Angry about lenient sentence for murder of elderly man in park

[Thomasina79]

7 years for the boy and three for the girl. This country is pathetic sometimes. A man lost his life while innocently walking his dog. Too sad

Does anyone know where I can find a transcript of the sentencing?

I'm local and sadly overt racism is so much more common around here than it was 10 years ago. People say whatever they want openly and lots of them consider all brown people to be "boat people" who should be deported. Look at the social media comments on local pages and you'll see what I mean.

Their families aren't necessarily extremist, it's just so common it was probably normal to those kids. And therefore doing something like this was funny and acceptable to them. But their parents get away scot free to keep peddling this nonsense.

A judge saying the attack wasn't racially motivated would be like Christmas to them. The girls family will be celebrating that she got away with it. It's just what it's like around here now.

Public figures and politicians spouting the same sort of racist nonsense makes people think it's OK for them to say it and then it escalates into people being killed.

I was born and bred in the area these kids are from and I was never fearful of racist attacks growing up (I'm brown), but I am now. My parents still live around there and I can't imagine my dad not being about to go wherever he wants for fear of such abuse but apparently he should be now.

Thanks to PP for linking to the sentencing review page, I'll definitely be doing that too.

@KenAdams Sentencing remarks here - comments on race seem somewhat contradictory from the judge. Bizarre.

I'm sorry that the area is like that - I think there is much more overt racism all over the UK, and it's getting worse. Sentences like this send the wrong message to racists, and exacerbate the problem.

You think it was a beleivable story that an aunt gave some kids a 4k ebike? Kids that felt it necessary to run from the police?

2 boys on a 4k ebike fleeing from the police is blatantly drugs or gangs.

The police should never have been investigated in that case. They were 2 children illegally riding an ebike too fast and they crashed.

Ultimatrly the point of prison has got to be rehabilitation, we cannot afford to keep every criminal and their mums locked up in our prisons forever. In this case I with a 13 yo and a 14yo they will need to be rehabilitated at some point, and if they spend too long in an adult prison there is a liklihood that you just create even more of a criminal. They are still children, even though what they did was awful

I don't know how you can say it wasn't racially motivated though, he was shouting racial abuse at the man. Is the argument Mr Kholi was targeted because he'd told off some kids in the past?

Of course it was never a gift from the aunt - that's why I said it was a 'likely story' and of course the police should have followed/chased. The whole case/story was ridiculous.

@ComtesseDeSpair

I do understand your point but some crimes are so heinous that a sentence needs to relfect their severity. These sentences do not.I don't care about the age of the perpetrators, they are old enough to know right from wrong.

I agree - it’s become more normalised and acceptable to be racist! Sentencing and justice needs to send a clearer and stronger message that it’s absolutely not okay. I feel we are going backwards. This country is going to the pits.

It is such a horrible crime. That poor, vulnerable man going about his day and coming across those horrendous children, I am throughly disgusted and horrified by their behaviour and it is hard to see how they can develop out of this scale of behaviour. There is an aspect of their thinking that is so far off the scale it is hard to know how it can be fixed.

Incarceration even though it is profoundly traumatising I think it is an incredibly important part of correction for clearly extremely damaged children but if ultimately they are going to be back out in society we need to work out a way to rehabilitate them and in relatively young children there is a chance for that, once they get older the personality and patterns become more fixed and the opportunities for rehabilitation fall. They need the punishment so there are consequences for their actions, the punishment will traumatise them and that will add to their negative personality aspects so there is a balance to be struck. I honestly don’t know what that balance is though.

I doubt very much that he can be rehabilitated. In fact, I would bet my house on him re-offending in some capacity once he’s released. This will not be his only stint of being incarcerated in his lifetime.

I was looking at the Reform website they've a quote with a union flag in the background..we want our country back.This is not dissimilar to the rhetoric that the BNP used in the 90s.
It emboldens people with racist leanings.

All this. I am brown too. Noticing many veiled comments these days. Not so much in London, but in other areas.
Brown people are takers, leaches, abusers and so on.

The thing with this quote is… it’s quite vague… what do they actually mean by We Want Our Country Back… Most people from ethnic minority backgrounds are fine people who bring a lot to this country.

It definitely carries racist connotations.
The reform MP asking should the burka be banned? That's definitely into BNP style rhetoric,I remember the leaflets in the 90s when the BNP were trying to present an acceptable public face but still carrying the racist under tones.

Bhim Kohli did everything that ethnic minorities are meant to do..Upstanding member of community, family man, broke no laws, loved by his neighbours.
But still not enough .
I dread when Reform comes in. Incidents like these will become more common.

Hopefully that never happens.
Our country is bad enough as it is.
I'm hoping they gain sod all in Scottish election next year.

We don’t jail children for life and nor should we. And yes, I’d say the same if this had been a family member.

Whereas the poor man was robbed of his life. If they are old enough to kill...

@Rispa42

I clearly said it wasn’t an excuse. But I can see why it’d be more likely to happen.

I don’t think it is contradictory at all. He is saying that despite the alleged use of a racial slur, there is no other evidence of the boy holding racist views despite further investigation. He used the word as a descriptor rather as a term of hate. It seems the judge felt the boy didn’t understand the magnitude of using that word. Whether that is right or wrong, I have no idea but I have to assume the judge has more evidence at his disposal in order to make that decision. I find it hard to believe the boy isn’t racist, but that doesn’t mean this particular crime has enough evidence to give rise to a charge of a hate crime. The litmus test is, would they have attacked him if he was white. Given the apparent history of them having dealt with him before, I think they would have.

…they are old enough to be sentenced as children who kill. Which they were.

If anyone here thinks the sentence is wrong, they can submit a request for review.

Yes, you are correct.

Racist slur as a "descriptor instead of hate".
Will remember that next time DS is called a P*.

@BoredZelda He used the word as a descriptor rather as a term of hate.

It's not a descriptor. Just like the N-word isn't a descriptor for black people.

It seems the judge felt the boy didn’t understand the magnitude of using that word. Whether that is right or wrong ...

It is wrong. And I would be surprised if any 14 year old doesn't understand what the word means, or doesn't understand that kicking and punching a defenseless, vulnerable elderly gentleman could lead to his death.

I've lost loved ones who also didn't make it anywhere near 80.

It was heartbreaking seeing cancer slowly take them; but I cannot imagine the vast magnitude by which that would have increased if they'd died because somebody who hated them for a neutral personal characteristic randomly assumed that their hatred gave them the right to bludgeon them to death.

I join you in your hope that these scum live next to you or your family and are best mates with your kids.