He wants to move back to his country - decision making.

[Stanwyck]

I’m in my early 30s and been talking about getting married/having kids etc. We live in the UK and he recently said he’s open to living here for the foreseeable. He is from Denmark originally.

But out of nowhere today he sat me down and said he’s been seriously thinking about it and he wants to return to Denmark within the next decade. He loves me but finds it hard to imagine long term in the UK.

In this country, I have my parents and other family, my best friends and my community. However I do love this man and he’s the only man I’ve wanted kids with. I see myself being with him in 20-30 years time.

Also during this conversation he gave me a beautiful ring and a handwritten poem but didn’t propose. So I view it as a promise ring but a bit strange.

The main issue for me is that I am an only child. When I think about leaving my ageing parents to go it alone, I find that hard. He has a brother who lives near his parents.

I could do with some advice on how to decide whether it is worthwhile/making a decision about the future.

My DH is Norwegian, and we'll be moving to live there within the next two years. Been together 11 years, two kids.

The decision was made to move back to Norway by both of us once I'd visited many, many times. Like 5 years in. He'd always wanted to go back, I knew that, but he was equally happy to stay in the UK if that's what it would have taken. As it happens, I love Norway and we've been spending huge chunks of the year there for the past ten years so it's a comfortable thing for me. I don't think I'd have just wanted to leave early in the relationship, though.

It also won't impact my job in any way. I WFH and don't need to be in the office. Can easily travel for monthly meetings which I do now anyway. Back then, I was early in my career and it was a joint decision to remain in the UK until I was senior and flexible.

I think you need to consider this really deeply. It could be wonderful but it could also be the complete opposite.

I'm also an author outside of my day job. Hi! 😁

I guess as you know from your list, it's about more than the job though. Some kind of compromise could be a few years there and then move again.

@Sweetleftfood I would agree about the friendships aspect having lived in Copenhagen- also far more Danes tend to stay in the big cities and suburbs if they grew up there from what I could see - lots still had most of their relatives in Copenhagen, plus old school friends and Uni friends.

Live for yourself. Not for your parents. They've had their life.

I live in a different country to my very old mother. She encouraged me to go as she wanted me to live my life.

I was guilt tripped by some of my aunties. Who told me that I should be at home looking after my mum. However I stood up to the pressure and I moved abroad. And I'm very happy that I did.

My mum is old (78) and lives alone. She is fine. When she needs more care she'll go into a nursing home. I go home and visit her

Live your life for you.

I know you love him and he looks like a good prospect, but honestly, is he? You met in Scotland, he told you he would consider staying there for good, and now when you were probably expecting a proposal, he comes to you and out of the blue tells you that he wants to move back home, and it does not look like it is negotiable. Now you are here deliberating whether or not you should do something you never even though about doing, you never wanted to do, so that you can be with a man who you believe is your soul mate. Well, how about this, if he was your soulmate, he would not put you in this impossible situation in the first place. I strong believe that leaving is not a good idea OP.

This is ridiculous, if he was her soulmate he wouldn’t want to move home? Surely the reverse is true for the OP? If he was her soulmate she would move for him.

The reality is neither is right and neither is wrong. He has got to an age where he’s considering his future and what he wants from life. Every reason OP has for staying is equally his pull to move home. One is not more valid than the other.

When you speak to him, you need to foreground this. He may not have taken on board the fact that you truly love him that deeply, which may be why he is dithering about commitment to Scotland. I know it seems daft, but sometimes you have to be very explicit with men as to how you feel - my DH has to be told because in the daily grind of kids, work etc, he sometimes feels forgotten or low priority. I have to make the point of telling him - not in passing, but as a conscious, focused act - how much I and the kids love him, as he really doesn’t ‘absorb’ that from general day to day activity.

I don't think talking about this is an issue. Sounds like a good time to have this conversation before they get married and have kids. I'm not saying that trailing spouses life is easy or something op should do. I'm saying that I don't really see anything wrong with him asking about it if he's career is the type of career that it is common.

Absolutely ridiculous. It goes both ways then, don’t you think?

Neither of them are wrong.

@cheezuz and @Sofiewoo no, I do not agree. They are not in the same position. OP met her bf in Scotland and he made her believe that he did not want to move back home. Now, out of the blue he practically gives her an ultimatum. How is that the same?

They aren’t per se but when you move to another country and meet someone local to that country, I do think the onus is on you to be 100% clear from the very start if you think you will stay or you eventually want to go back. The OP has never given any indication to him she wanted to move and by all accounts until very recently he has made it clear he was staying. He has, quite abruptly, changed his mind, which I accept he’s allowed to do but she is now collateral damage as she’s potentially wasted her time on a relationship which now might not go anywhere unless she uproots her life. I think that is quite unfair and put her in the most awful of predicaments.

Some people want to live abroad and some do not and those who do not, never "get used to it". This is something most of us (I gather some do) cannot rationalize. The fact that another country may be offering better quality of life does not mean you would not long for your family, parents, friends, language and culture. It simply does not work that way.

I never wanted to leave my home-country (not UK), but had to flee because of the war. I have lived abroad for 30 years now, got married, had three kids but never stopped longing for home. The scenery, the scents, the sounds of home always make me cry. Also, I missed my parents so much and will never forgive myself for not being there when they needed me the most. And it is not just about me caring for them, but me and my kids spending time with them. These things are priceless... to me, but I realize it is not same for everyone.

If he's only been back home for holidays then perhaps he has an unrealistic view of what things would be like to actually live there again. I think this is pretty common in the expat community.

I'm any case, it seems to essentially come down to this situation:
You got into a relationship with someone who was based in the same country and seemed happy there.
He now thinks he wants to move abroad.
You're considering sacrificing a lot to keep the relationship - giving him the thing he says he wants, without any certainty that it'll suit you.
He's considering going alone if you don't go with him?
And then what if it's not all he expected and he wants to uproot you again?

You could tell him to look into it himself - he needs to do this on his own - find a job, home, work out the finances. Maybe go there for a set period to see if he actually enjoys it. Once he's done that and can show you that the sums work, you'll consider it.

I think you'll end up resenting him if you move. Moving country is always going to bring challenges and if you're doing it for someone else not yourself you're going to struggle to settle and be happy there.

Also OP sounds like she is thriving: she has a job and two creative side interests, a community she enjoys being a part of, friends and family. What are the actual odds that she'll be able to rebuild that one to one in Denmark? Let's be real. Presumably, her DP knows that and must love that for her, however he is willing to consider being responsible for her giving all of that up to start from zero. It would be worse for her than it was for him because I bet his level of English was good when he moved to the UK whereas she'd have to learn his language from scratch (and it's not an easy one either). The best reason he can come up with is some impersonal stat about child poverty. If that bothers him, he should get involved with charities and/or politics rather than throw figures at OP's head and prompt her to be miserable because the relationship she thought was safe is now all up in the air. I think it's also very revealing that she was immediately worried about hurting and losing him whereas he didn't hesitate to put her into this horrible emotional state. I don't know him and I might be unfair but this is a red flag; he might be one of those 'fake nice' people: lovely on the surface but scratch a little and you find an opinionated & selfish core.

As for which country is 'better' - look at the US, look at all the countries being thrown into disarray once dickheads get into power, look at pandemics, wars etc. No one knows what's around the corner. A country that's thriving one minute might end up under attack of various kinds the next. Who knows who might be in power in either country in 10-20 years time? Who knows what prosperity will look like? There are so many unknowns in this day and age that going by the better 'prospects' right now feels a tad naive.

I lived in mainland Europe for 12 years and met so many women who had children with locals and all regretted settling there.
They got on with life, cared for their husbands but without exception all said they would not do it again.
They have good lives there, comfortable MC lives and have friends, work etc.

But they said the longer it goes on the stronger they feel it, being an outsider.

Obviously their children don't feel that and their husbands have family, relatives, life long friends around them.

None of the husbands will move, so they remain stuck.

Not a chance in hell I would do it.

Move for a year if you want to try it out, but get stuck their with a child unable to leave? Madness

You are handing over control of your life to someone else by having children with them in a foreign country.
Madness IMO.

Yes this is very true but you also have plenty of people (like OP's partner) who move here and meet someone British and then feel equally stuck. This is the situation OP's partner is in and this is the situation my DH is in. Everything you say about women who've moved abroad, regret their decision and feel like outsiders applies to the people who move here and fall in love.
It's easy to say "Well they shouldn't get involved with a British person if they don't want to stay here!" but feelings aren't black and white like that. Life is messy and complicated, especially when you fall in love.
My DH came here as a student and fully intended to return to his country after he'd finished his studies. However, he met me and fell in love and I've always refused to move. So it's DH who's stuck here, feeling like an outsider (especially in recent years as the UK has become more xenophobic and racism has increased. He now feels pretty uncomfortable here at times).
He is not wrong to feel like this. He's not a bad person for falling in love with me. I'm not wrong for wanting to stay here and raise our family here. It's just a sad situation. My brother's have both married Europeans too and their partners have an equally strong yearning to return to their countries and my brothers are determined to stay here.
What I'm saying is that no one is wrong to feel how they feel. Anyone who gets involved with a foreign person should be aware that these issues and feelings will inevitably arise. You will very often end up with one person who's deeply unhappy about where they're living - and that's shit.

I would say as one half of an international couple that this kind of thing is quite common. It’s very hard for lots of people to permanently move to another country and in international couples at least one has to make the sacrifice. Having children often concentrates people’s minds as often you want your children to have the same upbringing you did as well as the same cultural touchpoints etc….

There’s no getting around it and someone - either you or DP - is going to have to give something up if you want to stay together long term. It’s an unfortunate fact of life with international couples and I’ve seen it be the source of friction for so many couples. In reality there is unlikely to be a middle ground that makes you both happy, so you will need to decide what to do. My take based on the length of your relationship and your complete unfamiliarity with Denmark is that it’s a big ask for you to move but I also think your DP sounds like he will not be happy to stay in Scotland long term so this may be a dealbreaker for you both.

@kersh33 you're spot on. He got to the point of proposing and realised he couldn't face never moving back.
OP conversely just presumed he'd stay in the UK which is maybe a lack of foresight.

Ah, I really feel for you — I’m also in an international couple and an only child, so I totally get where you’re coming from. I had a similar situation early on with my now-husband. About six months into the relationship, I told him I couldn’t see myself living in his country (where we met) forever, and that long term, I’d want to move back home to be closer to my parents.

Thankfully, he completely understood and was on board. We’ve since moved to my home country and are really happy here. It wasn’t an easy thing to bring up, but I’m so glad we had that conversation early — it saved a lot of stress and “what ifs” later down the line.

As hard as it is, it is great that you’re having these big conversations now. I know how hard it is to even think about being far from ageing parents, especially as an only child. You’re definitely not alone in feeling torn.

Sending lots of love — these decisions are so hard, but being honest with yourself and each other is the best place to start.

@Commonsense22 to be fair he told me last month he sees himself in the UK at least for the next 10 years due to his job.

So unless he plans to pack in his amazing career just to go back before then, there’s every chance we break up based on a future fantasy of his that may or may not happen, and then he stays anyway.

He chose to have his career here.

Huh? Does he understand that staying in the UK for the next ten years, and moving back to Denmark to have children, and having children with you, are not compatible? You'll be 43 in ten years' time. Nobody who is serious about wanting children starts TTC when the woman is 43.

I think you need to have a serious conversation about whether he actually wants to have a future with you at all. Because this sounds like not only is he set on moving back to Denmark eventually, he's in absolutely no rush to have children with you. But at 33 you need to start moving in that direction pretty soon.

Take Denmark out of the equation for a minute. What is his timeline for having kids, and what is yours?

If your timelines don't match up then the question of Denmark is irrelevant because you should be looking to move on and meet someone else anyway.

@StandFirm is right.

I am thriving where I live now. I have great hobbies, job, family and friends. It took 5 years for me to build these up (after moving back from abroad myself). He is a huge part of the happiness in my life.

The other option is moving to another country and I might also have a great life there. But that would be unknown. He told me Danish is very hard to learn. I have visions of him, any kids and their grandparents all chatting fluently while I sit in the corner stuck and wishing I never left.

Or I might love Denmark and feel happy there.

I just don’t know. I want to give the best relationship of my life a chance, but I also don’t want to waste more time.

Part of me thinks if he loved me enough, he would prioritise the life he has here with me.

@MissScarletInTheBallroom we spoke about this at the weekend.

He asked when I wanted to have kids. I said in the next 2-3 years. He said without hesitation that’s fine with him.

I then said I don’t want to be waiting til very late 30s and he said he understood. Therefore I said I would want to have a kid here and possibly move to Denmark later. I think this is the bottom line.

he hasn’t yet said yes. I worry that he might agree now and change his mind in 2 years. Then I might have no chance at kids ever.