Why does no one like me?

[Avotoast9]

Name changed for this.
Please be honest, I've got a thick skin.

I don't know where I'm going wrong. I don't have very many close friends at all. I think most people see me as a bit pretentious and possibly too intense. I don't think of my self like that at all. I've always struggled to make friends within my age group. My closest friends have always been older and I've NEVER been part of the in-group or had lots of girl friends. I can't remember ever arguing with anyone or falling out over anything specific. I guess I just fall out of touch with people. Sometimes I wonder if my defenses rub people up the wrong way. One thing I would like people to know about me (but I don't always get a chance to show) is that I am fiercely loyal. I would change my plans in a heartbeat to support a friend if ever they needed me.

So yeah, ask me anything. Why in your opinion am I rubbing people up the wrong way. I don't have a problem making friends initially but they never really go anywhere. Is that normal or should I take a long hard look at myself?

If you got this far, thanks ☺️

Same line of work but the relative was higher up the food chain. I wouldn't have mentioned her at all only the acquaintance directly asked about her but then got frosty! And I literally just answered the question asked it certainly wasn't gloating or anything 🤷‍♀️

I’m autistic with ADHD and could have written your post. People exhaust me. I love being sociable but I know when I’ve had enough. I’m terrible at small talk, don’t see the point, and I talk about myself because that’s what I know. My friendships have always been quite transient really and I’m ok with that.

There I go again, talking about me! What do you feel that you’re missing?

That is appallingly rude of them, apart from anything else. Terrible manners. It's quite bewildering.

I love to give compliments to strangers, you know if someone has great shoes/jacket/hair, whatever. That will often be as far as the interaction goes but it makes me feel good, and hopefully gives them a boost too.

Me too. Though it’s only as I’ve got older I’ve felt confident enough to do this. ❤️ If you think something nice, just say it, is my motto.

I talk about myself because that’s what I know.

But... we generally ask questions of others to learn about them. Focussing on talking about yourself as that's what you know sounds very insular and lacking in curiosity. Neither of which encourage connection or friendship.

Yes. Other people can be so interesting. Even the dullest person almost always has some kernel of something fascinating, or strange, about them, or some story.

Inverted snobbery is rife I’m afraid. What you’ve just described reflects badly on the other person, not you

I’ve noticed I have a couple of friends who, when I try and turn the conversation back to asking about them, they seem reticent to talk about themselves too much and turn it back around again

That's interesting. I hate talking about myself but it seems other people do too! In some contexts, (for example a group of mums meeting for the first time and getting to know each other), I've felt like I'm under interrogation. I always feel I've said too much but not because I volunteered the info. My philosophy has always been, if you ask a direct question I will give you and answer but that's not worked out so well recently - probably something I should work on 😅 "where's the dad?", "oh so you're a single mum?", "do you have any family support", "it must be really hard financially without a second income. When are you going back to work?".
I try and dodge the questions or flip the conversation but at that point I usually want to run. It sometimes seems like they are trying to suss out whether I am friend material and then get rejected 🤦That's been the case with many of the muns I've met at the baby and toddler groups, bar maybe three or four who Im still on friendly terms with.

That said, I think this thread has helped me see that it's probably not that people don't like me so much as I'm just not on their radar, or that I am simply less important to them as they are to me. I don't know whether that's a good thing or bad thing tbh 😅

(Re-reading my post because autocorrect is changing mums to nuns, apologies if I missed one!)

But that’s how my autistic brain works. I do try to remember to ask questions about others. I also seem to be drawn to other NDs so we “get it” and are similar in conversation styles.

Well, if you habitually don’t talk about yourself, and always boomerang the conversational focus back onto the other person, then of course you’re not on their radar, because you haven’t let them know you. There’s nothing to get a purchase on. The questions you list in this post don’t sound particularly interesting or well-intentioned, though, and I can see why you found them intrusive. But presumably that’s not every conversation, in every group, though?

If I were auditioning as a friend, I wouldn’t have the remotest interest in whether you were in a relationship with your baby’s father or your income/s, I’d be thinking ‘Do I find this person’s conversation interesting, and would I like to talk to her again?’ But if you weren’t really saying anything, I’d move on.

You are a tough cookie! I look for humour, a sense of adventure and fun and shared interests like current affairs, cultural interests, travel and books. Feeling like I had to pass an invisible IQ test / conversationalist checklist would feel like a job interview and quite intimidating - so I’d move on for a different reason!!! 😂

But we all have to adjust to other people, be they NT or ND. I have to remember not to use any kind of figurative language around my autistic godson, as he finds it unnerving, also not to touch him, ever, even very slightly to draw his attention to something. I have to remember strategies to try to derail my ND father when he monologues for 20 minutes at total strangers, under the impression that because they have the same GP, they will want to hear about his recent medical treatments. I have to bear in mind that a friend with a history of severe anorexia will find some types of settings for eating harder than others. That another friend is feeling vulnerable because of a professional complained brought against her by a client.

They generally make reciprocal adjustments for my needs.

I read a comment upthread about a willingness to make small talk and people who find it difficult saying they don't care for it.

I don't either but I do understand why it's necessary. Most people aren't going to go straight into the heavy serious stuff without a bit of small talk to get things going.

I'm not averse to it, I'm just really bad at it! I just don't know what to say. Once the initial exchange is over, I just find myself wracking my brains to think of anything to say at all.

How are you?

I'm OK thanks. You?

Yeah, I'm good too, thanks.

Where do you go after that?

I can ask how someone is if they've been unwell. I can ask how a job interview etc went. I can ask if they enjoyed their holiday. But I've no idea what to say in follow up to any of their responses other than well done/sorry to hear that/that sounds lovely/I'm glad you had a good time... I really, really try, but I've got nothing!

My finest recent moment was hearing two people outside a pub talking about a subject I had an interest in and knowledge of. In an attempt to 'be friendly', I walked up to them and said, "This sounds like a conversation I'd like to be part of," and just joined in. Thankfully, they were very receptive and we had a good conversation (although I think I might have taken it to a deeper level than they were planning to have outside a pub on a Saturday evening 🙈

I didn't even realise it was an odd thing to do until my partner pointed it out afterwards. They were just having a really interesting chat!

I'm not trying to be a dick...

Sounds like you are neurodivergent, OP. There are a lot of undiagnosed ND women out there whose experience mirrors yours. Find other autistic people, they will be your lower stress crew.

Have you done a Myers Briggs personality type test? I would be interested to know what it came back as. It might give you some insight.

I'm quite an introvert and to be honest I don't really crave to be around others, I need to remind myself to get in touch with friends, otherwise I wouldn't, and I don't meet up with them as often as the rest of the friend group does, they kind of just accept it about me.

The close friend you speak to almost daily op… what do you chat about? And do you doubt she likes you?

My finest recent moment was hearing two people outside a pub talking about a subject I had an interest in and knowledge of. In an attempt to 'be friendly', I walked up to them and said, "This sounds like a conversation I'd like to be part of," and just joined in

@AutisticHouseMove had you gone to the pub with a friend? Or alone? Were these people complete strangers?

Anyone else just cringed at this?

I can't think of anyone I know who would have been delighted to have someone joining in like that. Sure they'll have been polite, but I suspect most people would feel that was intrusive rather than friendly.

Friendly would be passing a comment and seeing if they drew you into the conversation. What that is was announcing they're joining the conversation without giving them a chance to say no.
My bil does this sort of thing. He thinks people are delighted to hear his opinions and that he joined in. I can tell you that the people are not, and are desperate to extract themselves.

Why I asked @AutisticHouseMove was that she was presumably at the pub with friends. So channelling her energy in to making small talk with the people she went to the pub with would have been better spent nurturing existing relationships if they’re generally a bit thin on the ground

Modernskylines

It's a pub I've been to a few times. It's not really somewhere I'd make friends (they're into quite a specific 'scene' and tend to stick within that for friendships) but I know a few people to say hello to.

My partner was inside chatting to the landlord. I went outside for some fresh air. I went back inside again afterwards.

As for the people, I vaguely know one of the men to say hello to. He was talking to a woman. They didn't already know each other.

The inserting yourself into a conversation thing is something I'm not sure about. I remember during my own lonely period I'd always get people telling me I need to approach people and start conversations. I kind of agreed with the logic that if most people don't like people doing this then how could that be good advice?

If you've got a thick skin and don't mind it going badly most of the time it's probably worth it for the odd occasion that it's well received. I suspect some people can pull it off better than others, I mostly anticipated wide eyed horror myself as I'm not very charming.

I don't doubt she likes me. I mean you wouldn't talk to someone every day if you didn't like them I shouldn't think. I think she likes the fact she can relax and just be herself around me (and vice versa!).

We talk about everything under the sun. Daily updates about what's happening in both of our lives, we bounce ideas off each other, brainstorm for creative projects, chat about new stories, help decide wardrobe choices. Whatever is on our mind that day. If someone has something important to say they get the airwaves for that conversation. It's wholesome and natural. I think it works well because of the distance and because we've both had to work to keep it alive (or rather we have both leaned on each other at different points in our lives).

Love your username 😂😂