She’s not dd(11)s problem?

[juneisjuly]

Dd(11) was one of two girls from her primary to go to this secondary.
Dd and the other girl (that I’ll call Sarah) weren’t friends in primary, Sarah was basically head girl and was on occasion mean to dd eg would tell tales on her and refer to her as one of the boys excluding her from girl things.

Dd already knew other girls in secondary school from out school groups and quickly made other friends.
It’s seems Sarah hasn’t. Dd did hang out with Sarah for a while and attempt to include her with other friends at lunch and inviting out with them on a couple of occasions.
But says she finds her difficult and says she either doesn’t say anything or is really negative, none of dd’s friends like Sarah or want to include her.

After Christmas dd was called out of class and asked what was going on with her and Sarah, she explained and nothing else came from it.
Dd has never been unpleasant to sarah.

Sarah’s mum messaged me to ask if dd went out over Easter as Sarah was upset to have not done anything. I said that dd has gone out with friends and that I just don’t think her and Sarah are friends, they never were in primary and haven’t clicked now.
She’s said she’s going to have to go to the school as it’s not fair that Sarah is being excluded and the ‘primary school name’ girls should stick together.

I dont think Sarah is dds problem and that she shouldnt have to be friends with Sarah or hang out with her.

AIBU?

This is an age when friendship groups (and being included) matters terribly. Sarah is not your DD’s problem. She also behaved meanly at primary school.

But right now Sarah is unhappy. Anything your DD and/or her peers can do to help her make friends and enjoy her school life would be a kindness.

Girls (more so than boys ime) can be terrible at letting ‘dislikes’ fester for years.

Secondary schools don’t do that. They will be clear we can’t force or facilitate friendships.

*not friends in primary school

I'd have a chat with the head of year before the other mum does and explain. They will have seen situations like this a hundred times before and be able to advise the way forward. I'd be clear that dd and this girl have never been friends and despite her trying to include her it hasn't been successful. They need to find ways to help her make her own friends.

It's more than 2/3 of the way through the school year so plenty of time for everyone to have made new friendships. It sounds like Sarah would have been perfectly happy to not be friends with your daughter, OP, if she had other options and Sarah's mum probably doesn't have contact details for other kids' parents so you're a soft target. Agree with PP about letting the pastoral team at school know your perspective so as to prevent further pressure on your daughter. Yes we should be sympathetic to poor Sarah's social struggles but not at the expense of your daughter's happiness. They're 11; they will all change friendship groups several times over the next few years .

As long as your DD is polite to Sarah then that's all that matters. She has no obligation to be Sarah's friend now matter how much the other mother or teachers try to make out she does. If your DD was an adult no-body would try to force her to be friends with somebody she doesn't "click" with in the workplace so why do we expect it from schoolkids?

Sarah's mum doesn't give a toss about OP's daughter.
She is fixated on Sarah and what she wants.
Your daughter should have avoided her from day one due to their history.

By your daughter being called from class about this matter, there is implied criticism of her.

I would be furious about that.
Sarah's mother contacting you and threatening to go to the school is off the scale entitled.

Adults cannot dictate who children hang with outside of home. Leave the children alone, they'll naturally gravitate towards those like them. This girl is struggling because she isn't very nice. If she changed her mindset she'd attract nice friends. School cannot make your daughter be friends with someone she doesn't like. They'll ignore the girls mum for sure. Leave them all to it.

I agree, not your daughters problem to solve, and we’re half way through the school year now!

I think you need to prepare your daughter with some things to say. Basically , what you have said in your opening thread. Ie, you had other friends at primary and you have made new friends in this school. You haven’t been unpleasant to her, and it’s not up to you to sort her friendship problems are.

Pre-emptive email today. Be clear that you expect your daughter not to be spoken to about this and you trust the school will work with Sarah’s mother to get to the root of Sarah’s problem.

I'd email or leave a message for the head of year (or other relevant pastoral contact- some schools do it by house) to clarify that there is no natural friendship between DD and Sarah, and the issues that they had in primary school. Let them know that Sarah's mum has been applying pressure and contacting directly and that you do not support the forcing of this "friendship"

(This is not Safeguarding Lead territory!)

Your DD is socially settled which is great, and that's best left to be. Sarah's social skills are her own issue for her to develop and work out. DD is not a sticking plaster to fix her.

DS is autistic and went to secondary with two from primary. When I had concerns about friendships, school did social skills group work with him (and he did find likable people there). At no point did I expect him to pal up with either from primary- if they were natural friends, they would have been friends already. They're all civil with each other, but don't owe each other more than that.

Yanbu. Secondary school is when friendships mix up and the opportunity to make new ones. The fact Sarah hasn't done that seems more, sadly, due to her social skills and while it sounds heartbreaking for her mum and for her, her mum needs to encourage that rather than make your dd be friends with her. TBH it sounds like your dd has already gone above and beyond.

Does your dd have a decent head of year? At my DS's school, he had a v approachable head of year in year 7. Id either wait and see but get in touch if your dd is spoken to again or get in touch now to gently explain the situation. School need to know that palming this off on your dd isn't an option.

If I were you I would email school laying out what has gone on and your wish that your daughter is not ‘forced’ to be her friend.

I would reply to the other parent and say something like

"Oh dear, I am sorry to hear Sarah is struggling with friendships at school. DD has made friends and did try to include Sarah, but it didn't work out, unfortunately. If you think you need to involve the school then go for it.

But DD cannot be forced by this school to be friends with Sarah just because they went to the same primary school - especially as they were never friends there. That is unreasonable and I will intervene with the school if I feel she is being singled out in this.

I do understand it is hard to see your child struggling with something, and in your shoes I would feel the same, but the answer to this isn't to force a friendship where it doesn't exist.

Good luck with the school"

So if Op's daughter has been spoken to, has everyone else in the class who doesn't want to be friends with her?

Surely they are all excluding her if they aren't including her?

You've gone abit ott here. There was nothing in the post that suggested that ops daughter hadn't made effort to be understanding. She had made effort to include Sarah. Did you not read this ? Also ops child is 11 and not equipped to understand why Sarah is so difficult and negative. Its not the children's responsibility to resolve this its the parents of Sarah and the school. There are other children at the school.. its not just ops daughter that needs to make effort with Sarah. Yes of course ops daughter need to have empathy but that's not the end of the matter, they actually have to all be able to get along and have a connection as friends as well in order to move forward and the happiness of Sarah does not fall on one other childs shoulders only.

Do you know the whole story? Have you spoken to the teachers about this one? It may be that Sarah is also friends with the girls and being left out. But if she is not, no one should be made to be friends with her. Polite of course, but no one can force friendships. She needs to go to clubs, sports etc to make her own friends.

I would suggest to the mother that Sarah needs to make her own friends via sports, clubs and common interests. I would remind her they were not friends during primary and secondary does not automatically change things. Friendships also change during secondary as girls find their group.

My dd is in year 8 and from what she says the friends mix and change from the start of year 7, but everyone is friendly of course. Friendships change when classes are changed and you meet new people, until you find your group that you naturally click with.

I totally second this post, Yes, friendships do change in secondary, they did for my DD and all worked out ok in the end but it is upsetting as a parent to see your DC going through this.

My DD is one of two girls (there's also a boy from the parallel class) who are going to a secondary school. I bumped into the mum the other day and we had both been told by our DDs that they didn't want to be deliberately put together (though I know they get on). It is a new time for them and the other girl needs a bit of a boost.
Maybe mention some things that have helped your DD ("my DD has friends at X school through Y sport/Guides, I know there are spaces in Scouts, maybe she could join something like that") or ask if she thinks school can help (does she need a quiet place to go at lunch time or a job to do).

My DS struggles massively with making friends so I am sympathetic but I confine myself to suggesting play dates to the other mum or giving him tips on how to ask to join a game

The OP’s dd has already been beyond kind to include this girl who was mean to her in primary school.

We really need to stop socialising girls into meeting everyone’s needs but their own.

Perhaps the mum should have pulled up her dd more when she saw her being mean to other kids.

Yanbu, as the mother of a child who always struggles to make friends.

While your dd can be considerate of Sarah's struggles, she does not have to have a forced friendship with Sarah. This will only make it harder for both girls.

I agree that all pupils in the class should be asked, not just your dd as they're equally culpable if Sarah is being deliberately excluded.

Although it sounds to me a little like Sarah is maybe finding the move from big fish/little pond to little fish/big pond difficult and this isn't something that mummy can just force into others to bolster her DD's self esteem.

Sarah's mum can ask the school about lunch clubs and other ways her dd can engage with her peers in an attempt to build relationships with others.

There was a girl at DDs primary and he mum spent a lot of time orchestrating her friendships. She had several older children and knew a lot of the mums. She really wanted her DD to be popular, this also meant excluding children like my DD because her mum didn’t like me.
The girl had been nice but became increasingly entitled.
They went to different secondary school and guess who had massive issues making any friends. I don’t think she had learned how to be nice/or how to be friends.

Yes if this were two boys there would be much more common sense and "If they don't like each other, what can you do?". Teenage boys definitely have their own problems in how they are socialised but they aren't turned into the babysitters of a social group and taught how to be false to themselves.

This is so weird. I have 5 kids and only one of them stayed friends with primary school peers when they went to secondary. It is normal to move on.