Friend shouted at my 2 year old

[hmm01]

So I popped in to see my friend of 15 years today (we’re 30s now) with my 2 year old.

We were chatting and my 2yo was throwing a ball for her dog, then came to sit on my lap and was laughing and over excited about the dog and pulled my hair. This happens very rarely, slapping, biting or pulling hair when over excited and silly.

Before I had a chance to deal with it, my friend shouted so loud that it made me jump and my child burst into tears. She shouted “DO NOT TOUCH YOUR MUM LIKE THAT” she then went on a rant about how I need to do it back or they’ll keep doing it. We are not a shouty house, we don’t scream and shout at our child ever. We have a calm house so said child isn’t used to this. We explain why they are not to do it, show them how to touch gently and then we say “what do you say” and then we get a sorry and a cuddle and then move on from it. I think I was in shock that she shouted so loud at my child.

She has 3 older kids in their teens and to put it as bluntly but nicely as I can, they’ve all suffered as a result of her verbal abuse and I’ve seen her smack them (not hard but I had no children and I didn’t realise the impact in my early 20s) when they were younger and now she doesn’t have a nice relationship with any of them. They spend all their time in their bedrooms and she recently told me she booked a holiday with them and none of them want to go, they want to go and see their Dad for a couple of weeks instead while she goes alone.

I spent a lot of years helping her with them when their Dad left, I was there every morning to help get them ready for school, breakfast etc I did pick ups when I could, had them stay at mine for weeks during holidays so she could get a break and now I feel really angry that she spoke to my child like that. She isn’t their parent. I said “I’m going to shoot” straight after that and left and now I wish I’d of laid into her a little bit and told her to keep her nose out, it’s my child and I’ll speak to them how I see fit and I’m certainly not pulling their hair, biting or smacking them EVER.

How do I navigate this? I am also heavily pregnant and willing to be told that I’m upset over nothing here, my emotions are all over the place recently!

You may be being just a tad "precious" with this. (We've all been there, myself included ) It's also very easy to judge others parenting and be the "perfect" parent whilst your fresh into it with an adorable cuddly little child.

However, your friends parenting style doesn't sound ideal and other the other extreme.

She shouldn't have shouted at your child (if she she did shout ?) she was probably aghast at your values and parenting being so very different to hers.

And I think herein lies the problem: you've gone for one style of parenting, she lies at the other end. Your parenting styles are not compatible and won't gel.

If I'm honest, you do sound very judgemental and as though you don't even like her.

Has this friendship perhaps run it's course ? It sounds like now you're a mum yourself you're seeing you're very different. Will this realistically work going forwards?

You're pregnant and have a little child, it can make you feel very protective and "mumma bear" (believe me I've been there too and that feeling is very visceral ) but the example you gave didn't really need the backstory of the massive summary of all her parenting ills.

She alarmed your child by "telling him off" for pulling your hair. It wasn't her place. But it's too late to say anything now. These things are better dealt with at the time really. You've lost your moment.

Cool off the friendship as you do sound incompatible and it'll breed resentment.

I can see why it was a shock and why your DC got upset if it was a loud shout. It’s not nice. My dad is a shouter and it shocks my DD. I don’t think it’s a particularly big deal though in the grand scheme of things. I’d just send your friend a message to say that you appreciate she was looking out for you, but it upset your DC and that isn’t really how you do things. You obviously have a close relationship with your friend and she needs to know that she overstepped, and it isn’t required again.

Your friend was probably a bit shocked herself to see your DC pull your hair. I don’t really buy into all that ‘gentle hands’ stuff but if it generally works for you and your kids then that’s your prerogative.

You seem quite judgmental of the way your friend chose to parent. It sounds like she had a tough time and probably felt that she was doing her best.

'we are not a shouty house'

you sound precious

You are not being unreasonable at all- she sounds awful!
I strongly think you need to discontinue this friendship and tell her why you are by calling her out on her behaviour as it's totally unacceptable to shout at someone else's two year old, and her attitude in general doesn't sound good either.Sounds like she has used you and abused her kids.
I can be quite shouty at times but wouldn't have shouted at even my own child at that age and certainly not anyone else's.
Don't accept these behaviours and stand your ground....your daughter will need to see you advocating for her with people like this as she grows up.
Get some better friends and don't waste time people like this.

To be honest, both styles of parenting are crap.

Gentle parenting by you is awful and the child is not being set any boundaries and her style is aggressive and the children have become resentful.

You're just as judgemental as each other really.

She shouldn't have shouted at your child, even if it is painful to watch a parent go through the 'kind and gentle hands' sermon, while the toddler is idly wondering if penguins brush their teeth or similar.

It’s probably quite hard to gauge this for those of us who weren’t there.
Sometimes kids do need firmer discipline than ‘kind hands’. But it sounds like your friend went over the top.
I have a friend from another culture and she tells my kids off and other peoples and is happy if hers are told too, she also offers lots of guidance, plays with the kids and helps them. She’s got more of a ‘it takes a village to raise a child’ mindset. Whereas we are quite used to being the only ones to discipline/ help our kids. Maybe it was a shock for you.

I’m precious because I don’t think that shouting resolves anything?

I grew up in a very volatile home, shouting and swearing and beating the shit out of each other when they were drunk was the norm for my parents.

I don’t need to shout.

Perhaps this has made you swing the pendulum too far in the other direction?

There's a huge difference between shouting and violence though. With your background it's probably hard to see that though. From the other point of view, your friend saw your child hurting you without consequences. Although you say it happens rarely, she's two and shouldn’t be slapping or biting you . Describing it as 'being silly' is downplaying it.

Just to make it clear, my child does have clear boundaries. I don’t just let them hit me and say “ahh that’s okay” this has happened probably 3 times since she turned 1, she’s just turned 2 so it’s not every day or even every week. Yes I do want to teach her that we only ever use our hands on somebody to be kind (a hug, high five etc), I think it’s important for children to know that.

She absolutely has rules, consequences and boundaries and on the whole she is a great kid, she’s laughs a lot, playful, never have any trouble with her sleeping.

DD is a loving child, she’s never spiteful intentionally, it’s ALWAYS out of excitement, she’s never had a tantrum and lashed out in that way. She shares nicely with my friends toddlers and at nursery, she is gentle with animals etc.

I think your friend has been disagreeing with your style of parenting for a while and it’s come out like this because she has sat on it for so long. Your way of parenting isn’t great by the little information on here but neither is hers!

I wouldn’t lose the friend over it as I think she’s probably sick of seeing your dc walk all over you and rule the roost, friend was actually if you take another perspective, sticking up for you.

maybe Google some ways of dealing with your dc’s behaviours to help you now before the second arrives.

I spent a lot of years helping her with them when their Dad left, I was there every morning to help get them ready for school, breakfast etc I did pick ups when I could, had them stay at mine for weeks during holidays so she could get a break.

Why did you do all of this? Unless there is some tragic backstory this is very unusual.

I'm surprised at the replies here tbh. Of course two year olds sometimes hit, they're two and figuring out/pushing the boundaries. Not shouting doesn't mean you don't have boundaries 🙄 and honestly even if a parent does shout at their kids, it doesn't mean anyone else gets to! I'd have said something OP. Not "laid into her," but definitely along the lines of "please don't shout at her, I can handle it."

I definitely don’t think having grumpy teenagers who hide in their rooms and don’t want to go on family holidays is a valid criticism of any parenting style. That’s just having teenagers.

Yeah... you see, what you've described is not a normal home.

Shouty homes are not abusive, they just let children know when a line's been crossed.

If your friend is divorced then her relationship with her children could have been tainted in any number of ways.

I occasionally shout at my children, so does my DH, and we all have a great relationship. We console, listen, laugh, talk and praise just as much, it's just there when we need to deliver a strong message.

She’s never seen her do anything remotely like that towards me as it’s so rare. We see her probably once a month for a couple of hours and she usually dotes on her, plays the fun aunt role and gives her a chocolate ice cream every time we visit and plays with her. She was laughing at her throwing the ball in between our conversation, she just absolutely snapped when DD pulled my hair.

DD does not walk all over me or “rule the roost” we may not be a shouty house but we are firm.

I mean her kids are teens… isn’t that normal for them to enter their bedroom one day and not come out for a couple of years? Yes you do seem to grasping at reasons why she’s a crap mum. And unless there’s a backstory about the dad I don’t think the holiday preferences really make your case.

Because when he left, her mental health was very bad and she is my best friend. I was there to support her as she doesn’t have a great family.

I don’t think she’s a crap Mum, we just parent differently. No I don’t think that 3 teenagers laying in their rooms deciding to not go to school and not to have a shower in 8 days is normal. If that was my teenager, they’d be going to school and showering. She knows this and I’ve said it to her face.

“Shouty homes are not abusive” they actually are, emotionally abusive.

I’m sorry i feel like I don’t need to shout to be in control or have the upper hand.

I don’t think it’s normal for a child to hit, slap or pull hair when they’re excited, you have to establish firmer boundaries with your child. You don’t want her to grow up doing at school to other children, perhaps she can’t regulate her emotions and needs some help.

She's your best friend? It sounds like you don't like her at all and think you are a better parent than her.

I agree shouting is very bad, sometimes as parents we lose our cool. I try not to shout and to talk and I find talking to my child helps than to shout at them and make them fear me. However I know some children dont listen when parents are using a calm voice.

Neither sounds like great parenting.

Hitting/biting/hair pulling are not normal 2 year old stuff either.

I'm not a 'shouty household ' but I never had that crap and if it did, it would be 'when she gets excited, which suggests multiple incidents.

She may be too harsh, and you need firmer boundaries.