Where are the trans men?

[BlueandPinkSwan]

Just that really, we are always hearing about men wanting to 'become women'. Phycially, mentally and emotionally impossible, but why aren't women rushing to do the same thing in reverse?
Just interested to know as I'm gender critical, and hate the patriarcal society we live in.
Is it because men wouldn't accept it as a trans man being part of their tribe but women are forced to put up with trans women invading /trying to enter into woman only spaces?

And the rapists always know who a female is.

You think men never get raped?

Only because they have, as a community, redefined words as 'literal violence'.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/06/23/us/trans-women-incarceration

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/press/ncvs-trans-press-release/#:~:text=Transgender%20people%20are%20over%20four,at%20UCLA%20School%20of%20Law.

Sure. Transwomen aren't at risk and transpeople just mean "someone was mean to me" when they say they are at risk of violence

Transwomen are women and aren't acting threateningly by just going into the toilet they feel safest in

Hth

Well, they are given that they have no legal right to be there and the law explicitly states that they shouldn't be there.

Once someone has already shown a disregard for the law, no one else can judge how far they will take that.

trans women are male

that’s is a fact

and many women do not want to be around males in female only spaces because so many males are violent and they do not warn us they are going to be violent so just their presence can make us uncomfortable

females should not have to feel wary/uncomfortable in female only spaces

the issue is male violence not females wanting to remain feeling safe

What is a 'victimisation' when it's a home? 😵‍💫

Transwomen clearly aren't women.

You know that.

Why lie about something so obvious?

The female toilet is for ‘female’ people. It is designated as female and therefore female people are right to expect that space to be for only female people.

Can you please show where you were elected as the spokesperson for all male transgender people? Because you just made a blanket statement on their behalf. And one that is clearly false.

A statement, by the way, that is easy to show as being false. Because conveniently, male people with transgender identities self publish their actions on line. Do you want us to fill the thread with videos and photos of male people doing the exact thing that you deny?

Any male person entering a space that is designated as being female single sex only is violating the boundaries of the female people using the space. Sure, some female people are ok with those male people being there. However, those female people’s consent doesn’t over ride other female people’s non-consent.

HTH

And let me know if you want to see the links to self published content of male people with transgender identities doing the exact thing you deny happens.

You are not even trying to understand what I wrote and wilfully misrepresenting it. Waste of time communicating with you further.

Ok transwomen are women. We have replaced the old sex-based meaning of "Woman" with a new, shiny better meaning based on the belief that the difference between men and women is mental not physical. Seems pretty sexist to me, but ok. For this post, I'll accept that.

Thing is, women's spaces and womens rights and so on were not set up on a whim for people of "womanly mind". They were set up as direct responses to the risks and challenges faced by people with female bodies. They were called "women's" not in anticipation that future trans women should also be included but for the very simple reason that at the time, "woman" still had the old sex based meaning and was the name for female people.

And although the meaning of "woman" may have changed since then, female bodied people do still exist. Pretty much half of humanity is female bodied and every single human that ever lived owes their existence to one of those people so it's not like we are some obscure hidden sect. And those risks and challanges we faced because of our bodies are still there even if we aren't called "women" any more.

Yes, sadly, they did not go away along with the word. They seem to be very annoyingly stuck to our bodies.

So what I do not get is why on the one hand it's all "Trans women are women, it's not about the body and you don't have to be female to be a woman" but on the other it's "Because trans women are women they need to be included in everyting set up for female people, you can't have things for female people that do not include trans women".

Seems like a contradiction there surely? Either being female-bodied is significant to being a woman, in which case trans women are not women, or being female-bodied is not sigificant to being a woman, in which case trans women don't have any claim on female-only spaces and supports and it's entirely reasonable for them to continue to exist.

Can you explain to me clearly how it works that trans women, who are not female and don't have to deal with the challenges (physical and social) of being female, are entitled to the supports for female people, but female people, who are, obviously, female and do deal with the challenges that brings, are not entitled to have female-only anything?

It’s like dealing with flat earthers.

@AccidentallyWesAnderson Yes!

Very well said, @FlirtsWithRhinos. Top post.

Female single sex spaces are not there to protect male people above the age of about 8 years old. Just because a group of male people feel unsafe in male single sex spaces, the solution was never and still isn’t to allow those male people to be prioritised over the female people who need single sex spaces.

If male people feel unsafe in their spaces, they need to address this directly. They need to campaign to make male spaces safer for all males, including those with gender identities.

No other vulnerable male groups of people get the privilege to use female single sex spaces. And certainly not male people with the philosophical belief that they have an identity that is means they are somehow not male people. Ie. a philosophical belief that doesn’t reflect the material reality of their body.

This argument about safety is lazy and misses several other pertinent points.

Male people at any stage of transition still have been shown to have the same risk level of committing sex crimes as all other male people in the UK.

Female people need to have privacy and dignity away from all male people, it is not just about safety. Female people use the public spaces in their toilets, to use a toilet example, differently to male people.

Male people at any stage in their transition will have some physical advantage over female people. Even if it just height and the extra leverage their bone structure and their hip placement. There is a reason that male people are considered a risk to female people and this doesn’t change due to ‘transition’. To argue differently is making a Chesterton’s fence argument. It is forgetting why spaces were segregated in the first place. Not all male people are like that, and never were. But still enough were that robust safeguarding principles were developed to keep male people out.

This hasn’t changed. All male people are kept out of a space described as being for female people as per the Supreme Court Judgement in April 2024. Which clarified that this has been law in the Uk since 2010 but was misinterpreted.