Don’t want Pick Me at our wedding

[BarbourAnne]

I’m a bit hormonal at the moment so may well be unreasonable.

DP has a long standing friend (she’s long-term married) who is a typical pick me girl. Does the same male dominate sport, seen as one of the guys so when she grabs an arse it “doesn’t mean anything” and is generally very outgoing and out there.

Truth be told I’ve never liked her, but keep my distance. She’s the sort who will grope a fella, and then when challenged say it doesn’t mean anything but “I’m sorry if I offended you”. As if you’re the one with the problem not her.

Anyway. We’re now trying to organise a wedding and DP wants her to come. I haven’t seen her for 3 years. It is not a case of I don’t know her, so I don’t want her to come. I actively dislike her. I don’t want her feeling up my groom on our wedding day as “banter”.

He is saying all his other sporting mates are coming, and it will look odd if she isn’t invited. Personally I don’t care. Let it look odd. Or tell everyone I don’t like her so don’t want her there. Make me the bad guy, I don’t care. But this is the price she pays for her behaviour.

I would never tell him who he can and can’t be friends with, but I don’t spend time with her, and I don’t take “that’s just the way she is” or “it doesn’t mean anything she’s married” as a reason for her behaviour.

When I am married will it be ok to go and sit on some male friends lap, grab his arse etc? Of course not.

Totally unacceptable behaviour that should be loudly condemned. There was a woman like this in our wider circle when I was in my 20s. She’d press herself up against the men and grope their bums & groin. They (mostly) overreacted to get her off, her boyfriend didn’t bat an eye, but he didn’t really like her at all, goodness knows why he was with her, it lasted a long time but he was never going to end with her. Vile behaviour by anyone, not banter.

I wouldn’t have her there.

You’ve not seen her for years and if it was a man acting like that he wouldn’t be invited by the women of MN

I took it as her being judgmental about arse grabbing? I assume if the men are arse grabbers too, she’ll be judgmental about them as well. Did you have a different take?

Your DH to be needs to decide if he's ready to be a DH....

Exactly!

Nah; one of my female friends is
a huge football fan. But in no way would she be touching anyone else’s arsen

This doesn't sound like sexual assault to me, it sounds like group sex.

They all find it titillating, and get a 1st hand and 2nd hand thrill from inappropriate sexual contact.

Makes me feel very queasy.

I wouldn’t want anyone who sexually assaults people at my wedding either, OP. YANBU.

I agree, and also think that it's pretty unlikely that the version that OP and the other partners see is the most extreme - I think it probably all goes quite a bit further when there are no witnesses.

So does he get to veto one of your friends (who would be the only person in a particular friendship group of yours not invited) because he doesn't like her?

And this:
if you genuinely mean that you "would never tell him who he can be friends with", then I think that has to extend to him being able to invite her to the wedding.

@BarbourAnne I have thught of a way you can both win and have a go at her.

Write a letter to Pick Me for your fiance to deliver personally. Tell her that, as she is his lifelong dear friend, you are happy to have her at your wedding.

HOWEVER

You are aware of her choice to sexually assault other males and this won't be put up with at your wedding. In case she feels she cannot restrain herself, you have informed all wedding guests about her antics and you will have a number of male guests keeping an eye on her, and she will be ejected from the venue if she, at any time, chooses to touch any guest inappropriately.

This will put a focus on her alright, but not the one she wanted. The humiliation in itself may even mean she chooses not to come by hger own accord, which would aoso be a win-win for you.

Oh god, I worked with a woman like this. She was constantly groping the men in the office, boasting about sexual encounters she had with men in hotels during the lunch hour and much more. Its vile behaviour and IME men who are on the receiving end are embarrassed to call it out.

Not sure how this helps OP - I wouldn't want her at my wedding either, but women who behave like this should be called out, even if it's not as dangerous and threatening as when men do similar.

She sounds like something out of a Carry On movie

I was introduced to a very prestigious group of professionals - I was the outsider, but I was also in a very prestigious position.
When I met them, they were at a pool party and one of the husbands grabbed me and pulled me onto his lap and said “hey beautiful!” He kept me there until I could I pry myself away several minutes later. This man was very drunk.
Of course, the wives looked down their noses at me. I was dressed in street clothes.
The offending man’s wife hated me for the rest of those years we were acquainted with them - all because of her husband’s drunken behaviour.
She refused to attend our wedding, while everyone else attended.
I just wanted you to see the view from someone who was put in a very difficult position and who did nothing inappropriate but was penalized for it.
Those men were Naval pilot officers and I was aide to a senator.
Being inappropriate would have ruined my career, but evidently, not theirs.

I knew a woman like that, she was an exhibitionist...even talked about how she wanted to give birth in front of an audience. She wasn't joking...she tried to hire a TV crew. She was exhausting human at 25...I can't even imagine what she's like now at 50something...one would hope she'd settled down some, but w/ this update, makes me wonder if we know that same woman....

I agree that her behavior isn't dangerous to men like a man's would be to women, but she is a pest, that's for sure. And no way would I want someone like that at my wedding.

Tell your STBDH once, "I'm not inviting her," and don't say anything else. Are you in charge of the invites? Then don't address one to her. Just firmly, but simply say, "no. I'm not inviting her." No need for drama. A firm, non-emotional 'no' is enough.

You both have to agree to who comes to your wedding. You're not vetoing anyone else, I assume? Maybe add some distant cousin of your STBDH to show you're acting in good faith. Great-uncle Bob's daughter's niece won't make a scene, I'm sure.

Whilst she does sound like someone you might not want there you do need to decide if you’re someone who won’t say who he can be friends with or someone who will. Your position on it currently isn’t clear. Before issuing a straight veto maybe just check if there’s anyone he doesn’t want there as he could argue he gets the same.

She sounds like your typical attention beg.

Is it a physical sport that they're involved in OP? Not to excuse her behavior, but you do tend to find that teammates will be a bit 'hands on' socially with physical sports. Rugby is notorious for it, football and combat sports to a lesser extent too. Obviously her being female adds a different dynamic that will make some people uncomfortable, but I wouldn't necessarily assume that her intentions are nefarious rather than just (God I hate this word) 'banter'.

You do say that when you/your partner took issue with it she appologised and stopped.

I've been involved in a typically male dominated sport for the majority of my life, and you do tend to find that some women feel the need act like 'one of the lads' in order to fit in. And if it's a male dominated sport like you say, it'll naturally attract 'tomboy' types.

You say that there are recent pictures of her with male teammates knocking about. Presumably those men had no issue with her behavior, so you do run the risk of looking like you're singling her out because she's a woman. Or will you not be inviting the men in those pictures either? Would you react in the same way if one if your fella's male teammates groped him?

At the end of the day you're well within your rights not to want her there, but she's also been a friend of your partner's for presumably decades, and marriage is all about compromise. Could there be a situation where your partner tells her that her behavior has made some of the other guests uncomfortable in the past, and asks her to dial it down?

A man groping another man in jest is very weird but still a bit different to another woman groping your fella.

Would you have her at your wedding then?

Yes i wouldn't marry who wanted someone like that as a guest anyway

I don't necessarily disagree, but context is important!

I'm a former combat sports athlete; when you're training any kind of grappling you'll inevitably end up in all manner of compromising positions. I competed to quite a high level and with there being generally fewer women in the gym, I'd have to train and spar with smaller guys. If you end up stuck with some dude's sweaty butt in your face, sometimes you have to give it a smack or make a comment just to break the ice and get over the awkwardness of it.

That's obviously a million miles away from walking up behind someone and groping them 'just because'.

a 1st hand and 2nd hand thrill

😆😅😂😁

Surely it’s the biggest day of HIS life as well?

i imagine both the op and he thought that for the weddings of their first marriages.

look, this wedding isn’t going to be a happy affair no matter what. If it’s not this sex pest issue, it will be something else. Groups of people like this… they’ll be so many petty spats and likely so much soaked in alcohol.

Let her come, don’t let her come, the end result won’t be much different I suspect. Drama, tension, piss up

Thanks for all your input. It certainly helped. It was also interesting how many people thought they knew the woman- so either this behaviour isn’t that rare, or there’s a lot of team mates on here.

We agreed last night that we will invite members of the men’s team only- there will be some members of the women’s team-but as plus ones of the men. We’re then going to do a separate evening at the club and just buy the first round.

I think the idea of her behaviour being seen by his nieces was the dealbreaker. But he seems happy to say to the club it’s men’s team only because of numbers