Feeling pushed out of DGC life

[NannyJignea]

Hi all, I have 2 children, my son is 25, he has 3 children a 5 year old and twin 3 year olds. Obviously he was young when he became a dad but he and his partner were always amazing parents.

In January he and his partner broke up, he’s a joiner but works for the council so not making loads and decided on a one bedroom flat. He has children every other Saturday night from 4pm and until 5pm on Sunday.
Now we only see the children for a few hours on a Sunday afternoon every other week. My son likes them to stay at his on the Saturday night.
We have asked their mum if we could have them the Friday before but she said no as they have tennis on a Saturday morning, we have offered to take them to tennis, still no. We have asked if we could even have them for dinner one night a week or fortnight - still no.

Mum works in a school nursery so she has said we can have the children on in service days, but otherwise we arrange it through our son.

I have asked our son to have the children all weekend every other week and they can stay with us on the Friday but he has said no he’s happy as is.

In addition to this, they have agreed the children will always spend Christmas with mum, so we won’t see them until Boxing Day. They also spent birthday with mum but she did invite us to their party on the weekend before and out for dinner on their actual birthday.

Tomorrow is our eldest granddaughters first day of school, we had the children today as it was in service day. When mum picked them up I asked if we could go over and see them off in the morning, she said no she just wanted it to be her the children and my son as otherwise they would be overwhelmed.

We bought our eldest granddaughter her blazer (which is stupidly expensive), lelli kellys and her school bag and coat, and nursery shoes, bag and coats for the twins. We always spoil them when we have them here etc.

Am I being unreasonable to feel it’s not fair how little we are seeing them, and that mum is being quite controlling?

@NannyJignea your original post is all about what you want, it doesn’t matter what you want or think, it’s down to the parents to decide what works for the children.

It’s irrelevant saying how much you spoil them, it doesn’t give you automatic rights to see them whenever it suits you.

She sounds reasonable, these kinds of demands would do my head in.

Op it's a very delicate situation ,you do see them and she does accommodate you.
You want to see them more which is very common and a common complaint for grandparents who see GC regularly.

Id be trying to look at this from a different perspective ...be grateful and supportive but no fake ..can we help you out we have booked you a spa day oh and we can take the children type helping out !!

It's a crisis that she's going through so back off and being there in the background and as you are don't push for more.

Hopefully this will stand you in good stead with whatever comes

Why aren’t you complaining about him then?

Perhaps both parents find you interfering?

So he has been offered more space but he's declined - I think you have to face up to the fact that your son does not want his children more than the pathetic 23 hours every other week. The mother of the children is likely running herself ragged trying to manage three children and hold down a job. I very much doubt she has time or ability to be any more flexible with her schedule than she already is.
As other posters have said, you need to think about what is best for the children and stop thinking about yourself. And while you're at it. give your son a swift kick up the backside and tell him to pull his finger out.

We lived mikes away from both sets of grandparents so they only saw DGCs four or five times per year. As others have said it’s your don’s lack of access that is the issue- he needs to sort it before it becomes the norm.

It's tricky, but you are not the priority.
Back off a bit, but do still offer invites. Try inviting mum with children to dinner mid-week, say To give you a cooking break and catch up. All you can do is try as well as be supportive.

I think the dcs absolutely need to see their father AT LEAST EOW.
Theyve just lost their family unit. They need to start feeling comfortable in the secong new house.
Spending one of those weekends with you would destroy that. Worst thing to do imo.

What could be done is him having the dcs over during the week.
You picking them up after school, spending the end of the pm together and then their dad taking over for the night.
But takin* iver the weekends they have together is a sure way to negatively impact ther time together.

Your son is hardly parenting. Take it up with him. Don't make demands of mum.

You are allowed to have all your feelings about this, but I dont think you get to have a say.
They are his children not yours.
You may well love them very much and feel like you would like to see them more, but it doesn't sound like it suits them and their parents right now.
Are you still working, or working part time?
If so, could you offer to do pick up from school/nursery once in a while and have him to yours for tea?
I'd given them a couple of months to get used to the new routine of school first though.

Re Christmas, I do think that sounds fair for the children.
They get to see both mum and dad Christmas morning, mum for the rest of the day, then dad (and you) again boxing day.

You are allowed to have all your feelings about this, but I dont think you get to have a say.
They are his children not yours.
You may well love them very much and feel like you would like to see them more, but it doesn't sound like it suits them and their parents right now.
Are you still working, or working part time?
If so, could you offer to do pick up from school/nursery once in a while and have him to yours for tea?
I'd given them a couple of months to get used to the new routine of school first though.

Re Christmas, I do think that sounds fair for the children.
They get to see both mum and dad Christmas morning, mum for the rest of the day, then dad (and you) again boxing day.

Just read all the thread. I can’t imagine a council not being the type of employer to have a flexible working policy, he could at least request flexible hours every other week to allow him to pick the kids up and drop them at school. (Leave early on the Friday, start a bit later on the Monday). Fair enough he won’t be able to share a van ride to work with his mates but if he can drive, he can just take himself to work for those 4 days a month, I don’t think it’s going to kill him.

Then it sounds like both parents are happy with the way things are.

For your son he doesn't have to stress about getting the kids to school/nursery and only sees them every other weekend which in a one bed flat is probably enough. 3 kids sleeping in one bed doesn't sound ideal and if any of them were like mine, their wiggling will be disturbing their sibling, so if he wanted more nights he would need to change this. Yes he has to pay more maintenance as he isn't having them often but I really doubt what he pays covers the cost of 3 little ones. It doesn't sound like he wants extra time with them though, rather it is you that wants this.

The mum knows that it is easier for her to have the kids when it is a weekday and she isn't going to want to have to deal with taking them school if you son dropped them into her early, as why should she have this hassle if she then also loses maintenance for this.

Your son is the problem. My DH was divorced when his daughter was younger than your son’s children - he changed jobs to facilitate nursery hours and still works two twelve hour days to allow for two shorter days and one normal day to allow him to have 50:50 custody. Why on Earth would anyone get a one bedroom flat who has three kids, unless he had no intention of proper overnights? He’ll be time served at 25, joiners for the local council are far from poorly paid. It’s just excuses. If he wanted to be a father more than 1/14th of the time then you’d have more access to your DGC.

Where are you getting this from?

Op isn't asking to have the dgc eow and isn't taking any time away from her son's time with them.

Son has them every other Saturday to Sunday (not every week).

Op has asked if he would have dgc from the Friday night (of his weekend he has them) and they could stay at op's on that Friday night.

How do you expect to have them or a midweek dinner then? Are you expecting their mother to drop
them off and pick them up again?

You are not putting the children or their mother first.

I can see how seeing your grandchildren such a small amount would be really upsetting, if you have prior to the break up been heavily involved in their lives.
However this is a son problem not a ex daughter in law problem because you’ve said several times that your son is happy with the arrangements in place ie the Christmas plans and wanting them in his own space for his contact time, which I also understand.
You can’t really help out by doing school runs because of the difficulties with transport and I can see why it’s less faff for their mum to keep hold of them on a Friday evening to get them to tennis on a Saturday without going back and forwards on buses.
If this a new separation things may improve in time once everyone finds their feet, but your contact time should be when your son has the care of his children.
It’s not down to his ex to facilitate the children’s relationship with you, that’s on him…. Yes it would be nice if you could see them outside of your sons contact time but it probably all feels a little awkward.
If I separated from my DH I wouldn’t go out of my way to facilitate a relationship with their family on that side as they make no effort, however if they were fully involved I would try and still keep that involvement up, for example if they had always collected them from school on Tuesday and taken them out for tea, that routine would still take place.
How did you see them before? If it was adhoc then it’s difficult to now put something in place each week when it’s not your son’s contact time.

Op didn't say that.

Oh OP, you need to give them space.

The Mum sounds like a great mum to be managing all the little ones and holding down a job whilst negotiating her way through a break up! It's amazing she has the energy to take them to tennis at the weekends. All credit to her.

She also sounds very reasonable about Christmas. There's nothing worse than over bearing relatives all turning up on Christmas day. She's very wise to limit it to the immediate family as it will be difficult enough post break up.

The best thing you can do is give them space, get on with your own lives but be available to support them if asked.

So he has been offered more space but he's declined - I think you have to face up to the fact that your son does not want his children more than the pathetic 23 hours every other week

This. Your son clearly doesnt want to see his kids more than he currently does and the thing about the council and his hours is a lie. The council has to consider flexible working patterns for parents caring for children, its literally the law.

He is lying to you - he doesnt want more time with his children. You need to focus your wrath on him, not on the children's mother.

"but hundreds of thousands of single mums seem to manage it ."

This. YABU.

OP, I'm a full-time working single mum. I don't work for someone understanding like public sector. I've changed job five times in the last 12 years to ensure I can be there to do school run for my ds. I did whatever I needed to ensure I was there. In the 7 years of primary school. I only missed one pickup.

All I hear about your DS is excuses. Sorry but he needs to put in for flexible hours, he needs to start applying for other jobs. He can drive so he could easily take his dcs out for supper during the week or have them on Friday nights as well but he CHOOSES not to.

Your dgcs are better off with their mum. She's a lot more committed to them than he is.

You do realise they’re not your kids???

Sounds like they’ve got enough going on with parents without you sticking your oar in and demonising the mother.

I wouldn’t allow my three kids regular extra nights in a one bedroom apartment with their dad either. Especially one that doesn’t actually want them more.

your son needs to do better for his children.
the rest will follow.

I think you’re being offered plenty. I know when my children were that age the weekends were precious.

Your time with your grandchildren comes out of their father’s time with them. The maternal grandparents get their time out of their mum’s time with them.

You say your son is happy with 26 hours every two weeks (frankly, shocking). So you have to accept whatever few hours he allows you out of those 26 hours.

This has got nothing to do with the mum who, actually, sounds remarkably accommodating and generous to me. It’s everything to do with your son being happy to see his children for 26 hours per fortnight.

What are “in service” days.