To think men should automatically pay on a first date if they asked you out?

[ThisSnappyNewt]

Had a date recently - he asked me out, picked the place, and at the end said “Shall we split it?” I did but it left a bad taste. I just think if you’re the one initiating the date and doing the inviting, you should offer to pay - man or woman but especially if you’re the guy. It sets a tone. AIBU to think it’s just good manners and a red flag if they don’t?

I do agree that the person asking for the date should pay the bill.

But I would also offer up my half and would also ensure the place we were going was in my budget. If the person asking for the date then asks for half I would pay, but not see them again. If they accepted my offer to pay half then I would. If they pay the full bill then I would be paying the second.

I’ll admit I do like a man to pay for a first date but it’s only a deal breaker if they ask and I don’t get a chance to offer.

I haven’t asked men out before, no, and in my experience, the men I’ve dated or been in relationships with have always paid and that worked for us. I personally prefer that dynamic. I don’t expect anything over the top but if someone’s asking me out, I do expect them to take the lead, including covering the first date.

Yes, they should. Nothing worse than a mean man.

That’s fair but I didn’t go into the date planning not to see him again. I went in open-minded. It was how things unfolded - especially the way he handled the bill - that made me realise we probably weren’t a match. So no, I wasn’t expecting a free meal but I do pay attention to how people show up and that moment showed me a lot.

Nothing worse than a freeloading woman. Which OP would have been doing as she wasn't planning a second date.

Can someone break down for me why the person doing the asking should be the one paying?

Isn't that a bit 'rent-a-human'?

It'd be one thing if being asked meant you were obliged to go out, but surely if you both show up to a date it's a mutual decision to go out and do something?

Well I wouldn't have asked.
I'd expect an offer though,
Says a lot about both of you TBH

Did he ask you out again?

If he didn't, that could be why he didn't want to foot entire bill, for someone he knew he wasn't going to see again.

When I was dating, I never went out for a second date for a woman who didn't at least offer to split the bill on the first date.

I never understood why some women feel they should be wined and dined by a man. I'm dating to find someone to share my life with, hopefully the woman is too. She's not doing me a favour by going out with me, why should I pay for her meal. I wouldn't do it for any other stranger.

I don‘t expect people to pay me for a date. So i pay for what i consume.
If someone is so repulsive to me that they need to give me something (food, money, …) to go out with them, I‘m in a position to not have to do that.
Its different if you’ve known someone for a while, as then gifts are based on actual liking each other. But for someone i don’t know well I wouldn’t expect money (or food) for a date.

This isn't the same thing. He asked her to go out with him. He chose the restaurant. He then asked her to split the bill. If he wanted to share the bill he should have discussed with her beforehand what they should do and where they should go - he had no idea what she could afford.

This old chestnut. And it IS old. It harks back to a time when women were less able to pay their own way.

I go Dutch because I see it as a sign of self-respect and respect for the person I’m dining with. Why should either party fund someone else’s dinner, particularly when you don’t know if it is going to result in a longer term situation? It would feel a bit like an almost stranger was buying my time which is gross. Plus demonstrating at the start of a potential relationship that you are someone who shares things is a fairly big green flag isn’t it?

You’re equals, so start with a level playing field and both contribute. Pay your own way.

Edited to add @natura - yes, rent-a-human, exactly.

Or she could have had that conversation. I would have, because I would have been splitting the bill.

I get where you’re coming from but for me it’s not about “renting a human” or anyone being obliged. It’s about the energy someone brings to a situation. If you ask someone out and plan a date, offering to pay is a gesture of thoughtfulness and initiative - it shows you’re genuinely interested and taking the lead.

It’s not about obligation - just the dynamic. Plenty of people are happy with 50/50 but that’s not the tone I’m used to or personally prefer in dating.

but especially if you're the guy

You've given away your true attitude there. You want men to pay for you.

So the man should do the asking, the planning and the paying so what should the woman do open her legs

@ImmortalSnowman Wise up, gold digger? You’re so funny!
Yes, I’d expect a man to pay for first date, old fashioned or not, if he didn’t, no more dates.

But if it’s about “energy” and wanting to show that you’re thoughtful and intuitive and genuinely interested, surely that translates to doing your fair share of the asking out and therefore your fair share of the paying? Most good men also want thoughtful, intuitive, genuine partners who bring the right energy to a date - and those that don’t aren’t the ones you want to be dating. If that’s what you’re looking for from a partner, you need to be prepared to bring the same yourself, or you’ll only end up with the men who think paying for some dinners is their bit - and who later in the relationship think that everything else is your job because they do the money bit.

How many MN Relationships threads are started by women who feel taken for granted because their OH lumbers them with all the shitwork because he earns most of the money and thinks that all he needs to contribute? Financial inequality starts right from the beginning, when the tone for that is set.

I like when a guy pays but I don’t expect him to.

I know it’s an old sexist hangover - also I tend to outearn men in general so it would be an odd expectation. But you get indoctrinated with the chivalry. In general I do like to see a guy “make effort” if he is showing an interest in me, but that is not about paying for a date.

That said, during my years dating in the UK I almost never had a guy who wanted to split the bill. Only one man took me up on it (not including when I was a student) and only on the first date. Every date after that he refused to let me pay.

No, he didn’t ask me out again but I was open to seeing how it went. It wasn’t a hard no going in. It was just that, by the end of the date - including how he handled things like the bill - the vibe felt off. So if he also wasn’t interested, fair enough, but it still felt a bit underwhelming overall.

Mutual decision to go out on a date? How does that work?

It’s not a “red flag” if they don’t.

It just means they may not be right for you. And that’s fine.

I would always split on a first date, so would share the decision on where to go too.
Don’t want to feel there is any obligation either way when you don’t yet know someone.

Quite easily.

I would agree.