things back to the horrible woman and for standing your ground in the face of that aggression. It sounds like your background has made you even more vulnerable than most to that sort of behaviour and I for one think you dealt with it all brilliantly, making good points back to her and keeping calm.

I think you ROCK!

What next? I’d log it. Bullies get away with this stuff because of a fear it will get worse.

Do people know how expensive fences are to buy and get erected securely?

Pyracantha (common name is firethorn) all the way. Makes a fantastic hedge. Native plant, hardy, evergreen, beautiful white flowers followed by coloured berries that the birds love. Grows fast, especially in spring, and you just trim the young shoots to shape and control it. Huge thorns, will puncture any balls. Nobody will be climbing over and you can’t be sued if they hurt themselves trying. Nature’s barbed wire! I suggest for now, rather than paying for a new fence, you buy a few of these (as large as you can afford) and fill the gap with them. Carry on up the fence line. Once they have replaced a few punctured balls they will be offering to replace the fence themselves just to keep the thorns away!

Nightmare neighbours! Please report them to the council or their housing association.

Tenants are bound by tenancy agreements, which includes rule about:

Not causing nuisance, harassment, or antisocial behaviour toward neighbours (including shouting and aggression)

Respecting boundaries and property (including damaging fences or repeated trespassing)

Supervising children to ensure they don’t cause damage or disturbance.

Well it's already deteriorated and you can't reel it back. You need to make a formal complaint to her landlords about her abusive behaviour. You're not going to have a cordial relationship anyway so there's not really much to lose. You can't allow her to think being abusive like that will not be reported because it will escalate even more if she thinks you won't report it.

I will say I haven't read all the replies, but do agree with most of what has been said. The only thing I would add if it hasn't been mentioned already is that you shouldn't just take her word for it that the fence is your responsibility. Check the deeds (or whatever the equivalent is with shared housing) in case it is her responsibility and she is trying to pass the financial burden on to you.

We've got a neighbour like that and everyone knows she's a psycho. She had a massive go at me once and the lady next door to her said she has a reputation for it. Dont feel embarrassed, it's her that looks nuts, you're fine. A ring door bell and a camera on your garden / fence is a good idea

Absolutely this.

I would report to the housing association, report to the police on 101. I would also check with the HA whose responsibility the fence is

I would try and catch him alone (as he seems calmer) and have a conversation around her behaviour and the issues with the kids and say it’s not acceptable, mention the damage to the bin and more damage to the fence and that you have reported her behaviour as its harassment

tell him the kids needs to stop kicking the ball over, and if they do they will have to wait for you to return the ball

When you can afford to mend the fence, if it’s yours, then make it as high as you can. Keep your side gate locked. On bin day move the bin out to the front

You are living amongst scratters. They won’t change. I’d be looking at moving.

Cameras yes. Logging everything yes. Quiet word with police and HA yes. Stabbing the footballs NO, mummy dearest will go fking apeshit and very probably pursue OP for damaging her property.

I had a neighbour used to get her kids to fling dogshit and squirt a hose over my fence every time I tried to sit out/ do some gardening. Absolute animals. I feel for OP.