Family wedding with obligatory religion. What's an atheist to do?

[Tootoomooch]

A close family member is getting married this year. He is a devout christian. Both I and my partner are atheists (me, stridently; him, more quietly. Both committedly).

The family member has made a point of asking everyone to participate in various religious aspects of the wedding. It appears to be a more involved affair than the standard C of E wedding service. We've been asked - but it feels more like an instruction - to join the singing and to offer individual prayers for the couple (out loud, in front of the assembled masses).

I feel very uncomfortable about this but can't put my finger on exactly why. Logically, given that I don't believe, what is the harm in just playing along? But, conversely, if he knows we don't believe and are doing it to keep the peace, what value can he possibly place on our "prayers"? Also - and maybe this is flouncy - but why is my atheism any less valid than his theism? I wouldn't dream of asking him to not pray, or otherwise minimising his beliefs (at least out loud).

There is no way I will allow the children to participate, and I also feel uncomfortable with them watching us participate in a religious ceremony that they know we don't believe in.

My natural tendency is to both obduracy and confrontation (🤣) so my first instinct is to ignore the request and, if pushed, to say that I don't feel comfortable. This is me moderating my first, instinctive response to tell him to f-off.

However, I wonder if IABU. It's a wedding, his special day etc etc (blah) and I should just suck it up?

So -

AIBU - being a militant atheist can wait for a day. Keep the peace and make up a prayer.

or

AINBU - obliging disbelievers to participate is unreasonable and I can just keep quiet (to the fullest extent possible)

Fuck that, I'd decline the invite

Dont go to the wedding.

It's not your wedding. You are spoiling for a fight and it is obvious you are looking forward to challenging anyone who asks you to participate.

Just stay away and stop making it about your self and for fuck sake dont make a scene at the wedding if you must go.

It's a sad state of affairs that you want to make someone's wedding about your hatred of religion. Id rather you didn't come at all.

Devout Christian here. It is unreasonable to expect you to participate in singing and praying to a God you don't believe in. Christians are required to "tell the good news" not force the participation of non-believers.

Go, be polite, but don't participate if your conscience doesn't allow. If your family member can't accept that, then he/she is not following the tenets of Christian faith and is only going through the motions.

It’s his day. Do him a favour and don’t go.

Reminds me of my DS who was going through an atheist phase when he was enrolling as a Scout in Ye Olden Days when God was a requirement. He thought about it for a while and in the end said “I will do my duty to God” and whispered Darwin under his breath before going on. Worked for him.

I think this is a real issue for you and I do get it. My Dsis refused to be a god mother to my DD1 because she couldn’t agree to what she was going to be asked to do. No one else took it that literally. However DDs had the choice regarding taking their church introduction further or not. They chose not.

Therefore you have various options. Make them happy by joining in. Make yourselves happy by walking out at the prayer point or not attending. You presumably know these relatives and of course they want what suits them. Most couples do at their wedding.

My concern is - is there an evangelical zeal about this? Sometimes the very keen Christian attending this type of church does not really respect other religious or non religious positions. So either negotiate or don’t go to the service. If you and they cannot compromise, I think you stay away but you would have to recognise your views and non attendance are all about keeping you happy.

Projecting a little bit there @UninterestedBeing12 maybe? Nowhere in the OP did anyone mentioned hatred of religion, just being uncomfortable around it.

Because of the culture DH grew up in I've had to go to hundreds of things like this. I'm pretty staunchly atheist (I don't hate religion nor do I want to fight anyone who does, please note), and I now just smile and nod and pass the piece of paper they want me to read from to the next person, but I am hugely uncomfortable.

If you don't go will it taint your relationship with him going forward?

I am religious so may wish to disregard my opinion.

Personally, I think it would depend on the nature of the individual prayers. If it involves lots of invoking the power of the Lord and was very religious, I'd very much understand you not taking part. That would seem like a wedding limited to their own church friends. I'd probably not attend if I was you.

If it's just something non-committal like 'I hope that you have a very long and happy marriage, and lots of good times together' , I don't see it as that different to the forced pieces to camera I've had to deliver at some wedding receptions- it's just a bland message of support to the couple.

Also, if you're stridently atheist, I don't think that your children will suddenly become anchorites because they once saw you wish someone well at a wedding.

What kind of church and community is this? I grew up Catholic going to church in England with my mum but my dad’s family is part of a church (not even sure what) that is just so very different. No familiar hymns etc, services at a wedding could take hours. When at family gatherings everyone would launch into prayers.

i agree with previous posters to simply give your personal best wishes to the couple if you can. Will all attendees have to do this?!

Just tell him that you think St Paul got it right when he said that women should be silent in church so you will be following that rule. Hard for him to argue with the scriptures....

Sorry if I made an incorrect assumption!

Just to be clear, my initial plan was to do as I have done and will continue to do at all other religious weddings: sit quietly during the service and hymns. I was raised an atheist, so I don’t actually know any even if I did want to sing along. This approach has served me well over the years.

This person is a close family member and the relationship is important to me. There is no chance I will not attend.

That is why I set the voting options above as either to keep my head down and try to avoid, or to play along, grit my teeth and repeat the script.

I have no intention of actively raising it with the happy couple or refusing to go. Sorry for those spoiling for a fight!

That said, I retain my right to my private thoughts, which are that this is unreasonably intrusive. We must not force windows into (wo)men’s souls…

The sentiment of the individual prayers is just well wishes from you to the couple, which isn't IMO religion specific, I don't see why an atheist couldn't participate it's not a declaration of any sort of allegence to any church or belief. I would just wish them some kind of good fortune, what's un atheist about that?

My natural tendency is to both obduracy and confrontation (🤣) so my first instinct is to ignore the request and, if pushed, to say that I don't feel comfortable. This is me moderating my first, instinctive response to tell him to f-off.

From the OP. Im not projecting. That is hateful to want to behave like that over a wedding rather than just decline to attend.

I hope she does tell him to fuck off and is uninvited.

As a real atheist, I struggle to understand how some people who claim to be atheists have such a reaction to things religious.

If you follow the implications of your claim ("The is no God") then poncing around in a draughty building screeching along to vague platitudes intended for an omniscient omnipresent omnipotent and non existent being is only a wasted afternoon.

I mean it's not like you can catch God.

(Obviously it's different for agnostics ..😀.)

What is he actually asking you to do?

Sit/stand as per everyone else? Surely you can do that?

Read aloud along with everyone else? Would it be noticeable if you stayed silent at this point?

Unless he's asking you to stand individually and 'pray' I don't see what the fuss is in attending and observing?

I'm not religious but have no problem following along. I don't go to the altar for communion or a blessing but will stand and sit with everyone else.

Sit at the back and smile and nod. If they really want you to participate can you do a secular reading? Light a candle? There must be something non- religious to do.

I feel that you are making this way too much about you. The couple's wedding is within their religion because it is meaningful to them not because they are trying to force anything on you. If wishing them well offends your beliefs then just don't step up to participate when the ceremony calls for this (surely not everyone in church will anyway) but all this wanting to tell them to fuck off is just quite unpleasant.

I attend and sing at weddings but I never take part in the prayers. I don’t think anyone notices. I’ve never been asked to read outloud but would refuse whether religious or not due to nerves.

If the ceremony is structured so that you will have an unavoidable "turn to speak" could you manage to say something like "if there is any kind of benevolent spiritual being who can affect our lives and hear our words, then I thoroughly commend (harry & sally) to that being's love and care, but if there isn't then more immediately evident is the love and respect in which we all here present hold (harry & sally) in our hearts, and I and I am sure everyone here wish them all the very best of health, good fortune and happiness on whatever the road of live brings them in the years ahead."

Read a poem if pressed to do something. Surely not the entire congregation is going to do a personal prayer, though? Will take forever!

Did you read the OP. She is being asked to stand individually and pray. That's the whole point.

She says:

We've been asked - but it feels more like an instruction - to join the singing and to offer individual prayers for the couple (out loud, in front of the assembled masses).

This. Frankly I'd feel I was utterly disrespectful of someone else's faith if I was pretending.

In a pinch you could compromise with this? But I'd be sitting at the back and thinking about my shopping list mostly.

Corinthians 13:4-7 - Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

I would reply with ‘As you know we aren’t religious so won’t be saying a prayer but absolutely happy to voice our well wishes for you both during the ceremony.’

Why bother inviting atheists to a wedding if you want everyone offering individual prayers? Just ask the religious ones. Personally I would not go, especially if DC are involved, what sort of hypocrisy makes a parent pretend to say a religious prayer in front of DC who presumably know they are non-believers.

Thanks everyone. Lots of food for thought. If it comes up again I shall decline the pre-scripted prayer I have been asked to read and offer to do a non-religious blessing. Let’s hope it’s accepted. If not I’ll have to think some more.

You've all helped me realise that, as illogical as it is - and the poster who made the point about “catching god” isn’t wrong! - I do feel uncomfortable and and a bit annoyed having my views so obviously disregarded.

Thank you all!