M&S changing rooms

[SweetChilliGirl]

Was I unreasonable to send this to M&S?

Good morning,

Having not shopped for lingerie with you for several years, due to your policy of allowing trans-identifying men into the women's changing rooms, can I now be assured that, in line with the judgement of the supreme court males will no longer be allowed to identify their way into your single sex changing rooms, thus preserving biological women's dignity and safety? I would very much like to be able to shop with you again.

I look forward to hearing from to to clarify this important matter.

Regards,

Sweetchilligirl

YANBU and I look forward to their reply which will hopefully clarify that they plan to abide by the law and provide single sex spaces for women again.

Changing facilities in privately owned businesses aren’t subject to law, OP. M&S can dictate exactly who is allowed in them and it’s their choice.

M&S changing rooms I have been in have a locked door.

I really can't see the issue who is in the next one too me 🤷‍♂️

Not quite.
Private businesses are not allowed to discriminate. See Gay Cake.

You are completely wrong. The equality act applies to shops and businesses

www.equalityhumanrights.com/guidance/business/guidance-businesses

In our local M&S there aren’t men’s and women’s - that’s the problem. The one in the lingerie section just says Fitting Room. So I’m not sure thinking works, if that’s the case across their stores. Better to ask if they will restore fitting rooms signed Male and Female?

I didn't know this, but then again I never took the time to seek it out as it wasn't something I'd think about, but if that's the case I wonder why so many stores either went with it or as in the case with our local larger clothing store done away with the men's changing rooms all together.

Luckily you don’t get to give away the rights of other women and girls because you’re fine with a mixed sex space.

I’m saying that they can allow a transwoman into the ladies changing room because it is not unlawful for them to set their own rules for access.

It’s not true as evidenced above

They can set their own rules, within the law.

No, they cannot allow males to access changing rooms marked as female.

That's kind of the whole point. And it's brilliant 😁

M&S can absolutely declare their fitting rooms as uninsex – it’s completely lawful and they do not have to provide single sex spaces.

Our local one has fitting rooms by the lingerie and by the menswear, I was waiting to go into the lingerie one last week and a man came over to queue the staff member said sir the men's fitting room is over there the other side of the menswear near the café. I was quite pleased.

ETA both are just labelled.fitting room not men's/women's

Mine has curtains that don't "quite" close

This is for employees - not for customers. They do not have to provide single sex changing for customers. They can declare it unisex.

I think this what a lot of people have misunderstood about the ruling.

If an organisation still wants to include women and TIMs in the same space, they I'll be allowed to. They just won't be able to label/advertise it as a female space.

That way, women won't be lied to and TW won't be able to access female/women's spaces. And women will have the right to challenge if a male person is in a female space without being the one who is told to leave.

If someone wants to offer a unisex space, it'll have to be compliant with the law.

Mmm. That's not what I said though.

They can't allow males to access changing rooms designated as female. No matter how pink and frilly they're dressed.

Unisex fitting rooms don't give those with autogynephilia the same kick as forcing their way into female spaces does. It's why they push back so hard about third spaces, because these just won't do.

The fact that males can no longer 'legitimately' push their way into female spaces is bloody outstanding.

Regardless of what they can and can't do in law, I'll tell you what they can't do in real terms.

They can't alienate the majority of their customer base if they want to thrive as a business.

If they think that men pretending to be women and their allies spend more than women and their allies, then let them take the test and find out.

Same for Ocado, Barclays and the rest of them. We don't have to do anything except keep our purses firmly shut.

And we can declare M&S a no go. We're not helpless.

This has nothing to do with the opinion of the ruling by any direction. My point simply is that M&S do not have to provide single sex spaces for changing spaces for customers. They may or they may not decide to.

Everyone can decide, indeed.

I don’t think there’s enough singular incidents to really make a difference to general footfall however. Boycotting of stores has happened for all sorts of reasons in the past - stance on Russia/Ukraine, palm oil, Teslas etc. It very rarely makes a dent whatsoever to large corporations. This is nothing to do with my personal opinion on whether people should shop there or not.

Why are you shopping in M&S, they advertise on the blatantly misogynistic GB news.

And how are they going to police this? Demand to see birth certificates, or ask for a fanny flash? I have several very androgynous female friends who look quite masculine, conversely I know some trans women you wouldn't give a second glance to or suspect were not born women. Whatever your thoughts on this ruling, HOW is it going to be enforced?