Trans people

[Mog65]

Firstly, I'm a trans ally

Everyone is up in arms about trans women. What seems to be forgotten these people are human beings. Where is humanity. You have probably been sharing toilets and coming into contact with trans women every day and have no idea. You only hear about the few bad ones. In a public toilet, you go into a cubical and pee. Its not like you're sat there in full public view with your knickers at your ankles.

What has been forgotten also, as many females are changing to. So trans men. So you're in hospital in a ward. The woman in the next bed, identifys as George, clit is now a penis fully working and you're in the next bed! Same person can wander around female only spaces as the law has changed. George can now only be searched by a female. By the way George a transgender man is a pervert! All hypothetical but nobody has brought this up.

Just a thought.

So, by your logic here, ovaries can be turned into testes if there is enough of a skilled surgeon.

It won't matter if the ovaries don't work like testes, they are made from the same tissue as an embryo, they just went through different pathways. And it doesn't matter if they work or not, because that doesn't matter.

So now an ovary is a teste.

Do you see how this works?

And if I post this and repost it, it makes it more credible right?

Didn't you once tell us that you had done years of scientific research into this topic?

OK I get it now. You all see trans women as no different to men. That is the main difference it seems. Whereas I don't lump them together and see one as a serious threat, and one as something different, small in numbers and facing lots of abuse.

I would re frame this question as

"Why should a woman be supposed to know, if she encounters a man in the toilets, if that man identifies as awoman or not?"

Its a bizarre publicisation of self labelled gender identity and an insistence that everyone around them agrees with this internalised labelling to the detriment of others' identities that I find so jarring.

& I genuinely could not care less who pees where, just leave me alone, do your business and get on with your day. That goes for everyone in the loos, men, women, transwomen, transmen, children or even well trained badgers.

Can you explain what you see the difference being between men and transwomen?

I don't think trans women are just men who have concocted an elaborate plan to abuse women by dressing up as them first 😂

So are you arguing for the abolition of single sex spaces entirely?

So what makes them a type of woman?

No not at all-I personally do not mind unisex toilets with cubicles though

No, we can’t. The TRA lobby has made that abundantly clear. Nothing short of total capitulation to their wants is acceptable, on pains of being denounced as a transphobic bigot.

The prefix of cis is also one many women find offensive.

Oh weird it's also here

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12473521/Retired-social-worker-quizzed-hate-crime-police-sticker-Stand-Trans-poster.html#article-12473521

Please tell us specifically what the differences are between the two groups of male people - the one you call 'men' and the one you say are not.

"one as something different, small in numbers and facing lots of abuse."

So, does this mean that any small group of male people who face lots of abuse are not 'men'? Because by your logic, there are many vulnerable groups of adult male people who are not 'men'.

If you cannot articulate the differences, why?

Wow you got it finally

I will check with my surgeon and get back to you on that. Not sure there would be room in my reorganised undercarriage what with my clitorpenis, defunct urethra, labia, vagina and bum. But if India W can get a cervix out of her surgery I don’t see why I couldn’t get a wrinkled old scrotum - if I wanted one. 😎

Yes they're all men but there is a difference. Trans women are a subset of men with much higher rates of sexual offences than men as a whole group.

Ok, thanks for clarifying.

Perhaps other women need this space to be single sex however? Like my friend who's a rape victim. Or orthodox religious women.

100% I was agreeing with you-sorry if that was not clear-the point I was making was why should women entering a single sex space be expected to know how any person internally identifies the gender-if it is a designated single sex space, it should absolutely be used only by that sex.

However, as a personal preference I do not mind unisex toilets.

I do, they are usually swimming in urine. Makes it very awkward when you are wearing wide legged trousers and have to keep the hems from trailing on the floor.

Ah sorry, fair enough

Well yes, perhaps I should have clarified clean unisex toilets.

🙂

But they don't exist. Do they Ted 🤔

A lot of women and men do have a problem with them though.
There’s a pub we have been going to for years that last year had a refurb and now the toilets are mixed gender (that’s the sign on the door) - since that change, the regular nights we always went to are about 30% emptier and the biggest reason given is because of the mixed toilets.

Neither the women or men want or feel comfortable using them and it is affecting the profits of the businesses who insist on having mixed sex facilities. Maybe the only way to show this isn’t what most people want is by hitting these places in their pockets.

I do have to say I feel very sorry for someone DH works with who would describe themselves as transsexual, not transgender. DH has been with the employer for about 12 years and this person "transitioned" before he arrived, the full surgery process. The agreement was made that they should use the female loos after returning to work since the surgery and this is the situation which has been ongoing, without incident or complaint, for over 12 years. The person is recognisable as a transwoman if only because of her height. But everyone calls her "she" and there aren't many people in the company who remember her as a man. She very much describes herself as a transwoman and accepts that she is different from women.

She has no time for the more recent trend of "I am a woman because I say I am" folks and feels their attention seeking and media courting has made life 100 times harder for people who were on this bandwagon even before it was a bandwagon to be on. Because people will assume she is about to harangue them about misgendering her. She just wants to get on quietly with her life, working in a job she's good at and has been doing for 20 years, not bothering anyone. She doesn't do sport, doesn't go up for women only clubs or awards, doesn't force a way into female only groups.

This ruling has meant that she can now be blocked from using the female loos which she has been using for 12 years plus at work and which nobody has objected to because she is not a woman - a fact she accepts and has always accepted. I am sure that individual cases will be considered and I wouldn't imagine she will stop using the female toilets at work unless someone objects.

I am very much in favour of the ruling and it is well overdue. But on the other hand I can see how it will affect this transwoman I know, who has proven for 12 years or more that they pose no threat to anyone and are not interested in accessing women's spaces apart from the work loos. Conflicted.

Ah so vulnerable. The male aggression and sense of entitlement in full force.

I agree that the genuine trans people who have coexisted peacefully are the ones most suffering. Most of us have never had an issue with these real people who want to just get on with their lives.

The problem is that the whole trans rights cause has been taken over by aggressive entitled men with a fetish who scream and shout and demand they are prioritised and that women need to budge over to accommodate their every whim otherwise be accused of being hateful transphobic far right bigots.