To cut holiday short

[ToddlerSleep]

I’m on a very child friendly fully catered 4-night UK break with DS 6 (nearly 7) and DS just turned 4, and I’m not coping with their behaviour. DH is a great and involved dad and couldn’t come due to work. We knew this would be the case and therefore chose this particular place as there’s so much for children to do and should in theory have worked. We are due to go home on Friday, but WIBU to go home tomorrow? Below is a snapshot of 6 hours of my day and it’s been like this from morning til night since Monday. Have I brought them up badly? Or is this just normal behaviour from them and I am being a useless parent? Please be gentle with me. It’s day 3 and I’m now in tears.

I had two more 1-night trips planned with them in the summer holidays and I have told them we are no longer doing them due to their behaviour. I am regretting doing this holiday and had I known beforehand how they would behave, there’s no way I would have done it.

It’s absolutely relentless. I put in clear boundaries and follow through with consequences eg taking away toys, time out, missing activities that we had planned, and it has no impact. They say sorry and it won’t happen again, and 5 mins later it happens again.

1. In the morning they have to be asked several times to please take their pyjamas off, please come brush your teeth, please put your socks on etc.
2. while this is taking place, DS6 won’t stop teasing DS4 despite being told several times to stop. DS4 gets upset, I have to step in.
3. DSs then refuse to put their shoes on themselves, they are too tired, it’s too hard etc. I stand my ground and in the end stand outside the flat and tell them to just get on with it.
4. We walk to breakfast (2 mins away) and DS6 is teasing DS4 again
5. We get to the dining room and there’s an argument about who will sit with whom
6. I get them their drinks and then go to get their food. When I’m back with food I find that DS4 has had an accident with his drink resulting in it spilt everywhere.
7. While eating there’s more teasing.
8. We walk back to our flat and there’s more teasing.
9. We get to our flat and there’s an argument about who will open the door.
10. We then go to an activity, more whinging about shoes, and there’s more teasing on the way. DS4 keeps running off as well to whatever takes his fancy on the way. I have to keep running after him so I don’t lose sight of him.
11. It’s now lunchtime and both say they are hungry but won’t eat the food I have for them and are whinging. It’s normally their favourite. DS4 keep running off, DS6 whinging about whatever.
12. We go to watch a show, which I know DS6 loves. DS6 constantly whinging he doesn’t want to see it and I had promised him we won’t see it (I never did), DS4 making whinging noises and I don’t know why.
13. Get to the show, whinging continues and now we also have an argument about who sits on which seat.
14. Show is over, kids had loved it, more teasing on the way back to the flat which I have to break up. DS4 keeps running off.
15. Another argument at the door about who will open it.
16. I need to repack my rucksack while DS6 keeps teasing DS4 and eventually he is lying on top of DS4 tickling him while DS4 is crying. I keep having to step in over and over again to break it up while trying to concentrate on my rucksack.
17. Off to the next activity 5 mins walk away. More whinging about them having to put on their shoes themselves. I realise when I get to the activity that I have forgotten something key to pack into my rucksack so we have to walk back.
18. DS4 was trailing behind us, then suddenly has disappeared and we can’t find him anywhere. 20 minutes of running around in tears trying to find him. Activity is now missed.
19. I want to go back to the flat, DSs just won’t listen and come with me, so it takes me 10 minutes to get them to move. DS4 again keep running off, DS6 is teasing again.
20. Once in the flat, DS4 has a 30 minute stand off to get undressed so I can shower him. DS6 also has to be asked 10 times but at least he does it.

Doesn’t sound too out of the ordinary except the bit being able to find your DS for 20 mins, you must have been frantic. I’d either drastically lower your expectations - stay in your accommodation and venture out somewhere cheap/free like the park if you feel up to it. Or, just go home

Having now read the updates I think you should stay for the looked forward to activities today, but I wouldn't blame you if you decided you couldn't face another day.

In the dark ages when I had young children, I discovered the older one bullying the younger one. I meted out exactly the same treatment to the older one. I then asked him how it felt when somebody older and bigger treated him badly and pointed out that that was exactly what he had done to his younger sibling. I never had to deal with the problem again. (No, it didn't involve biting!) They are close siblings who look out for each other in their twenties. This is probably not very woke. I can say that this has not figured in any complaints about their childhood - the elder one seems entirely focussed on a kayaking event on a school trip for which I did not consent to given there was no information about where they would be kayaking, the level of supervision involved and even whether they would be wearing a life jacket.

Just sounds mostly like normal little kids to me with a bit of extra giddy excitement. Keep the schedule relaxed, you are on holiday and don't worry if they take a while to put shoes on or just do it for them or make it a game. "I bet you can't put your shoes on before Mummy!" Praise them for sitting nicely or anything which shows more maturity and minimise the telling off, picking your battles.

Holidays are just normal parenting in an unfamiliar environment which can actually bring stress as well as interest and excitement. Don't expect too much and chill out.

I have the same age kids.

4yr old - why is he running off? I’ve had three kids (DS DS DD), youngest is 4 and none of them have run off like that at that age, I’d say that not typical. My kids always stay with me when on route somewhere. I’m not boasting, just saying that, to me, that’s not usual behaviour at that age so I’d keep my eye out on it. Lots of reminders to stay with you as it’s not safe, lots of bribes if they do “walk nicely”.

6yr old - absolutely not ok to constantly tease brother. It’s unkind and feels horrible as the younger sibling. I’d be going solo with 4yr old to next trip and letting 6yr old know why.

Id not bother doing trips now until DH is free. Personally I’d never take mine alone, a holiday is for everyone and I’d find it too hard alone. I’d rather be at home doing day trips.

YANBU it’s times like this you wonder why you ever had them. Good for you for trying but I’d just go home. Kids are hard work!

I wouldn't go home, because I dont imagine fir a minute it will improve at home .

I would tell 6 year old that if I hear them teasing 4 year old again they are going to the room to reflect on their behaviour. I would also explain it's mean. I would tell 4 year old to ignore 6 year old, as they are doing it for a reaction. Once the reaction stops, 6 year old will stop. If they do it again, send them to room and ask them to return when they have thought about behaviour, and are ready to apologise. No shouting, no drama, just consistency.

Do not engage in the drama. Tell them, its the youngest turn to use key and ope door this time. If you fuss, I will do it every time, and follow it through.

Dont want the food? Fine. You still sit at the table, engage in conversation. Food in fridge for when they are hungry. Again, no drama, just carry on. Dont give in and buy some crap for them to eat later.

Not dressed in 10 minutes? Guess what? You go out in whatever you are dressed in. In my experience, if they truly believe you would do that, they soon throw their clothes on.

You're in charge. It doesnt mean constant shouting or being annoyed. It doesnt mean always negotiating. It means firm boundaries and consistency. It means being firm, but also allowing for fun along the way.

It worked for me and I often holidayed solo with 4 kids.

It sounds really tough.

One of the things that worked for us at that age was keeping the dc busy, generally with games. They can't tease each other and wind each other up if they are engaged in an activity. I-Spy, colour spotting, memory games, even things like "everyone name their favourite toy/hobby/holiday/activity we've done" worked for my dc when walking, or when we had to wait for a show or something.

I'd definitely make a 4yo hold my hand if they'd run off and got lost for 20 mins, that must have been really scary!

I'd also pick my battles, just put their shoes on for them.

Pick your battles OP! Put their shoes on for them. One less thing to fight over. Take it in turns to open door. Give them choices… shall we do x or y. They just sound like normal high spirited kids, do you not spend much time with them at home?

This is great - I wish I'd known more about this when DD2 was little. She can actually be pretty organised and mature at 16 so I think we muddle through ok, they are not like that forever.

They’re doing too much. They’re overhyped and overtired. They may also be hungry if they’re not eating enough or regularly enough. I wouldn’t go home but I would have a mostly duvet day today. If you can, put on a movie and give them a couple of big bowls of pasta (assuming there’s a shop in striking distance buy a packet of spaghetti and a jar of pasta sauce), and just let them chill out. You can go out in the evening perhaps but just let them stop.

Just power through until Fri. You can't go home, they sound like pretty normal annoying kids. If they don't respect boundaries and instructions it's something you need to work on once home.

Going forward never ever do anything alone trip wise with a 4yr old and 6yr old. Make sure your dh books time off or arrange to go with friends or family. Other adults obviously dilute the situation.

My son can be like that but he has adhd and is only child. I wouldn't have been able to cope with 2x. You have my sympathy.

I think you need to implement consequences here-now rather than threaten with future holidays cancelled. They would be upset for a moment and then carry on.
Also, if you threaten you should really follow through. Talking from experience, as I am really bad implementing "big bad" measures.
Is there a kids club you could park them in to give you a bit of rest?

Mate, go home

I once went on a caravan holiday when mine were 4, 6 & 7. First & last time. I packed up the car 2 days early because I'd had enough & had reached the tearful exhaustion stage. Turned the key in the ignition & absolutely nothing. Four hours I waited for the AA. I think it was longest 4 hours of their lives because I wouldn't let them out of their car seats. I used the time to organise a full day with the childminder the day after.

So no, I don't think you're being unreasonable for going home. Don't let it put you off though. When mine were a few years older we started camping. It was great, they just joined the gang of kids on site & went feral for a week. I dutifully took my turns at supervising, cleaning grazes, feeding snacks etc etc & had lots of nice time alone or with the other parents in between. It takes a campsite of like minded parents, or a hotel with a great kids club to make a good family holiday, & no one will ever convince me otherwise.

Seeing some of the slightly contradictory advice has made me feel a little better as I feel it shows there’s no easy answer, eg they are bored vs there’s too much going on.

I am very lucky that nothing is more than a 5 minute walk away so we don’t need to get into the car to go to any places. We have been on site since Monday. I also haven’t booked or paid for any formal activities so there’s no pressure for us to be somewhere if we don’t feel like it. It’s mainly been playgrounds and soft play and a puppet show.

DS4 is really trying his best with getting dressed but does need help and I give it to him, and he gets praise when he does something himself. DS6 also gets some help but I draw the line at being expected to do his Velcro straps up on his shoes. We had a lot of moaning about it the first 2 days and we had a few occasions where I stood outside the flat door waiting for him to do it himself. I think yesterday was the first day he did it without complaining.

we do the “you go out in whatever you are in” both at home and on holiday too. There have been a few occasions where DS6 has stood before the door half dressed because despite multiple reminders and help he won’t do anything at all sometimes. We turn things into a game too and that doesn’t always work, eg after losing he will say “oh I changed the rules to be whoever is last wins so I have won”

The children have been up for 30 minutes now and are subdued, no teasing. DS4 told me he doesn’t want to go home and he wants to go to a particular playground, which has been one of their favourite activities. I’ll see how things go. It’s a 5 hour drive including breaks so need to leave here at a reasonable time to go home.

I am part of the problem because I don’t 100% follow through on consequences when it’s something that means it’s lost forever. So at home, if the consequence is no TV or no sweets etc, I easily follow through because he can have TV on another day. Yesterday we walked past the swimming pool and didn’t go in because that was the consequence for misbehaving. But then when they misbehaved again at the playground instead of going home with them straight away I gave them 5 minutes extra.

I have written a timetable together with DS6 which we look at together so he knows what we can do when. Which also means he knows what he has missed out on as a result of behaviour eg not going to a playground we had planned to go to yesterday.

I work part time and am the main parent at home. I have done this trip with just DS6 before, when he was 4 and 5, and it was great. I have also done many day trips with both of them and it went fine. It’s the first time I have tried an overnight trip with them both and it’s been so hard. I didn’t expect it as it’s not been like this previously and perhaps part of the problem is that I have built it up in my head to be as good as what we have previously done.

You have all given me a lot to think about for how we do things at home and in future holidays.

Now off to get ready for breakfast. It’s a 2 minute walk to the dining hall and less hassle than getting into the car with both to find croissants and berries!

Whiy could your dh not come due to work, doesn't he get annual leave? Do you think he had an idea of how things would be?

For your own sanity stick to boundaries. Also a 5hr drive sounds miserable too, maybe next time somewhere closer there are holiday parks everywhere.

It's difficult to say, OP.

Apart from the running off and getting lost for 20 minutes, which would have made me do my nut, none of this sounds particularly outside the range of normal behaviour for little kids. There was nothing else that jumped out at me and made me think, "Mine would never!"

I have to say, however, that mine are only 4 and 2. Perhaps in two years' time I would no longer consider this sort of thing normal behaviour, I don't know yet.

Solo parenting with two little kids is a lot. I know single parents do it all the time but they have developed their coping mechanisms. You normally have your husband around and have not.

You don't have to stick it out to the bitter end if you're really not enjoying it, but maybe see how today goes first.

In your shoes at the moment with a 6YO. Lots of instances of bad behaviour and I found I was being very grumpy with them and I think it became a bit of a knock on effect. I have made a concerted effort to be more positive and things have improved a little. There is still quite a bit of bad behaviour but I'm hoping that will fade and things will go back to normal when we go home.

I think my irritation was worsening things.

So you recognise that the basic, long term problem is your parenting skills.

123 Magic has a huge following. It’s not difficult. I recommend you look into it with your dh. It will bring a common structure to you both and strengthen your own backbone in those struggles we all suffer.

And, of course, tomorrow is always a new day.

I bet the dad's been sat at home all week, feet up telly on.

Me too, quite good even 😂

Apart from the getting lost! That sounds very worrying.

They sound tired. I think a self catering holiday might have been better as it seems they want to lounge around not be on a strict timetable on their holiday.
Can you write down all the positives of the holiday now ,ones that you are grateful for ? If there are any. This is what I try to do in my life when things don’t seem to be going well. It can pull you out of a certain way of thinking.

It all sounds fairly run of the mill behaviour whilst challenging and no fun - not that you shouldn’t be dealing with it with consequences. I think it would be absolutely fine to come home.

I think a solo adult holiday with those ages is just really tough.

The one thing that jumped out at me is the amount of teasing because that’s really not on. Any kind of unkindness to siblings is the thing I take more seriously, and would be very firm about.

Edit - I do think a pp is right that they sound tired. The whinging is usually a sign of tiredness. Strangely I think having at least partial SC can be better for small kids as it gives them the chance for a bit of down time where they’re not being observed or “on”.

I feel your pain!!! And I think it is fairly normal and please don’t punish yourself. It’s a mixture of being out of usual routines/diff environment and over excitement. Do they have downtime apart? Can you pop them in different rooms with a game/colouring/tv etc so they have time apart?

id say also pick your battles. I don’t know one partner that follows through on all consequences (I’m sure someone will come along and at how perfect they are!!). It’s your break too so put their shoes on for them? Instead of telling off the teasing, ignore it and focus on the other one and find something to praise/give attention to. This may help your sanity a bit.

buy honestly - holidays with kids can be brutal and tiring. But like you say, they’ve still enjoyed some stuff!

for families with two adults it’s helpful to to split up some of the time so kids get time apart and some 1:1. But obviously you can’t do that.

do what you need to do to stay sane! Stay strong mama!!