To not want to move after saying I would??

[Tryingtobepatient001]

Morning Mumsnet community,

Would love a bit of advice or perspective here.
My husband and I have been together for 8 years and in that time he's nearly always wanted to move to the US for work - his company's head office is there and for his career he is best to get promoted if he's there. They tried to move him in 2019 but the visa was rejected.

Fast forward 6 years and we're now married, have built a really nice life for ourselves and recently had a little boy. I've found it tougher than I thought I would and my friends and family have been massive support since husband has gone back to work.

Last week husband had his appraisal and was told they wanted to promote him and they could start the visa procedure. He told me this after his call and although they said he could take time to think about it, I'm pretty certain that he said yes we would be up for it. As soon as he told me I burst into tears as I realised I just don't want to move.

Here we have friends and my family, a gorgeous house and very comfortable lifestyle. If we move he will get a good payrise but I'm unsure if I'll work (can't for the first 6 months) - if I do it'll mean I'll have to put my LO into childcare and miss out on a lot due to long US work hours, but if I don't my life will be me and a one year old every day.

Husband doesn't seem to be able to see my perspective and said we've always said we would do this so I'm back tracking now. He also insinuated that if he knew I wouldn't go he wouldn't have married me/had a child. His career has always been really important to him and it's clear it's priority over what I want.

I don't know what to do. Husband is being pretty adamant that this is happening. So I either don't go and risk splitting up our family, or go and risk being really unhappy and lonely.

AiBU to change my mind on something now it's happening??

Very wise stick to the path. And next time you meet any creative professional be sure to compliment them on their luck and marketing skills.

Very good financial advice here. Although it doesn’t cover you for if you ever want to move back to the UK with your son, or if he has an affair in the US and you split up.

Agree - I just wanted to give an impartial benchmark that the OP could use when looking at the package on offer. IME (have done a lot of expat advice myself) the packages rarely put people in the same financial position that they are in at home when you consider the loss of spouse earnings and the additional living costs. There is no earthly reason why an employee should be prepared to take on more work and uproot their family to be worse off. Funny how few employers get that point.

Moving is hard mentally before you go but the reality is usually not half as bad. We moved to a new country soon after our wedding. I was nervous and anxious but 23 years later could not be happier. I have made friends and gave a lovely community. Give it a try before you make up your mind.

The fact he discussed this as a non negotiable before you married and had a child means you are being unreasonable. You should at least try! I think it’s pretty selfish tbh.

The US isn't a safe place to be as someone who can get pregnant. Hospital staff are fearing accusations of illegal abortions and refusing / delaying care for eg. incomplete miscarriages. That won't be all staff everywhere but it's a risk and as an outsider you won't have enough knowledge to pick the safer hospitals. Contraception can be tricky - pharmacists can decline to supply on moral / religious grounds. Abortion is tricky - and remember the potential for foetuses with conditions incompatible with life, even if you don't expect to need one.

The political situation as a whole is a mess in a way it wasn't in 2019.

Also the anti-vaccine stuff and measles outbreaks make bits of the US risky for babies too little for an MMR.

If your husband wants to work there can he negotiate working in the UK for a couple of fortnights each year (jet lag is terrible on the way back - make his trips home long enough to be enjoyable)? Can he keep a UK style annual leave allowance?

There is a lot to unpack here.

So no you almost certainly won’t get a work visa so rule that out now. They are long and complicated especially since you don’t have a job to go to and unless it’s specialist then it won’t happen.

You committed to moving and supporting your husband and now aren’t doing these things. You didn’t communicate this to him but let him go through his appraisal knowing you felt this way. Honestly he has very right to feel let down and betrayed by this especially since you have said how important his career is to him.

You are both being equally selfish and only thinking about your own position and not thr right thing collectively EXCEPT you did agree to go so you don’t have any right to feel upset that he started the process as you had previously been supportive.

I’ve done expats and the absolute best time is when kids are young. This is the right time to go and it doesn’t have to be forever.

You have highlighted all the negatives and none of the positives - new adventure, travel opportunities etc

I probably think his attitude is based on his feelings of betrayal, selfishness and negativity. Until you are in a different headspace you can’t have a reasonable conversation.

I think the ‘try it out for a year’ while sounds practical, in reality is quite different. I did that and was an awful idea as from day one I was one foot in one foot out. Knowing that the possibility to go back is on the table didn’t allow me to give the place a real chance and I found a fault in most things.
settling in a new country and having the feeling of ‘belonging’ takes way more than a year.

So I can give you a perspective from someone whose family have moved around abroad a lot. My Mum first upped sticks and followed my Dad to Norway with a toddler and newborn.

It is scary, but depending on where you are going it is a huge opportunity. It may not be forever, or you might love it. My friend moved to Texas with three kids, she was dreading it, but now she loves life, huge house and pool, all the girls are thriving, she has a part time job that suits her.

Once kids get to high school age this type of move gets really hard, now is the time to try it out. Whatever happens you can’t work for 6 months, so play it by ear.

you are going to an English speaking country so it is easier to settle, if it is a global company you will also find a group of ex pats who can help settle you in.

So I totally get the panic, but honestly, maybe it is a great opportunity and great timing..

So much of this post is assumption and isn’t accurate.

The US is a lot cheaper and standard of living is higher (in thr right areas). Your money will go further except on a few things. Cars cheap: Houses are a lot bigger. Gas cheap. Electricity cheap. Taxes in a lot of places cheaper. Car insurance and mobile phones are expensive. For example…

You almost certainly won’t be able to work.

You can leave at any time you aren’t trapped there.

Your son is British, you are on an expat contract and he can’t prevent you from leaving if you have permission or a court order - get this before you go.

You don’t need all this support from family and friends. It’s nice and welcome but you can do it without them and won’t be trapped in a house on your own. Americans are very friendly.

Flight times are about 6.5 hours it isn’t exactly the other side of the world and flights aren’t crazy expensive.

Healthcare in the US is world leading and much better than the NHS but you have to pay for it - but most companies offer health insurance so make sure they do and it will be covered.

Check his package and what it is offering. They may pay for rent for a while too which will ultimately save you money.

My suggestion is that you join expat groups in the US and ask questions from people who have made thr move rather than from people guessing here.

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I would say to him that your agreement to move years ago was based on your life back then. Now that you have your home and a child, things have changed. I would not be moving to isolate myself in America. I would say if he wants to move then he can, but you don’t.

Bit of scare mongering here, I doubt she is heading to Alabama! The US is fine, especially on an ex pat contract with health insurance. The abortion things is only an issue in a few states, and most are sensible. There is nothing to stop you vaccinating, over 90% of people do, more in big cities.

It sounds like you effectively feel blackmailed into going. Just because you felt one way six years ago, doesn’t mean you always have to feel that way! Can’t you change your mind?! Your DH is deluded if he’s holding this against you. Moving as two people sans children is very different from moving as a parent. It could be great. It might not be. But you are as equally entitled to say no to going as he is to say yes. And if there’s a power imbalance right now, there will be a much bigger one there when he’s working and you can’t.

I’m on side on your husband with this one. You were up for it before and now you’re pulling out. You’re effectively destroying his career. You can have a beautiful house and friends in the US. you’ve gotten comfortable here and he’s still focused on moving life forward.

I think you need to go off Mumsnet and try and work things out with your husband so you don’t lose your marriage.

Yeh! Totally! Who gives a shit about the op or her baby as long as diddums is happy.

A lot of careers depend on doing some time overseas - I know several people in huge firms who only got to where they did because they were willing to do this. If I had stayed in that type of work, I would have too. If he was clear about this, and you agreed, its pretty rough on him that you have now changed your mind. I understand where you are coming from but better to do it when children are young and it is not so disruptive to them.

This is the right time to go and it doesn’t have to be forever.

But once she's there she'll have no control over how little or how much time it will be before they can come back unless she's prepared to come back with out her DC

I think it's unfair and disingenuous of your DH to hold you to something that you agreed to in principle 6 years ago, especially as that was before you became parents. Your priorities at that time would have been completely different.

It's really telling that your DH's priorities don't seem to have changed a bit.

It's also really telling that instead of asking you whether you would still be willing to move, he has simply told you what's happening.

I don't buy for one second that he's genuinely shocked you don't want to go anymore. He would have to be pretty dense to be surprised that a woman might change her mind about moving half the world away from her entire support network having recently had a baby. I think he knows full well that this is a huge ask, that this arrangement would be entirely for his benefit and to your detriment, but he's trying to set it up as though you're the one who's being selfish.

Destroying his career? He's got a pretty good well paid job now hasn't he? He could if he wanted to prioritise his family and look for career enhancing jobs in the UK, there must be some.

People who are saying go, try it, you can always move back aren't paying attention to (or not aware of) the Hague Convention, which both US and UK enforce strictly.

Once OP moves to the US her child will be considered habituated there. It doesn't matter that he's got a UK passport, courts look at residence. If she brings their son back to the UK without the dad's consent then he could be removed and returned to the US under a judge's order. It's serious stuff. And no, no written agreement between the parents would supercede the Hague Convention if things got to that point.

Be careful OP.

This - no way would I move with a guy as selfish as yours

It sounds like he has a vision but doesn't really have a plan, he didn't think about what it would really mean and how it would really work.

Agreeing to potential moving in principle doesn't mean agreeing to automatically do it at any specific moment.

He doesn't have your and your child's best interests in mind, he can't really offer being there with you and for you if you'd move with him.

If you can't discuss it together, you can't go together.

Jeez, he isn't really selling it is he? You may not be able to work, he will be at work all the time, he wouldn't have married you if he had known you would say no? He sounds like a completely selfish twat. I wouldn't go to the bus stop with him never mind the states.

I wouldn't panic, if his visa was refused several years ago it's very unlikely to be accepted now- the US have always been prickly about working visas, but are even more so now.
It seems he's adamant he wants to do it, so you have to tell him his company will need to stump up for an international school for your LO once he is five- or he/she will return very behind school wise, the American education system is very different and does not have a good reputation.
Also I hate to break it to you, but it's very unlikely you will ever be able to work in the US- my father and step mother lived there, Dad worked for American Express on full ex pat with an international school for my brother- but my step mother was never allowed to work, I very much doubt the rules have slackened.
On the up side Americans are very friendly and my step mother had no trouble finding a circle of friends and filling her days.

Obviously he does care about them - he’s trying to be successful in his career and provide for them. I guess that’s slipped your mind and hers.