To think school should’ve let me keep ds4 back a year?

[BulletinGuru]

hi im new here so sorry if this is in the wrong place.

my ds4 started reception this week, hes only just turned 4 in feb so hes one of the youngest. hes finding it really hard, crying every morning, not wanting to go in, teachers saying hes not joining in with carpet time and gets upset when hes told off.

i did ask last year about keeping him back until hes older but school said its not really possible unless theres “special reasons”. i just feel like hes not ready yet. hes still quite babyish, wants his dummy sometimes at night and struggles with writing. some of the other kids are nearly 5 and it seems unfair hes expected to keep up.

dh says “he will be fine” and i should just give it time but its horrible seeing him so upset.

aibu to think they should let younger ones start later?

Struggling with drop off and joining in is normal. Still having a dummy is not - you need to get rid of this. Potty training, I empathise as our daughter was similar with refusing to go unless wearing a nappy and it was really hard. You need to work with the school on this and get some sort of care plan in place so they can help him with personal hygiene. It does read like you ‘baby’ him a lot. I think you need to start rapidly changing how you support him to encourage his confidence and independence, and support him with adjusting to school. He isn’t young for the year by any stretch, he just needs preparing more.

It’s early days for school: keep things light and positive. Chuck the dummies away and sort out the potty training. Keep an eye out for SEN and have a word with your health visitor.

Sorry, I'm not understanding this at all. My little girl is 3 and will be 4 in November, so 9 months younger than your son. She's in preschool now due to her birthday but I know if she was in reception instead she'd be absolutely fine. She's fully potty trained, bright eyed, bushy tailed and ready to learn. In the nicest possible way I absolutely think you are babying your son a bit and he should really be ready for school at this point.

Awww it's hard, OP. There is a reason why in many countries, school starts at 6. Not much you can do really other than try and support him as best you can and also communicate with the teacher.

P.s it really is up to you whether you want to defer him, you would just have to put him down as homeschooled no one can tell you otherwise unless there are agencies involved for any reason.

But, if you did decide to do that I really would be using that time to fully teach him how to be independent.

Having older siblings around the house should help with this.

If you are concerned about his development, then school would help pin point those areas too, and hopefully offer support if things did become apparent.

Children aren’t all the same, though? From what the nursery have said, there maybe something developmental going on here as well as the parenting.

Well they can implement an intimate care plan.

No they're not all the same but it's the 'young for his year, should have been kept back' that's confusing me.

So you need to toilet train him asap, stop using pull ups during the day. Most reception children can’t write yet because they’ve only just started school!

When are children ready you just have to get on with it and potty training him. Teacher's don't change nappies.

Still using dummy and not toilet trained at 4.5? Does he have additional needs? My dd2 started school 5 days after turning 4, so definitely one of the older kids.

Where is your DH in all this, @BulletinGuru?

It has only been a short while since school started, so for many young children, this may all be very new.

As others have said, the crying is the least of the issues. My DC went to primary school with a child who cried every single morning without fail when they were dropped off. Crying, sobbing, clinging to the parent, and having to be gently prised off by parent & TA to get them into the classroom.
Once in school they were absolutely fine, quite happy at home-time, etc.
It took until Y5 for them to actually go into the classroom without fuss.

The important things to focus on are getting toilet trained asap, and ditching the dummy.
This is something that some nurseries work on in conjunction with schools ('school readiness' - which includes using cutlery, putting coats and shoes on and some very basic fine motor skills). However, not all nurseries do this and schools often have to try to manage children who can't toilet properly, don't know how to hold a knife and fork, etc.
Whilst the more children you have, the less time you may have to work on these things, they do need to be done.
If school are not picking up on any potential developmental delays then that's all good, although it may be worth checking out to see if there are more ways to help and support your DS.

Sorry?! He's 4.5 and he's not potty trained and still has a dummy?! If he isn't SEN then you have failed by not preparing him for school. If he is 'babyish' you have yourself to blame.

He is in the older half which is September to end Feb.

@BulletinGuru you need to do something here you have dropped the ball in dealing with his feelings of going from being the baby to not being the baby by letting him keep the things that tie him to his baby brother and to you

the school will only let you defer if born in the summer term and you are would be kicking the can down the road and not solving the actual issue which is how his baby brother has affected him and his place in the family

My son is july end born so literally one of the youngest. Only 2 kids in the entire school were younger than him when he started. He was also one of the smallest physically. He did fine in reception, fantastic at sports day - won all the races even against kids twice his size,did really well at reading and math and had a fab year. So a feb born child should be fine. Give him time to adjust. And really get rid of the dummy, he is far too old for it.

A February birthday puts him in the middle of his year so there is no reason for keeping him back.
You still though have the right not to send your child to school until the term after his fifth birthday which in your dis’s case would be after Easter 2026. You actually don’t need school’s permission though it can be difficult to find your child a school place of you do this.
I think you should be looking for other reasons than his age for an explanation of why he is unhappy. Has he told you why? Do his teachers have any insights? It is still early days. He will probably settle in a few weeks.

That's what they say but in reality it's not.

I think 4 is too young to start school for some children especially boys.

I am very glad I don't live in England so don't have this problem as my child would not have coped (emotionally - he's clever) . I think 4 is still below compulsory school age in England so I think he doesn't have to go? Or can you speak to the school about support for him?

Op you are correct and its sad to see the responses

4 IS young to start school - look across europe - in other european countries they think we are crazy putting 4 year olds in formal classrooms. and yes, reception is formal - ive spent time in reception there is plenty of guided work, sitting in circles etc

some children are not ready!! they don't get ready all at the same time.

it's quite claer some 4 year olds really really struggle at this point

by the way bedwetting at night has nothing to do with being dry in the day and it is normal to stay wet longer at night - it's nothing to do with training

you sound like you have your handsfull

one question - his response to toilet training does sound quite extreme and it sounds like possible nuerodivergence? any other signs?

You’ve got 3 children older than him - how can you not understand that in England a child born in February is not the youngest in the year group? And how can you think that him being ‘only’ 4 and a half is an excuse for him not being toilet trained? He’s 4 and a half! He’s young for his age because you’ve parented him to be young for his age, and instead of giving yourself a shake you’re on here asking if school are unreasonable!

"its like a power struggle and i end up giving up cos i’ve got the baby to deal with too."

You've just hit the nail on the head there.

I have a 5yo and she wants to be the boss of the house (her words) so always wants her own way, and I have a baby too. So I do get how you can end up giving up.

But that's the key, once they know they have that card up their sleeve, that you'll give up, they're the ones in control and they'll use all their tactics to get you to back down and to get their own way.

I think he's old enough to be sat down tonight and told: four-year-olds don't wear nappies. Five-year-olds certainly don't. We're stopping the nappies tonight. We've run out now and mummy and Daddy won't be buying anymore. Now my daughter would try and call my bluff so I'd empty the bag before hand and leave the empty bag in the usual spot. I'd then set out clearly, that if you don't wee in the toilet, you will be wet and cold all day. Mummy will not be buying more pull ups now. You have to wee in a toilet from when you wake up tomorrow.

Let him scream, let him cry, let him suffer the consequences over the weekend.

Let him realise there really is no other option, there is no going back to what is safe.

I will caveat that with, at the same time, I'd want to gently try and establish if anything is stopping him from wanting to try. Is he too scared of failing (e.g. has he had accidents and somebody has got cross and made a big huff about cleaning it up, because the baby is also screaming and dinner is on the hob, etc). I'd try and reset his expectations/allay his fear by saying it's OK if you have accidents as long as you're trying your best to go to the toilet.

Or is it literally an attention thing with the new baby? In that case, that's easy to solve by heaping on loads of positive attention elsewhere and trying to build in little moments of connection through the day. (Though it might be slow progress and not an overnight fix). My daughter has been craving my attention and I find myself saying no to games etc, so often. Either the baby wants me, or the baby would ruin what she wants to do, or I am just tired and can't be bothered, or got food to cook, or jobs to do.... So I have to be conscious of that because I am worried she's spent a year hearing "no, no, no, you don't matter!"

The dummy, I don't know. I think I'd have to "lose" it....

we have lost sight of the 'purpose' of early chlidhood. it is to be playful!
Children - before formal schooling became the norm - just played for years - and that is how they learnt

that is why there is a call for school (ie. sitting down/learning etc) to wait til a lot later - around 7. They can still 'learn' before 7 but in a much more supportive child friendly environment

IN this sort of really good kindergarten type care - your son could actually get the help he requires for the age he is ACTUALLY at not where people think he should be. Then your son could be supported - which clearly it's harder for you to do with lots of kids at home.

your son clearly needs to develop in other ways before he can move on to bloody phonics.

I remember my june born daughter would fall asleep on the carpet in reception - she simply wasn't ready

and it carries on - my april born son couldn't cope at all with the writing pressures in year 1 and 2 - despite emotionally being fine at that stage

school is not geared towards children it is all about targets.

Boys are often behind girls in being ready and also children are different. Just because yours is ready doesn't mean all children are!

If he is still not properly potty trained I suggest you take him to the GP. There is a quite common treatable medical condition that might be the cause of this. Best to find out now if this is the problem.