To think there’s a real crisis in men being able to express how they truly feel about life and society?

[TheGentleSwan]

It feels like, in the West, men are struggling to be honest about their emotions, their frustrations, and how they view the world. Whether it’s societal pressure, fear of judgement, or just a lack of spaces to talk openly, it seems like many men keep things bottled up. AIBU to think this is a real issue?

I know anecdote does not equal data
but every divorced dad I know has had some difficulties with seeing their kids. Some minor, some short term, some more serious and enduring.

I believe it’s not as rare as you think

Data shows that males are the main false accusers of PA. Conviction data shows that men are liars on a ratio of 1:175. Men falsely accuse women 175 times more than women do to men. So yes data does prove that men are the main issue and yes it is rare.

Many of those will have been the reason for that difficulty. Abuse is the main issue women face in pregnancy. More so than anything else they experience.

An abuser isn't going to go to their mates and say they can't see their kids because they've been kicking her head in and she thinks they are not safe, right? Or do you think abusers are honest folk?

How do you distinguish between a man who is being alienated or one who is pretending to be alienated so no one knows the truth? Given the latter is more common data wise.

Exactly this. Every word.

Interesting data, can you share it?

also the claim of abuse being the largest issue faced in pregnancy? I’m not minimising it but I find that one hard to believe.

ONS data. Abuse is common in pregnancy. By all means do not believe it. I choose to believe women when they report abuse not say they are hard to believe.

Can you share your data source please and also answer my question on how to distinguish between an abuser who is lying and a man who is being alienated?

@ZoggyStirdust Did every dad you know reduce their working days when their wife was pregnant and do 50/50 childcare?

Mine is anecdotal. I said that in the post. I highlighted that did not make it data.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😁😁😁😁

You said it wasn't rare. What you told me what that men were having difficulties. You do not know the reasons behind those difficulties only what they told you was the reason. From that you applied it to the whole population to say it isn't rare assuming all of these were victims because a man told you.

I told you abusers (who are usually men) lie to get away with their crimes and cover up their crimes and paint the victim as the perpetrator. Happens in almost all cases of abuse and rape.

I asked you how did you define that these men were victims and not men pretending to be victims because someone took action to safeguard their children.

Wow! Someone really did a number on you didn't they? I can't imagine what it's like to carry such bitterness.

Oh, OK then 🙄

So, yes please, I do want more evidence.

Great. Google is your friend!

Nope they haven't. Men do have a sense of entitlement why do you think the phrase 'friend zone' is used as a put down? Or have I made that up that that phrase is even a thing?

I'm not bitter. I just can't imagine being a person who accepts men saying 'friend zone' to disrespect women who do not give them sex as being a good thing. I do not think we should accept that and disagree that speaking out about it is being bitter.

The irony that this post is about men not being able to speak out and look what happens when a woman does, she is told to shut up and stop being bitter because men complaining about 'friend zone' is grand!

If you've no evidence, you need only say so. You wouldn't be the first person to frame your belief as a fact.

Are you literally joking!?

Thanks for the 'schooling' but I know all there is to know about mental health services - or indeed lack off - in my area. I know first hand what causes people to become mentally unwell because I've lived it. Having spent over a month in hospital, I know the signs and now do what I can to try and stop others suffering like I did. I've done pretty much all the things you describe, and then some, so no need to 'educate myself' thanks.

Respectfully, I think that's all rather trivial. Guess we're just bothered about different things when it comes to men's mental health...

So it is trivial when men are lonely because they disrespect women down to a sense of entitlement that we are not worthy of being friends with men and only worthy of being in their lives if we are fucking them and are killing themselves as they are lonely due to this. That is trivial is it?

Looking at why women are not going near such men is worth discussing or do we wish to skirt over the disrespect and misogyny and pretend this isn't the cause of women not wanting anything to do with such individuals?

In the grand scheme of things, I think it's trivial. You don't. That's fine.

Suicide is trivial to you, grand! Glad you've made that point clear.

What isn't trivial to you then? Women speaking out? That is a huge issue for you isn't it?

I believed what they told me. They’re friends.

I think quite a few men really feel like pressure to be talking about their emotions is mainly women trying to make them deal with their feelings like women do. ANd they don't like it.

The chances of them all being victims is very slim. The probability that the majority were lying is high.

So do you think that if they were abusers because they are your friends they would tell you they were kicking ten bells out of their wife?

Fantastic post.

You said you wanted some ideas of how you could help with the problem of male suicide. I gave you a list of practical actions that could make a real difference. Obviously they take a lot more effort than hand wringing on MN about how terrible it is that men can't express themselves and berating other women for not caring as much about men as you do, but they're the things you asked about that could help. If you don't want to help and are just here for the virtue signalling I do think its important you educate yourself. Spreading myths about male suicide causes more harm than good.

I’m not going to defend my friends against a total stranger on the internet who doesn’t know them