To think I can't be the only person who doesn't know a single trans person

[VioletSpeedwell]

Seriously.

The news is full of people worrying about how the SC ruling will affect people who identify as trans.

Where are they? Not in my office (large organisation), my family or social groups. I don't come across any in the village where I live or when I go into town.

DD is at university and doesn't know any trans people.

Surely, I can't be the only one?

Where are they all?

Apparently, they were in London today, having a massive tantrum, chanting silly slogans and defacing statues.

One of the reports says:

At least two statues in Parliament Square were daubed with graffiti during the rally including one of suffragette Millicent Fawcett, who was part of the campaign to secure the vote for women in the early part of the 20th century.

just says it all really doesn’t it!

Odd isn’t it. Every single time I note something odd about an actor in a TV show, like within seconds of them appearing in a scene and certainly after they start speaking, a quick google reveals they are trans.

Every single time. I’m just sitting there watching the drama and hey… yep, that’s not a biological woman. It’s uncanny. I’d consider it a weird superpower if it weren’t for all the other women I know who clocked it too. They do not pass.

That's wishful thinking (and petty). I know many transwomen who not only pass but they look better as women than many natural women.

And, there is a reason why transwomen, for their own safety, are told to always inform a man of their identity prior to their first sexual encounter. If they "didn't pass" then having to inform the man wouldn't be a thing.

'...better as women than many natural women'? There's rarely been a more deluded, autogynephiliac statement.

The degree to which those men have modified their appearance, by means either permanent or temporary, to more closely resemble a narrowly conventional model of femininity is, ultimately, irrelevant. They remain men.

They'll never be better at being a woman than an actual woman.

I know many transwomen who not only pass
but they look better as women than many natural women.

Oh yes, the petty and misogynistic "men can 'women' better than you women".

And you really don't see the hateful misogyny in these statements.

It’s likely you know some trans people without realizing. My neighbours of the past 7 years are an elderly lesbian couple. It was only this year that we were chatting and it came up that one of them was born male and had transitioned back in the 80s. I had no idea.

It can be harder to tell sex with the very young and very old (and also, I'd say, with those of atypical gait for reasons of disability or obesity).

I'm sure there are and will still be cases of successful deception of some people by some people. However, the current situation has been that anyone who can tell is just told to pretend harder that they can't.

Me too. Many, many times now we've been watching a quiz show or a documentary about sprockets or other exciting things, and someone is introduced as Lydia Loveday or similar, but it's just blindingly obvious that Lydia started life as Leonard. I suppose the reason so many men dismiss women's ability to do this is because men are not nearly as good at this as women. There are obvious evolutionary reasons for this. As I have said time without number now, why would humans be the only mammals who can't correctly sex other members of their own species?

What about simply being honest with a prospective sexual partner and considering their needs and preferences alongside one's own? Revolutionary concept, I know, but most of us would prefer not to be deceived or coerced into sex. As a long-married heterosexual woman this is outside my own experience, but unless a man was blind drunk or otherwise cognitively challenged I'd be amazed if he couldn't tell that his sexual partner was not female when they get down to business.

I know two. One is a friend from university who transitioned from woman to man aged 20, 25 years ago now. They look like a 45 year old man, balding with a beer belly. If I met them for the first time now I'd think they were a gay man.

The second is a child at my kids' school. They changed from boy to girl aged 5, in year 1. They are 10 now. I think the parents should be prosecuted. How can it be ok to tell a 5 year old he is a girl and then get everyone to go along with it? Absolute madness.

Looking at the pictures of the marches yesterday then they are really not passing.

I know someone whose teenage son has declared themselves a woman (after spending many years locked in his room on the internet- funny that) is making zero effort to change his appearance. He has been using the women’s bathrooms now in his college.

*I know many transwomen who not only pass but they look better as women than many natural .

Delusional.

If you have ever watched Ru Paul’s Drag Race there are a number of men who can make themselves become absolute stunners - and not in an over the top unreal way - they look like they’re about to join TOWIE and wouldn’t look out of place among the women - some would argue these women look OTT, but I’m saying they look how a lot of young women now aspire to look

So what you are saying is that they NEED make up to look like women? Real women don’t, even if some women choose to wear it.

I can completely believe that there are people who don't know anyone who is trans. It depends on the circles you move in, your social activities and so on. I was in my teens before I learned that not everyone lived with their mum and dad, because my family was very religious, I went to a church school etc. I wasn't taught about things that weren't within their belief system. Similarly, I was well into my 20s before I learned that same-sex relationships happened.
I have trans colleagues at work but not any friends or acquaintances. To my knowledge. Having seen two people transition completely one to a woman, one to a man, if I didn't know then I wouldn't be able to tell.

Opinions vary and mine doesn't agree with you.

Put in whatever fantasy codes you like but those are a sop. A woman doesn't have to do this, they don't need to pass because they just are.

Don't come on this board and denigrate women. We won't stand for it.

No you don't.

I'm willing to accede men are worse at telling than women are, but most can still tell.

I once had a tw gently inform me they were trans, somehow completely convinced I had no idea. Of course I'd known from the first moment we'd met, I just hadn't mentioned it. The self delusion is very strong in many.

The hey look like what they are, men in drag. That isn’t what women look like.

Arguing about TW who pass and could mince in and out of the Ladies all day long is unfair on the TW who will never pass, though. A few TW do pass on a cursory glace and in bad lighting, but let's be honest, most don't. Most transmen dont pass either. It would be even more unfair to have 2 tiers of trans, based purely on looks and acting ability.

Men need to become less aggressive towards gender-non conforming men, in the toilets and everywhere else. Trans people of both sexes need to start thinking about whether they want third spaces, and what those are going to look like, and start lobbying properly for them. Everyone needs to stop saying shit like "sex is on a spectrum " and "trans people are the most vulnerable " and "the law has been changed".

So glad we are getting the ‘men make better women than you’ treatment. Always so enlightening/

@ChessorBuckaroo ’I know many transwomen who not only pass but they look better as women than many natural women.’

This is absolutely delusional, they never pass, women always know. Make up and wigs can’t hide man size feet and hands or Adam’s apples.

Men telling women that no only are they better than us because they are men, they are also better than us when they pretend to be women, the level of insecurity, entitlement and male privilege wrapped up in this statement is next level.

And it’s SO original isn’t it? I have NEVER heard this before have you? 🙄😂

Men cannot be better at being women than women. That's a category error (as well as being utterly ridiculous).

The problem is that the sta dares of education these days are through the floor.

They might pass with men, but less chance with women.