She’s not dd(11)s problem?

[juneisjuly]

Dd(11) was one of two girls from her primary to go to this secondary.
Dd and the other girl (that I’ll call Sarah) weren’t friends in primary, Sarah was basically head girl and was on occasion mean to dd eg would tell tales on her and refer to her as one of the boys excluding her from girl things.

Dd already knew other girls in secondary school from out school groups and quickly made other friends.
It’s seems Sarah hasn’t. Dd did hang out with Sarah for a while and attempt to include her with other friends at lunch and inviting out with them on a couple of occasions.
But says she finds her difficult and says she either doesn’t say anything or is really negative, none of dd’s friends like Sarah or want to include her.

After Christmas dd was called out of class and asked what was going on with her and Sarah, she explained and nothing else came from it.
Dd has never been unpleasant to sarah.

Sarah’s mum messaged me to ask if dd went out over Easter as Sarah was upset to have not done anything. I said that dd has gone out with friends and that I just don’t think her and Sarah are friends, they never were in primary and haven’t clicked now.
She’s said she’s going to have to go to the school as it’s not fair that Sarah is being excluded and the ‘primary school name’ girls should stick together.

I dont think Sarah is dds problem and that she shouldnt have to be friends with Sarah or hang out with her.

AIBU?

@juneisjulyi would speak to school first, the head of year possibly. Just to give them a heads up. Explain yours and DD situation and that you have tried to be tactful to the mum. That there is no bullying/excluding, just that DD has other friends and Sarah isn’t in that group. Explain you feel for Sarah but don’t want your DD being pulled out of lessons again, or forced into a situation of hanging around with Sarah that is likely to then push her away from the friendship group she actually likes.

When my DD moved to a senior school away from the area we went to primary, I enrolled her in out of school clubs to make friends before she went. your DD had this and Sarah’s mum should have done the same to avoid this situation. If she hasn’t that’s not yours or DDs issue. I feel for Sarah but she needs to make her own friends and focus on that instead of being left out from a group that is not really her friends.

@Namenamchange · Today 22:48

she should be asking how they can support Sarah to make new friends not force her old primary friends to include her.

But she she isn't with any old primary friends, isn't that the issue? Sarah and OP's DD were never friends there.

Yanbu.
Sarah is struggling with school going from the big fish to just another student.
She will find her tribes again.
I'd be happy that your DD isn't her sidekick when she finds herself.

There are so many ways for Sarah’s mum to help Sarah make friends. Enrolling in after school clubs, activities outside school (scouts or guides are good ones), joining school sports. Sarah will then find her tribe.
Your DD has been very kind but it’s actually turned into one of those ‘no good deed goes unpunished’ situations.
Where do you and your DD want to see this situation by the end of the school year? Put in place ways to make that happen. Protect your DD.

So head it off upfront.

Tell the school.what you've said here: your daughter tried and you strongly feel that the mother will approach the school asking them to push Sarah into your daughter again- you don't support that and actively do not want the school to take this course of action. They can find her a different buddy.

You and your DD have done the right thing, if what she says is true.
Of course the other Mum will be worried, but if they weren’t friends in the first place, she has no right to say anything to you.
It is hard to see your child struggling, but you absolutely cannot force friendships.
Let the Mum go to the school, I think secondary teachers can see straight through these things. Hopefully the other girl can get some support and stop trying to rely on your DD.

If it was my daughter in the ‘Sarah’ position I’d work with her on her self confidence and ways she can make new friends, it’s not doing either of the girls any favours making this situation someone’s fault

Oh god Sarah’s mum needs to get a grip!! Absolutely not your daughter’s problem - sounds like her mum is shocked her precious darling can’t make friends. You / your daughter should just get on with it - she should be kind (always) but can have whatever friends she likes.

while I feel for Sarah, going to the school to insist that girls who came form xx primary school must stick together is ridiculous.

She is not being excluded if they haven’t jelled together and are not friends. You can’t force them to be friends simply because you want to show sympathy. As long as OPs DD is polite to her and isn’t going out of her way to be mean or ill-treat her or bully her etc, but if they are not friends then they are not friends.

They are in secondary school for crying out loud, what next University head of departments forcing students from the same secondary school to be friends at Uni?

YANBU.

In my experience as both a secondary pupil and a secondary teacher, primary school pals don't always stick together at secondary school. In fact, the schools encourage the various primary groups to mix up.

What's Sarah's mummy going to do when Sarah has difficulty making friends after leaving school - phone round other young women's parents and demand that they befriend her?

It's been two terms

I'm sure that your DD isn't the only child Sarah knows so the school needs to broaden her potential friendship groups

It's no longer your DD's job

@BlahBlahBittyBlah it feels as though you are putting yourself in the position of the Sarah's mother - desperate to sort things out and going for the easy option of trying to guilt the op's daughter into becoming Sarah's new best friend. Whereas you should be looking at what it is about Sarah that is driving the other girls away. For all your talk of empathy, you have given no thought how Sarah treated the op's daughter at primary school and how that must have impacted the op's daughter. The op's daughter has attempted to bring the girl into her friendship groups but the attempts have failed because of Sarah's negativity. Perhaps you should be more even handed.

@juneisjuly I'd do what previous posters have recommended and contact the school, explain the history and ensure that your daughter does not become responsible for Sarah's friendships.

Ask yourself how you would feel if your daughter were being coerced into being 'friends' with a girl who had bullied her.

The OP's daughter has already tried to be helpful. She's done enough.

Well, quite! Her mother sounds like a nightmare, filling her precious daughters-in-law head with all sorts of entitlements

Fuck that noise. I had a similar issue with a mum pushing her DD on my DD. My DD didn’t like this girl, she finds her too overly bossy and controlling and humourless. When DD started heat 7 I got a text from Thai girl’s mum asking why they weren’t friends! I just replied along they’re at secondary now they can sort their own friendships. They’re on their journey to adulthood now, I really think if they can they should sorry their own interests with mum’s intervention only when it’s necessary

Your DD is not responsible for Sarah's happiness.

This, definitely! Get in touch and explain to the school and/or ask to speak to whoever the appropriate pastoral person is (form tutor, Head of Year). This is not on your daughter, and the other girl needs to be supported to find new friendships. This sort of thing is common at secondary and they should have different tactics and ways of encouraging her (eg moving classes / suggesting clubs/activities etc).

@juneisjuly OP, if the other mother has the temerity to approach the school, please be ready to point out that your daughter has already tried to be accommodating in spite of the fact that Sarah bullied her at primary and that she can do no more. Tell them that you are not prepared to put your daughter's mental health in jeopardy.

If the school pastoral team has any sense, they'll inform Sarah's entitled idiotic mother that the school has no authority over children outside school hours and that it cannot dictate friendship groups within school.

Two terms on, they should all have made other friends. If Sarah hasn’t, that’s not your dd’s problem at all.

Drop an email.to her tutor or head of year. Explain you've been contacted by Sarah's mum as she has concerns about her child - however you do not want your child brought into it as despite coming from the same primary, they were not friends there and previous attempt to include her in your child's current groups has failed.

Your child is not responsible for another child's friendships or lack of.

But says she finds her difficult and says she either doesn’t say anything or is really negative, none of dd’s friends like Sarah or want to include her.

I think this has the potential to be an even bigger problem. If the school force DD and Sarah together then DD could lose her new friendships if they see that to have DD they have to have Sarah too.

You need to go to the school as soon as term starts and spell it out to them that you will not support them making Sarah your DD's problem. Emphasise that they haven't excluded her, she has pretty much excluded herself by her behaviour.

This is a prime example of when you do have to be 'that' parent.

OP should also be prepared for the pastoral team trying to persuade her that Sarah and her DD should hold a restorative conversation in order to allow them to 'move on' from the past.

It is not up to your daughter to assuage Sarah's guilt for her past bullying and it is certainly not up to your daughter to behave as Sarah's social manager.

You don’t need to get involved. Schools have social classes, clubs, etc to involve kids like Sarah. It’s really isn’t your problem.

Most bullies from primary end up friendless for a reason.

You don’t need to get involved.

I think she does. She has to support her daughter and talk to the school pre-emptively before they try to take the easy way out.

Yup. There's a chance that DD will be taken out of class for another chat.