To suspect the "deal" between the US and Russia Greenland for Ukraine?

[FancyRedRobin]

The way things are shaping up I'm beginning to think the USAs negotiations with Putin were for USA to stand aside and let Putin have part of Ukraine and for Russia to support the US to take Greenland.

Yes, that's many magnitudes more likely.

I'd put the odds of interactions with alien civilizations as significantly lower than a zombie apocalypse.

I don't think people, like the pp, should be viewing stuff like Star Trek as a vaguely plausible prediction of what the future might look like, but it seems to be informing their political views.

and yet we have celebs endorsing political candidates and they have no true understanding of that politicians policies etc and the public then trust the cleb, so many ways no different

no you get ruled by them instead if they win

More fool anyone believing what a celebrity says. Their mistake.

Do you think Ukraine should give Putin what he wants?

What is it with posters who don't use capital letters and punctuations marks, they seem to pop up on quite a few threads 🤔

You think that people being influenced by the political views of other people (however ill thought out, and regardlessof whether their social standing gives their opinions undue weigh) is comparable to basing your politics on thinking Star Trek might happen? That's....erm....quite a take!

And I don't think people listening to celebrities (yes, even Donald Trump and Elon Musk) is an issue of any real significance when compared to the influence of the mega rich generally (whether via the media, or their influence on political parties).

How would your one world government stop this anyway? Banning "celebrities" somehow? Banning elections/democracy generally?

Honestly, this is all just so very stupid.

You resist. Half of the Canadians polled said they were personally prepared to defend Canada. I believe them.

And the UK would be compelled to be at war with the US in those circumstances, because they’re in the Commonwealth. Quite apart from Canada being a member of NATO. No one could ever have predicted that the UK and the US being at war!

Trump is supposedly a fan of the Royal Family, and was angling for a state visit with the King. I doubt the visit will be a comfortable one, with the King being the Head of State of Canada.

The UK has no obligation to defend Commonwealth countries, and NATO won't provide military assistance either (without the US, it simply does not have the means). Sanctions are the best they could offer.

Article Five of the treaty states that if an armed attack occurs against one of the member states, it should be considered an attack against all members, and other members shall assist the attacked member, with armed forces if necessary.

I know, but it won't happen.

And even if they tried to provide assistance, it would prove entirely ineffective.

The other NATO members would hugely struggle to hold off Russia, without active US involvement.

Most European-owned military hardware was purchased from the US, and most of it could be "bricked" by the US (as it only functions with continued US software support).

The nuclear threat from the US is also far more pronounced than it is from Russia, and there's the logistical issue of the Atlantic.

If Europe attempted to go to war with the US, it'd be a swift end to the continent, either at the hands of the US, Russia, or a combination of both.

It is simply not going to happen, no matter what Article 5 says.

So you’d give Canada up to the Americans if they invaded?

Me personally? No - I'm in Canada and, despite being an immigrant from Europe, I'd participate in its defence at the cost of my life if needed.

Europe? Unfortunately, yes, it would leave Canada to be invaded. While I'm sure they'd hate to do so, they simply do not have the means to assist, and a fool hearted attempt to assist (were it to happen) would amount to Europe sacrificing itself, for no benefit to itself and, ultimately, no material benefit to Canada or its people.

If America invades Canada, then public opinion in Britain will prevail and the country would go to Canadas aid. That would cut through the way other things don't.

Uk against the might of Usa, nah tickles to that

Yes, you’re probably right, sadly. And sanctions wouldn’t be very effective either. Apart from the shame factor for Trump, who would very likely lose a lot of support in the US.

Eggs!

Maybe, I really hope we never find ourselves in that position, but then I never expected to be even debating about this.

Where do you live? I’m assuming a red state?

think across the pond

me too

And in practice, what would that look like?

Obviously, it would require use of the UK's airforce, which is about 10% of the size of the US's and not as sophisticated. On top of that, about a third of the UK's airforce (including most its more powerful aircraft) can essentially be switched off by the US.

The naval situation may be marginally better, on paper, but would be of less practical use.

Then there's the fact that most aspects of British life (to the extent they involve computing, either at point of use or back-end admin) rely on American software to some extent or another, leaving the UK extremely vulnerable to US cyber warfare. Banks, hospitals, telecommunications, energy, etc, etc, all disabled.

And even if the UK overcame all that an pushed on regardless, the US could completely level the UK, through a nuclear attack, in less than an hour.

To add, the US would be able to destroy the UK in less than half the time it would take the fastest UK-owned fighter jet to reach the US.

The US would be far less likely to use nuclear weapons against Canada than against the UK, for obvious reasons of geography. Canada could put up a fight, and Canadians an enduring resistance, much more effectively than the UK.

If the UK declared war against the US, it would be an act of mass suicide that would have zero benefit to anyone.

So none of this is affecting your life.