Is being a family compatible with lack of freedom?

[bmosca]

For context: My wife (DW) and I have been married for over six years and have two young children — our son (DS) is 3, and our daughter (DD) is 6 months and currently breastfed. DW is on maternity leave and expected to return to work sometime next year. I work full-time as a software developer.

Recently, a friend invited me to play football after work.
It’s been a while since I’ve done any sport or had time for myself, so I accepted right away.
Around midday, I let DW know I’d be playing for 90 minutes after work. Her reaction caught me off guard — she was upset that I hadn’t “asked” her if it was okay for her to look after the kids during that time. I ended up cancelling the game.
Later, DW was emotional and said she feels like she spends the whole day without seeing me, and was hoping we’d go for a walk together with the kids after work. She also reminded me that maternity leave isn’t a holiday — which I do understand.
But I can’t help wondering: isn’t her day less stressful than mine?
She spends her time breastfeeding while watching TV, napping, and bonding with the children. We’re currently staying with her parents, so she doesn’t have to cook or manage household chores.
Meanwhile, I’m working full-time, attending meetings, and mentally drained by the end of the day.
After work, I still help with cooking, cleaning, bedtime routines, bathing, reading stories, calming DD when she’s unsettled, changing nappies, playing with the kids, handling paperwork, mowing the lawn, and washing the car.
The only things I don’t do are laundry and lunch prep.

I genuinely don’t mind taking care of the kids if she wants to meet a friend or take time for herself — I’ve told her that. But I’m struggling to understand why I need explicit permission to do something for myself, especially when I gave her notice well in advance.
If this is how things are, does having young kids mean I can never do anything social or recreational without it being a problem?

Have you got any experience of spending a day looking after the kids on your own? If the answer is no, I think you’re probably not in a position to decide whose day is more stressful.

I say this as a woman who doesn’t have kids. I wouldn’t assume I know what it’s like to spend a day looking after small kids, because I don’t.

How many of your children have you grown, given birth to, sustained with your own body and looked after all day every day? Zero? What a surprise.

Basically, you and your wife both work whilst you are at your paid employment. You earn money, and she enables you to earn money. In the hours you are not working, you should both put in equal amounts of time doing any household and childcare jobs that she has not managed to do during your working hours. With a 6 month old, that will be most of the jobs. When the children are older she'll probably be able to get more done whilst you're at work.
Once the jobs are done, assess how much time is left and divide it equally. You can either have an ad hoc system, where both of you are responsible for the children all the time you're not at work, and when either of you wants to do something recreational you check with the other in advance. Or you could have a set night (or more) off duty each. So eg you have Tuesday from.8pm to 11pm and that's your hobby time and you don't need to check in advance because DW knows he kids are her sole responsibility then. She has Wednesday night.
Your choice how you work it, but it needs to be equal.

I think there's something fundamentally wrong when either parent can't have 90 minutes downtime to enjoy a hobby out of the entire week.

That said, when making plans its always sensible to make your partner aware in case there's a clash. But hell would freeze over before I'd be seeking permission like I'd have had to ask my mum as a child.

I think you are romanticising being at home with children of those ages big time.

Realistically having children does curtail your freedom especially when they are very young. It's why most families stick to small numbers, relatively close together so they don't have large proportions of their lives curtailed.

Out of respect then l "ask" my husband. It only seems fair to me and he does the same for me. I know when l was on maternity leave l was glad when he got home as it was a long day -l had twins but l doubt a 3 year old and a small baby are much easier. You make maternity leave sound quite pleasant, in contrast like a lot of people l found it hard work.

How much time does your wife REALLY get to herself -having a shower, doing tasks while they nap etc don't count

I do think it’s only polite to check with a spouse that it’s ok to pop out after work etc to make sure nothing is amiss.

but it’s seriously unhealthy to not have any other interests or time away. Kids are hard yes but seriously I don’t understand so many posts about people having hobbies.

nothing stopping your wife doing the same some evenings once you are home

I do think you should have asked her if it was ok but equally, I think she should have told you that yes, of course it was ok and waved you off with "have a lovely time."

Whilst maternity leave isn't a holiday and being at home with 2 small kids is dull and hard work and I get that she's fed up she is being unreasonable I think and both of you should get to do things you want to do. Especially if she's at her parents and presumably they are helping a bit? And working FTOTH is also hard work, it just is.

So no, you shouldn't have to give up everything you love doing because you have kids but I think you need to agree between you what notice should be given. I hope you work it out.

In my experience I was more stressed when staying with my parents with my young children because of the fear ruining something of someone else's, or just generally being in their way.
As a family you're a team so you should at least run things past her.
Good that you support her to have her own life, but it can take more encouragement for women to take partners up on these offers because theyre so much further removed from their old life than you are.

She spends her time breastfeeding while watching TV, napping, and bonding with the children.

You've never looked after kids for any significant length of time, have you? You make it sound like a holiday. Looking after newborns/small children is one of the most draining and frustrating things you can do. When I went back to work after maternity leave I found it to be an oasis of organised calm (and it's not, it's very stressful). Small children are absolute chaos. Everything is unstructured, you have very little control over your time and everything takes twice as long as it should, you find yourself in an endless cycle of repetition (cleaning things which have been dirtied five minutes after you last cleaned them). Everything is dirty and disordered. You can't have an adult conversation. There is constant background noise which doesn't abate unless the children are asleep. You're constantly being touched by small hands and have no time for your own thoughts.

I genuinely don’t mind taking care of the kids if she wants to meet a friend or take time for herself — I’ve told her that. But I’m struggling to understand why I need explicit permission to do something for myself, especially when I gave her notice well in advance.

You don't need permission. You just need to show you're not assuming that she will always be the default parent without complaint. You need to show her you have some sense of where she is at the moment and the fact that she might want some respite from it.

With all kindness, because you sound naive rather than malicious, the way you're behaving and thinking about her and her role in the family ends marriages. If you fail to consider how she is feeling like this, she will become incredibly resentful and eventually want to leave you.

Totally depends on the work split.

We have a 1 year old, currently 7 months pregnant with our second and both my husband & I have always still had time for hobbies BUT that was okay because we were both absolutely doing our part as partners and parents, no resentment. If my husband hadn’t been doing his share I wouldn’t have been so accomodating and neither would he.

Ha ha good luck with this.

2 dc and breastfeeding. And living with parents. I don’t think your job is more stressful than that.

Her day is not less stressful than yours. Your description of her day suggests you have little idea what it is like to have an infant and toddler to care for all day. You don’t get a moment peace and have to have eyes in the back of your head.

wanting to get back into sport is good, but it’s needs coordinating with your wife, not just springing on her.

Being single is incompatible with freedom.

Because being single means having fuck all money.

Being very familiar of the working life of the software developer there's not a lot of sympathy forthcoming here. She doesn't get to chat in the kitchen, gab with the team, nip out at lunchtime etc and the myriad things that developers, like most working people, do.

Small children need a lot of attention, new babies are like limpets (in the nicest way mostly) and it's a really tiring time.

Stress is a subjective thing so I think you need to put yourself in her shoes before you start the "my jobs more stressful" crap.

I also sincerely hope you didn't cancel your football game and then proceed to play the put upon male because there's nothing that breeds resentment more than one half of the relationship making out that they're hard done by.

She spends her time breastfeeding while watching TV, napping, and bonding with the children.

Oh my god. Is that what you think looking after a three year old and six month old is? Seriously?

You also seem to have forgotten to mention night feeds. Funny, that.

Reading what is posted... currently she does no household chores.
I don't think Op was unreasonable to be honest. He appears to do his fair share of childcare and everyone should be able to get 90 minutes to themselves without asking permission. That includes his wife, and he's got no problem with her taking some time to herself.

I think it is only fair to check in with the other parent to make sure they weren't feeling particularly snowed under, or had dinner planned etc. DH and I would always check with the other.

You cannot make the assumption that your wife is the default parent, always there to take care of the kids so you can do what you wish. Of course you can and should be able to play football with friends, but it is only polite to not assume that you always have someone at home doing what needs to be done. When work finishes, you are equally responsible for the kids, if you want to delegate your portion of that to your wife you need to check in with her.

I would have assumed that you would need football kit etc to play football, so wouldn't be able to go on the day? Get it booked in for the future, but just don't make assumptions about your wife taking on your share.

His attitude is clearly that he has a worse time of it, than a breast-feeding mother who is looking after a three year old and a six month old.

And he just blithely agreed to and hour and a half of not being at home in the evening, with no discussion, when she is probably desperate for a break by that time. I know I was.

Agreed...hahahaha 😅

For what it's worth I don't think a calm rational conversation (at least as much as is possible with potential sleep deprivation) about the possibility of you taking some time for a hobby is unreasonable. The problem was presenting it as a done deal and just assuming it would be ok.

Op you both have a tough day but now imagine someone saying to you ‘but what you do isn’t really work is it?’ Just talk to your wife in advance so you can have a guilt free game and also have a date night/ go for a walk together and then give her a day off too

I guess what might be missing here is whether the wife gets some respite help from her parents. As they are living with them... that might affect how 'desperate for a break' she might be.

I should imagine that most mothers here had to look after young children, and do a housework, while their partner was at work. She may also have company of her parents.

I reckon she is also feeling his attitude, which he shows on here. Which is that she is having a lovely skipping through the flowers kind of day - with a three year old and a six month old! - while he does the "actual work".

Your bang out of order saying 'isn't her day less stressful then mine'. Its not a competition.

However, you couldn't even have 90 minutes to play football. You need to talk to her in a way that's kind and discuss a way forward.