When someone dies.....

[Wiltshiregirl06]

Posting for traffic here, all suggestions welcome.

A relative lives a very reclusive life, think a farm house in the middle of nowhere, not much contact with others, apart from occasionally getting shopping delivered from another distant relative.
If he dies, how would we find out or be notified? The distant relative doesn't have my contact details, I don't have theirs. The relative in question is elderly, doesn't see or hear well, can't read be or write very well and isn't likely to have our details to hand, or be able to read it if they did.
Is there anywhere we can register that we (my family and my father) are next of kin? Just to complicate matters, my father and them fell out some years ago and don't speak.
Thank you.

I had an uncle in a not dissimilar situation, @Wiltshiregirl06; he too declined all input from others, but luckily he had neighbours who kept an eye on him - for example if they didn't see lights on for a couple of days they'd go and knock anyway, and failing that they'd call the police

If this chap is so isolated that doesn't sound like an option, but I agree with PPs who suggested calling the local social services and flagging him up as a severely vulnerable adult

Realistically he could well lie there for a while if he died, but at least he'd know nothing about it and he'd have led the life he preferred until the end - not ideal perhaps, but there are worse outcomes

if this is true I find this very uncomfortable I don't want random relatives I don't speak to declaring they are my next of kin without my knowledge creepy and unethical in my book

It's tricky OP. My mums cousin died and dispite being in constant contact with my mum, we only found out via me doing a Internet search after months of no replies. She had died and there was a notice of any possible interest in her estate.

Her brother definitely knew my mum would have wanted to know and go the funeral but it seem he told no one as he was nok. Cousins sister had just died the year before so she had her own and sisters inheritance the brother couldn't risk not getting his hands on I guess.

My in laws again we are in contact regularly with but will not discuss things like this. If they die unfortunately it will be up to the police to tell us if we dont find out another way. What can you do? If someone has no plan in place and you can't get hold of them as part of regular contact but miles away you call the police. If your not in regular contact but nok you wait for a police call.

It wouldn't be my choice to be discovered dead weeks later but it happens.

Ideally everyone has physical phone book by the landline or a prominent place and interested neighbours.

How do you know you're next of kin? If you never ever see them and have no contact why do you need so urgently to know that they have passed away?

I'd hope they'd leave their money to charity, not some random distant relatives they fell out with years back or never ever speak to. Who never visited or helped with their care.

So I'd say you don't need to know he died. You didn't care about him when he's alive?

So sad that your first and only thought here isn’t for his welfare, ie visit him, speak to him, try and enrich his life (if he wants you to). He might not be reclusive and isolated through choice, but more to do with circumstance. I know if I was him and nobody bothered about me while alive, I certainly wouldn’t want them to have an interest in when I died. This is a clear decision of leaving to charity instead of money grabbing relatives.

I do hope so.

Have they now?

You could write to them with all your contact details, perhaps including a photo of your family. And then continue to send Christmas cards with all contact details in. These may be found when the person dies and someone could then contact you.

Why are you expecting to be prioritised when they are dead when you aren’t doing so when they are living? There seems to be an unsettling level in entitlement in your question.

@Wiltshiregirl06 - "... Her dad is next of kin legally, but as I said, they fell out... "

Don't worry. Despite what your friend may have led you to believe, legally there is no such thing as "next of kin".

When the NHS or Social Services ask for "next of kin" they just mean who do we contact when you die. The term has no legal meaning or significance whatsoever.

All that matters when people die without a will are the blood relationships listed in the relevant intestacy legislation.

I agree.

If your father is the link and they fell out a long time ago I would think it has nothing to do with you. Unless you are genuinely fond of, and concerned about, this person in which case you would surely have been in touch over the years.

Not read the thread have you?

@AgentJohnson @MrsSkylerWhite

RTFT

It's a very complicated family situation that I'm genuinely trying to find a solution to.

What exactly is the problem that you feel only needs resolving after your relatives death?

Also find out how they are, do they need any help.It sounds like they're living the loneliest existence.
If you're not interested in them when they're alive why show any interest when they're dead

If you'd said this from the start, it would have been easier to comment.
So you are now saying it's not your relative at all but someone else's relative.
I'm that case I don't think there is much you can do. It's something they need to figure out themselves.

Yes entirely right - it's the equivalent of having an emergency contact in this context really. No legal definition - or expectation/obligation - of next of kin and you can't nominate yourself. Not all families are close - one side of our family it and one side isn't - I wouldn't know the cousins of my late uncle from a bar of soap. We didn't fall out we're just very different in age and live in different places - countries even. I won't know when they go and vice versa.

In our local area we have a care shop which is run by volunteers and they have people who phone elderly people on a daily basis just have a chat and if they require anything to be done, shopping house maintenance etc.
Maybe worth a try in the local area and call citizens advice.

It's amazing and disappointing how many Mumsnet responders first thought is of money rather than that people may have concern for distant relatives.

Yup... I'd mentioned that I was going to organise a funeral plan and they spoke in positive terms of someone who had organised a Direct Cremation. (You had to be there to catch the drift of the conversation.) No point in wasting money... (One of them organised that when their spouse died.)

I intend to organise the funeral that I want for myself. They (or their children) can come or not as they please. I know that a couple of the cousins who live closest to me will come if they outlive me. I think that my husband's nephew will come.

Nothing lavish - just the local crem, a very brief eulogy and recordings of my husband singing.

I have relatives on the other side of the family who would most definitely attend, but they all live abroad and it would currently be impossible for them to get here.

Hi, I wonder if it's possible that the gas and electricity people or his bank might be the first to realise when he is gone? Maybe if your friend contacts social services to say that the relative is very isolated and vulnerable, then when things go pear shaped with his bills then at least someone will know who to get in touch with.

tbh, I think this is not such an uncommon thing as people who are old and very vulnerable/ill can be very hard to get close to even if you are trying to help.

I think a lot of people may be in this situation. I'm sure social services will know what to do.

Agree and her dad is not legally next of kin. It's not a legal thing. He could have been nominated by the relative, but if they've fallen out then I wouldn't assume that he still is.

In some cases, I'm afraid that it's based on bitter experience.

This one's even quoted a thread WAY after OP had clarified that she is talking about her friend and STILL doesn't get it 😂

Hold my hands up. No I didn’t ☺️ But tbh, it was a bit of a drip feed there, and I still feel that if it was someone I barely saw or bothered with that, it wouldn’t cross my mind to be thinking about what happens to his money and property when he dies. Especially when there appears to closer family on the radar.