Constantly disruptive child in my daughter's class

[waitingforsainos]

DD is Y6 and this other child seems to be causing so much trouble in class every day, shouting at the teacher, slamming doors, flicking light switches on and off, randomly screaming in the middle of a lesson when they don't want to do the work, mouthing off if other kids get to do something different because they've behaved well. DD says it's every lesson.

On the whatsapp group, the child's mum has said it's not their fault, they've got an ehcp for semh (think that's mental health?) and has laughed at the teacher when she's been asked to go inside to talk at the end of the day.

From the parent chat, it sounds like the child has had a few suspensions but doesn't seem to have made any difference.

AIBU to expect more from school? What would happen in your child's school if someone behaved like that?

There's a similar child in my Y5 DD's class. At the moment I think the school are trying to prove that mainstream can't meet needs so that the child will get a place in an SEN school for high school. They try to mostly keep the other kids safe. They're funding a 1:1 apparently out of their own budget. I don't think they could do much more.

Suspensions don't make much difference to the one in DD's class either, but that's to be expected if the behaviour is down to SEN.

It's quite hard to get an EHCP, so if this child already has an EHCP then their needs must be reasonably high and the school must have shown that they already tried the usual things they'd do for any other child on the SEN register. The mother may well be very defensive but I wouldn't leap to the conclusion that it's her fault which is what your post seems to be suggesting.

I think schools have more power and more inclination to exclude at secondary.

Not a lot at my daughters school. They have to evacuate the class at least 3 times a week due to a child kicking off. This child has been suspended 6 times since September.

The kids are left to get on with it the rest of the time as long as they aren't being too disruptive.

As schools have no funding, nothing gets done and as speclaist provision is in such short supply there isn't room for them there either so they are stuck in mainstream, when mainstream can't cope with them and on and on it goes.

Go to your local MP and ask that they support more funding for schools.

Ah OP, I hope you’ve got your hard hat on. You’re about to get 8 pages of people calling you insensitive and ignorant to the disruptive child’s needs.

Is there chat on a group/class WhatsApp about this child?

We have a child like this and his EHCP says he cannot be sanctioned in any way and we would be breaking the law to go against this.

My dd had a couple of kids like this in her class (y5 and y6 were worst). It was impossible to do anything about it, the school had no leverage (very hard to exclude).

My dd selected the most strict single sex school she could find for secondary- desperate to escape the noise and bedlam and frustration. She enjoys the calmer classrooms and is thriving.

I heard one of the boys has settled down a bit at secondary school and the other is still continually in trouble. I feel sorry for these kids who simply aren’t able to be in a classroom setting , it’s not fair on these students or their peers or teachers.

There's very little the school can do. All you can do is hope her secondary classes are better but there will probably be similar children there too. Inclusion at all costs (or more accurately, inclusion to save all costs) is a shitshow.

@cherish123 the child has an EHCP, takes a lot to get one of those. Gentle parenting doesn’t give rise to an EHCP

@crumblingschools not naming the child, no. One of the other mums complained about her child getting yelled at in class and this child's mum sent back the messages as above.

I feel for the child who seems really unsettled, but the impact it's having on my child's time at school is my biggest worry.

The child has an EHCP so likely has a disability.

The problem here is lack of funding so not enough support for children with additional needs.

The problem is not:

1. Crap teachers
2. lazy/ineffective parents
3. awful children

The sooner we can all recognise the problem and stop this useless blame game the better.

We have one of these in my child’s class, also Y6. Screaming, shouting, racist slurs, you name it. The parents aren’t ’gentle parenting’, they don’t seem to parent at all. The child eats almost nothing but sweets and biscuits, appears to have unrestrained screen time, and the parents just shrug their shoulders and say that they can’t do anything, so just let their child have their own way to keep the peace at home. I am sympathetic to parents struggling with children additional needs (am in that boat myself), or who are working multiple jobs to make ends meet, but these don’t seem to care. Plus they are clearly where the child learned racism, which enrages me. School are doing their best but with no money and no special school places available, the other children just have to cope with constant disruption. I’m just grateful there’s no violence with this one.

As it should be. Take it to the school. When the parent makes comments hold her accountable. SEN, having an ehcp does not mean the child gets a free pass to be disruptive.

It’s the leadership team you need to speak with. Not the teacher. They either cannot be bothered or they have other issues which they are focused on.

Have you seen the EHCP?

My yr3 child has about 6 terribly behaved children in their class. Some of things they do are shocking for 7 year olds. They’ve broken Their teacher who has gone off sick thankfully the new teacher is really good and hopefully better behaviour is starting improve.
My other child is autistic and I know how difficult school can be but I do believe that the actions these badly behaved kids are doing are not due to neurodiversity they are just plain naughtiness. Their parents need to look into how they are parenting their children as behaviour is learned.

I'm a year six teacher. This is extremely common now; this is what primary schools are like. The teacher will undoubtedly be very frustrated by this and the impact that it's having on the class but there's pretty much nothing anybody can do about it. This is what teaching is these days. Oh and despite what some people say, sometimes it is the child's fault or the parents fault.

This is life in a UK state school these days. It’s worse in secondary as the kids are just more violent. Save for private is my advice. It’s called ‘inclusion’ and you’re a bigot if you moan, dontcha know.

But seriously, this is a big reason why kids are full of anxiety and school refusing, and who can blame them. If there was a violent colleague in the workplace I had to go into every day I’d be terrified too. We are traumatising our children by refusing to address this.

@Leafy74 I see threads like this weekly on mumsnet and I wonder why this is so common now ?

If you have met one child with autism you have met one child with autism.

We’ve had the same in my DD’s class. A very violent and disruptive child with additional needs and a 1 to 1 support still manages to hit other children, smash stuff in the class room and hit the teachers. He’s 9 at the moment. I told the school once he reaches 10 I won’t think twice about calling the police if he assaults my child again. It’s a huge problem as it’s had quite an obvious impact on teaching time, including attention given to other SEN children who don’t have a 1 to 1.

Lack of funding and provision of specific school places for those with additional needs.

Simple. Local authorities are skint. Pupil referral units have been closed and there aren’t enough sen schools. Pupils have been chucked in mainstream in the name of ‘inclusion’ and it’s cheaper so no one is going to change it.

X2boys ? ?

Can anyone explain why children with severe behavioural problems are in mainstream schools? Is it parents pursuing mainstream schools as as opposed to a special school? What is in it for the child who isn't suited to this environment?

There are nowhere near enough special school places for the number of kids who need them.