To let this friendship drift?

[Rosebold]

I have been close to my friend since secondary school, we went though university together, travelled together, moved to London for a while together and in the past she felt like a soul mate. However in the past five years I've had two children, been at home with them, went to back to work and am now a very busy working mother. My friend on the other hand is married but childfree, her husband is a high earner and she hasn't had a job since she's been with him, she does work at something creative but its not something she makes a living from. Her life is all about the books she's reading, her creative projects, her self care routine etc. Essentially more like the kind of life we had in our 20's and its like she has just gone deeper into that as opposed to growing up into something more adult. Even physically she looks like she did at 25 and seems stuck at that age.

It's not that I think she's wrong or that I don't like her anymore, she's been great with my kids and always goes out of her way to make things easier for me when we meet up because I have more demands on my time. It's more that we were once so close and on the same page with everything but now we feel very far apart. She's sympathetic to the pressures I am under but she hasn't been there herself and I just feel more seen and understood with women who have more similar lives to me these days, with kids and careers.

Its also more difficult because if we meet up if I bring my kids or even one of them it limits where we go or the kids get bored and act up unlike if I meet other Mum friends we can go to the park or some other activity and our kids will play together while we chat and get coffee. It's getting to the point where if I see a message from her I am feeling a bit agitated at the pressure I feel under and I procrastinate over getting back to her and I am seeing her less and less.

I don't want to lose touch with her altogether as I think in time as she matures more we might re-find our connection but at the moment with such little free time I just prefer to share it with people who really get me and know what my life is like, it that so unreasonable?

Parents aren't 'selfless'. They just extend their concept of 'self' to include their children. They don't give any more of a shit about other people's children, or about the world in general, than they did before reproducing. If anything, I would say the opposite is true as having children tends to narrow your worldview.

I think OP hasn’t moved on from the barbarian era where women’s only role in life was to procreate.

In fact, she’s started arguing with me about pensions instead of discussing her “friendship” which apparently triggered the thread. Wouldn’t be surprised if there is an agenda.

@Scar88 Thank you and I totally agree with you. I'm sure I've seen quite a few threads in the past where women who don't work for example are hauled over the coals for sponging off a man and not contributing.

You’re not a net contributor, you take out more than you put into the system. Whereas childfree people are more likely to be net contributors.

So please get off your high horse, OP.

Did someone hijack your account? Because going by your posts here, women choosing to be childfree is very definitely a problem for you.

She has no dc. That is a completely valid choice and being able to discuss literature and creative projects is just as valid (probably a whole lot more well rounded) that discussing the latest bottle feeding sterilisers and how many words Timmy now speaks

I have 3 new adult dc and I found people like your df a whole lot more fun to hearing than other mums huddling in cafes talking about Boden sales and where to get school shoes

Exactly. Many parents would fuck over anyone else’s children in a heartbeat if it means their child comes out on top. It’s totally dog-eat-dog.

OP don’t be one of those women who can’t see friends without their DC also going.

OP, I hope re-reading this post of yours allows you to see how much you disapprove of and dislike your 'friend'. Why would you continue having her in your life in these circumstances? The only possible reason would be to allow yourself to carry on feeling your righteous anger. I hope your own reflections on this thread have been illuminating to you.

I think OP is “one of those women” in lots of different ways.

And who do you think is paying for you and your children? I suppose all the taxes you and your DH pay covers the entire of their free nursery hours, education, healthcare etc.,etc. That would be me - a TAX PAYING CHILDLESS PENSIONER who has paid for you, is paying for your children and will continue to do so until the day I die. So don't start the bullshit about your contribution to society - if we do the math, I would bet that you are actually a drain on society.

As for pensions - I'm 67, and if I had depended on you and your generation (or any generation) I would be living in poverty right now. The reason I am not is because I made provisions for my own pension, just as everybody and their uncle was told to and is being told to. So don't make me laugh that your children will be personally paying for anyones future. Bearing in mind your judgey attitudes, just be careful they will even be around in your future - being a parent doesn't mean they will stick by you in any circumstances. You know, they might think that you are judgey, immature and really have a rubbish career...

Your parents, husband and career must be a thrill to hear about.

Why do you need to take your kids when you meet up with her?

Does she have to be miserable and physically aged to be ‘grown up’?

Sounds dreamy 😍

Differently, but not more. People who dont have kids already contribute disproportionately to society through their taxes for services used by families and children. Most dont mind, until some up themselves mother (its never dads spouting this shit) comes along bleating about how superior they are now.

People obv hate to admit it but having kids does mature you more than not having them. You learn how to be selfless, a patience you can't comprehend.

This line always cracks me up when I see it in this kind of debate. The idea you can only really understand love and patience because you reproduced yourself does not speak well to your character. Many people are able to be patient, kind, loving and thoughtful without having skin in the game.

Oh Popette give it a rest. You did not have dc in a conscious effort to hold up the future taxation for the nation. Nor do you work because you altruistically want share your plentiful talents with society.

I am getting second hand cringe.

you claim you are not jealous but you are revealing something of yourself that isn’t complete. When we are genuinely satisfied with our situation and choices we are not triggered by others unless they are actively causing significant social or personal discord.
When we are living our best life we are either happy for others or we are nonplussed. We certainly aren’t annoyed with them. She’s just living a different life to you. Why this bothers you enough to write a post outlining all manner of what you consider negative aspects of her is beyond me but perhaps with some quiet self reflection you can figure out why it unsettles you so much.

She deserves better friends than you.

You definitely feel that you are in a superior more mature position.
When you are similar to many women who make their DC the centre of their world, sometimes that is a regression.

@Scar88 People obv hate to admit it but having kids does mature you more than not having them. You learn how to be selfless, a patience you can't comprehend.

I am childless. I couldn't have children. I spent my 20's working with the most disadvantaged communities in the UK, my 30's and 40's working in war and disaster zones until I was injured aged 53, and having then become disabled as a result I worked to the age of 67 working to protect women and children. Do not tell me that parnets are the only people who are "selfless" - and FWIIW I have "a patience" that I can guarantee you no parent can comprehend. Whe you have spend decades comforting and putting together parents who have lost their own parents, their partners, their children, then you will know what bloody patience is!

Another "arrogant only a parent can possibly understand anything about real life" poster.

"People who dont have kids already contribute disproportionately to society through their taxes for services used by families and children"

Yes this is true except she doesn't work.

@PhilippaGeorgiou You did spend your life making a difference and contributing to the world in amazing and brave ways. This is quite different to sitting at home doing face masks and making nut butter energy balls.

She is supported by her husband not the state, though. Whereas you get more state support.

It sounds like it annoys you that she is not funding your children via taxes.

Do not for one second think I support your views - I think you are judgemental and arrogant and don't deserve your friend.

She sounds interesting and balanced. You should celebrate and be grateful for your friends and if you don’t appreciate her then leave her to put her energy into other friendships. Sometimes you don’t appreciate a good friend until they’ve gone and then it’s too late.

"Essentially more like the kind of life we had in our 20's and its like she has just gone deeper into that as opposed to growing up into something more adult."

Growing up into something more adult.
A bit more like you, you mean.
Adults live a variety of different lifestyles. If your lifestyle requires your friends to be living the same lifestyle as you, then by all means let her drift.

Put your friend out of her misery.

She’s a much more solid person than you are.

Do you have any sense or understanding of how jarring it can be having other people’s DCs present when they’re playing up, at a meet up, if you haven’t got your own children?

She’s a much better friend to you than you are to her.