To think that white British/ American etcmen are just as much a threat to women as migrants?

[malificent7]

I am not excusing grooming, paedophile sex rings and unmonitored immigration at all but I hate all these protests.
I know that my white male ex teacher is a sex offender. Not to mention the Epstein scandal.
Aibu to think that ALL men are a danger to women...not just men of different ethnicities/ religions etc?

That's not what I understand the thread to be about but there's no evidence asylum seekers or refugees are more of a risk than white British or American men. In fact a woman is assaulted every 9 seconds in the US.

If we can move away from asylum seekers for a moment and talk about VAWAG, we have one of the lowest levels of rape convictions in Europe. Our judicial system is broken and survivors are dropping out because of how long it takes to go to court amongst other concerns.

Therefore many rapists in the UK don't have convictions and rape has in effect become legal. It would be prudent therefore for other countries to deny British men entry lest they're an unconvicted rapist.

Losing refugee status means they can be deported as they have no right to be in the country.

I also don’t get why anyone wants a system with no checks. It’s invariably women and girls who are the victims.

I live in an ethnically diverse place so often walk past mosques and Wetherspoons or similar
Guess which one is more intimidating and guess which one had a crowd outside that shouted at my 13 year old DD to show them her tits?
It was the same one by the way.
I am not so naive to think that there is not a problem in some communities with their attitudes to women and girls but as someone who grew up in an area with such communities and living in one now I (and DD) have been jeered at and harrassed by white working class men more than any other group.

We shouldn’t let more men in.

It’s literally the thread title.

Being able to deport/revoke asylum status does nothing to lessen the risks in the first place.

Theres no way to ascertain that white British or American men are more of a threat. That’s the point.

There are no statistics held on these men.

Also to add, I very much agree with your other points, re pathetic sentences/conviction rates

Agreed. And deporting them is expensive, time consuming and often fails on ‘human rights’ grounds.

I don't assume a thread is rigidly focused on the title. I understand the thread to be about VAWAG, the current hotel protests and asylum seekers.

We can ascertain whether or not white British or American men are a threat to women because we have statistics on crime and domestic abuse. For example, two women on average are murdered a week by a partner or former partner. There's no evidence that women are being murdered by asylum seekers weekly.

Revoking someone's refugee status acts as a deterrent and means that those who are a danger to women are removed from the country.

Therefore many rapists in the UK don't have convictions and rape has in effect become legal. It would be prudent therefore for other countries to deny British men entry lest they're an unconvicted rapist.

So you agree? Countries should deny entry based on risk of offending?

There’s no ‘evidence’ of anything, that’s the point!

You seem to be satisfied with the fact that these unvetted men are arriving in droves, and are happy that the risk of failed asylum and deportation is a robust enough deterrent. The rapes that have happened don’t particularly concern you, because white men rape too. And we can deport them after the fact.

That’s your prerogative, but to not understand that not everyone agrees (and why) is just dense or dishonest

No I don't, I think it's a ridiculous idea that isn't remotely feasible.

What you’ve quoted is no where near an argument in any case. You’d think some prefer Afghanistan to UK for women and girls.

There’s no ‘evidence’ of anything, that’s the point!

It seems we agree.

The men arrested for rape haven't been prosecuted. I believe in innocent until proven guilty which applies to everyone, irrespective of ethnicity or religion.

Where we fundamentally disagree is on VAWAG. I'm not blaming asylum seekers for the current VAWAG crisis we have in the UK and scapegoating them. I detest the weaponisation of VAWAG by the far right, many of who are abusers themselves. There's no evidence that asylum seekers are more of a danger to women than British men, quite the opposite given how women are more likely to be abused by someone they know.

A system which checks would benefit women and girls, since they are usually the victims.

I’m not sure why people would be against it.

A hotel in a town near me housed women and children for several years. They were settled and integrated into to the local community until some bright spark had the idea to start housing single male asylum seekers in the same hotel. Women and girls were assaulted by these men so what has happened? The women and girls have been moved out and it will be used for single males. The residents are understandably furious and are protesting but I doubt the government will care.

‘There's no evidence that asylum seekers are more of a danger to women than British men, quite the opposite given how women are more likely to be abused by someone they know’

This is where we differ.

You believe that there being no evidence is proof enough.

I think research needs to be done, and then once we have statistics we can go from there, then there can be no doubt.

I really don’t understand why my view is controversial.

I’m reminded very much for the protection of women and girls.

In order to protect them, we need to understand the different demographics of which they are under threat by, and how to tackle them accordingly.

As an example, It’s like the abuse taking place in the Catholic Church.

Unless you specifically look into it, and record that abuse is occurring, someone could very easily dismiss it and say ‘there’s no evidence that abuse is occurring in the church at all higher rate than anywhere else, so no need investigate further’

We already have statistics on violence against women. Half of sexual assaults are carried out by a partner or ex partner and 6 in 7 rapes are carried out by someone the survivor knows. Therefore women and girls are in danger from people they know rather than complete strangers. Stranger assault is rare.

You've now moved on to institutional abuse which has nothing to do with the thread.

Could you clarify what statistics on ethnicity would do? For example, should all Afghan men be tagged if they're found to commit assaults? Does this apply to all demographics found culpable of sexual assault or just foreigners?

‘If we can move away from asylum seekers for a moment and talk about VAWAG, we have one of the lowest levels of rape convictions in Europe. Our judicial system is broken and survivors are dropping out because of how long it takes to go to court amongst other concerns.
Therefore many rapists in the UK don't have convictions and rape has in effect become legal.’

‘The men arrested for rape haven't been prosecuted. I believe in innocent until proven guilty which applies to everyone, irrespective of ethnicity or religion.’

I can’t take you in good faith when you understand the issue so well in point 1, but have forgotten it by point 2

You wouldn’t be able to make the points you were if we didn’t have the stats.

I’m not talking specifically about institutional abuse, I’m using it as as example against your logic.

If you could quote me or @ me when you're responding to me, that would be appreciated.

Again I don't really understand what you mean. Are you saying that we should presume guilt when people are arrested?

Like I said, we already have statistics on sexual assault. You were saying that we need more research, specifically data on ethnicity. I'm asking you for the purpose of the research.

Look at my info about the Danish statistics.
quickly though, before this thread is deleted 🙄

So to be clear, you don’t think we need accurate statistics?
In general, or just for ethnicity of perpetrators?

We already have statistics on sexual assault and the perpetrators of sexual assault. Half of sexual assaults are carried out by a partner or ex partner and 6 in 7 rapes are carried out by someone the survivor knows. Therefore women and girls are in danger from people they know rather than complete strangers.

Can you explain how ethnicity of the perpetrator is important additional information please?

Remember the mass sexual assault in Germany on nye?