Why does no one like me?

[Avotoast9]

Name changed for this.
Please be honest, I've got a thick skin.

I don't know where I'm going wrong. I don't have very many close friends at all. I think most people see me as a bit pretentious and possibly too intense. I don't think of my self like that at all. I've always struggled to make friends within my age group. My closest friends have always been older and I've NEVER been part of the in-group or had lots of girl friends. I can't remember ever arguing with anyone or falling out over anything specific. I guess I just fall out of touch with people. Sometimes I wonder if my defenses rub people up the wrong way. One thing I would like people to know about me (but I don't always get a chance to show) is that I am fiercely loyal. I would change my plans in a heartbeat to support a friend if ever they needed me.

So yeah, ask me anything. Why in your opinion am I rubbing people up the wrong way. I don't have a problem making friends initially but they never really go anywhere. Is that normal or should I take a long hard look at myself?

If you got this far, thanks ☺️

Fair point 🙂
I notice that post has been deleted now anyway 😂

I avoid over sharers which you admit to being. it can have many roots either anxiety or an eagerness to please or be ingratiated very quickly and possibly depending on the story them wanting me to feel sorry for them. It also make me feel as if they are bad at keeping counsel why would I share anything with someone who blurts things out. It can also make me feel as if they are a little bit daft as knowledge is very useful, you tell me stuff about yourself without knowing me what if I was the sort to use it against you?

I retired early, all my friends locally to me are still working. So I joined 2 voluntary organisations, tried various walking groups and some other classes as I waited for DH to also retire. I met a lot of new people there were a couple of women whilst not unpleasant revealed on first meeting deeply personal information about finances, romances and estranged stepchildren. I actually said you really shouldn’t share that information with a complete stranger, it was just horribly uncomfortable.

Hmm friendships take work. I had a lot more friends when younger than I do now, but always felt on the outside, and was never part of a core group.

I found out that I'm autistic a couple of years back and realised that I'd been heavily masking to fit in and be accepted.

These days I have a few individual friends & I see them as and when. It can be a bit lonely but to be honest I have never understood the rules of friendship and am quite exhausted from socialising.

I think I come across as pretty pleasant & when you get to know me I'm funny, good company and extremely loyal, however I am no-one's number 1.

I spent a good while trying to analyse it all and have felt quite hurt, but the older I get the more I realise I just want a peaceful life free of drama. If I reach out to someone and they don't reciprocate then I just leave it. Quite a few previous friends/ acquaintances have dropped away since I stopped being the one that reached out.

Ok, maybe “average” person doesn’t sit right with everyone.

Sure, no one is average but there is “mainstream/ typical/acceptable” vs “not” - and I’m trying to find the word that describes when you are “not”.

I say this as someone that has struggled socially in pretty much all settings - and I’ve noticed that there is a “majority” and a “mainstream” and then there are those of us that are a minority and don’t quite fit in.

Like it or not, it exists - the question is whether you fit into the mainstream culture. And this will change depending on the setting you are in - which is why subcultures are a lifeline for some people.

So I guess what I meant is maybe OP doesn’t fit into the mainstream. Because I certainly dont. And I say this as someone that struggled throughout primary, secondary school and noticed that there is a “social code” - a majority can act in this code, and there are few of us that don’t know how to or struggle to. I guess it’s like the ND v NT - NT is probably used to describe the majority at the moment, and there are a pool of ND people with different needs, who for now are the minority.

I’ll add not fitting in for me did cause lots of insecurities. My best friend when I was young was the most social person I’ve ever known, she made friends everywhere and absolutly everyone appeared to like her - and I noticed people like her got further at work, at school, had more friends etc - as we got older I realised that we are just different but she is more “palatable” - and there are lots of people that are more “palatable” in mainstream settings - whereas some of us just don’t fit in. And so I say this as someone that does not feel like the average person.

But there is an average. There is a reason why we say “the average Joe Bloggs”

In the west the average person goes to work, has friends, has 2.3kids, has a home, has x number of holidays … I’m sure statistics will tell you more - but we aren’t all special or different - being average isn’t always a bad thing - depending on the context,

I moved with a baby and a toddler and it was really tough! Everyone had made friends at the pregnancy nct stage or were old friends from school. Wait until your daughter goes to primary, we've made lots of lovely friends and my best "local" friend was met that way (to the point we holiday together, see each other most days etc).
Interestingly you talk about friends slightly objectively, as in "I want more/they don't want to be my friend" but not as in "I want to hang out with people who have similar values, or who are interested in the same things as me, or who have a similar hobby" - it does sound a tiny bit like you don't care too much who they are, which may make you appear desperate (particularly if you're a slightly intense person) and not many people are attracted to that. Sorry if that's not true, but I'd suggest (tricky with a toddler) that you try and meet people who are going to want to discuss similar things and go with you to the things you want to do (maybe an exercise class, art gallery, book club - whatever you're into!) It's a better base for friendship and it might make conversation flow better, plus it's less effort staying in touch as you want to do the same things.

Average isn’t a disparaging term, or it shouldn’t be. There’s nothing wrong with being average.

No. Because it was unnecessary to quote when I had copied and pasted. Making a conscious effort to keep your mouth shut suggests that it is the opposite which is instinctive, ergo OP likely talks about herself a lot. She asked for honest thoughts; why are you more defensive for her than she is?

I never take comments like that seriously, to be honest - it usually just means it’s not your crowd.

Couple of thoughts....

Firstly, I think single parenthood is really hard. I think being in a couple is often much easier for making friends. People in couples like hanging out with other couples quite often.

I agree with others that keeping friendships going takes effort. Even if it's texts only, they need sustaining.

I have let people go because they're so busy and I can't seem to fit in with their lives. I'm no where near a priority to them. I would still think of them as friends. I have good feelings towards them all. I just know they're not in the same place as when I met them. It's not that I did anything wrong or they did. We just drifted.

I know several people who became much more family orientated during covid and now don't really see friends just do family stuff. As I'm a single mum, I'm not on their radar.

I have learned to be ok with my own company.

Finally, there is nothing wrong with you. If other people don't like you, it's their business and their issue. You cannot mould yourself into something acceptable to everyone. I can recommend an amazing book. The courage to be disliked.

I don't even think you are disliked. The truth is usually duller. That people are pretty self centered and don't really feel that strongly about you.

Ask yourself what it is you want. Do you want to see your existing friends more? Do you want more friends? Or do you just want to get rid of a nagging worry that there's something you're doing wrong?

Maybe it's all. There's things you can do to go forwards with all these thoughts but what you must do is be true to yourself. The most important person you need to like you is you !

Without knowing you it would be hard to pinpoint.
It could be others being cliquey, but if you’re recognising you could be too intense, maybe you could be a personality that is and shys others away. Or could it be you expect others to make the social gatherings etc and maybe effort on your part is fleeting?
it can be normal to make friends but the long term friendship never quite takes off. But you would hope every now and them come to fruition.
consider practising gentle calm questions and sit and listen to people and be interested in what they have to say.

sometimes friendships take time, people assume having babies helps, but I’ve heard walking dogs is far more beneficial to making friends!

things like volunteering in local shops or litter pickers, walking groups etc are all good ways to meet people.

I agree and some people do superficial better than others!

This is really interesting and spoke to me.

I also struggle to make friends though I know people don’t dislike me - as in I’m friendly, polite, helpful.

I fit the description of your friend as I know I’m inauthentic, except when I’m very very comfortable with someone. (Not even with my parents!)

When I can totally be myself then I can have a real relationship (just with my husband and my very best friend I’ve known since a baby.

The problem is that I feel it’s impossible for me to drop the mask with anyone else. I have a block about it - I just can’t.

I’ve made my peace with it as I’m happy now and I have accepted myself, but I feel sad sometimes for my younger self who found the no friends situation really hard.

@Stairsdown I didn't say I have "no friends" in the thread title, not sure what you mean? I found this thread very helpful. It's helped put things in perspective and given me lots to think about.

@Avotoast9 might not be your thing but I think Bumble does like a dating app but to meet new friends. I am thinking of signing up myself actually. If I do, I can report back if you like?

The problem with talking about friends is that you have this one word to use that actually means several different things. Of course it makes a difference if you only have distance friends or those people some consider to be friends despite several years of no contact.

In fairness, many people on Mn appear to define ‘friend’ as ‘someone I know but dislike, and who seldom behaves nicely to me’.

Same here although I have no idea where to start in getting diagnosed

You do have the word "frenemy" for that one at least. I'd like to see a word for the person-I-still-consider-a-friend-despite-lack-of-any-meaningful-interaction.