To think Trump is right

[Donotpanicoknowpanic]

Watching the press conference last night which descended into an argument

I can't help think Trump was right and made good points

Thousands of troops are dying and being seriously injured every month

Trump wants it to stop

There are thousands of people who have children alive today who will not be alive tomorrow because of this war

They are clearly in a stalemate and soldiers are now dying untill peace terms are made as no side can win on the battlefield

Trump as brutal as it sounds was being realistic about what peace would be like

Ukraine has to be realistic

If Ukraine sign the rare earth deal with America then America will have a stake in Ukraine and they should then get a better security deal

Trump has not agreed what that is yet, it's clear he wants the European's to form a big part of that

The European's want American troops and for good reason

But this has to stop and the only way it will stop is by peace negotiations

And these have to be realistic and Trump is saying it as it is

Yes, he has, multiple times:

https://edition.cnn.com/2025/02/28/politics/volodymyr-zelensky-thankful-us-fact-check/index.html

Sure.

So you don't have to wear a suit and be respectable, if you are rich like elon musk, then?

The hypocrisy is staggering isn't it?

I guess dressing informally is acceptable providing you're wearing a MAGA hat 🙄

Tbh I think Russia and the US need a change of leaders, not all out war

Currently one appears to be a stop at nothing despot who thinks he can use cannon fodder to get what he wants and when he runs out of homegrown cannon fodder he uses other countries citizens
And the other to me looks quite unwell both physically and mentally. (Said this prior to last nights debacle)
Losing control and shouting given the position he is in can indicate that something is seriously amiss

I would be very surprised if he made it till Christmas, summer or even through Spring is stretching it a bit fine.

I fervently hope you’re right.

Not necessarily.

The EU would need the US and to some extent the UK for any conflict because of the ability to get amendments to FVEY intelligence for its release to allies in a conflict.

In both peace time and in conflict, intelligence is one of the most important factors. Without it, you will not be able to target correctly and will not have the accurate threat laydowns etc.

At the moment the EU and NATO are heavily reliant on US assets and to some extent UK assets working in partnership with the US.
Take these out the equation and you have quite a large intelligence gap. Without the essential intelligence, countries will not have what they require to get sign off from the "Red Card Holder" to conduct strikes.

No, but it's probably in the same room as you.

@Bertaboo I think you need to consider what form what you'd like would take

Where are you sourcing the weapons and people?

You also need to consider escalation

Except Trump wasn't giving Zelenskyy what he wanted though was he? They were asking him to stop fighting Russia and give them part of Ukraine and sign over half their minerals to the US.
How do the Ukraine benefit in that deal?

…an aviation environment, they definitely aren't meaningless. Those ranges will be taken into consideration when formulating flight plans, altitude and orbit. And in any environment where there is an increased threat, they will not operate or fly within the missile engagement zone (seen from experience)

Welcome to the club…

My opinion, FWIW, based on my “seen from experience”, albeit some time ago, is that you most of what is in the public domain on surface to air/air to air missiles has often come from the manufacturer and is often based on a highly favourable scenario for the system.

It’s highly simplistic and not a bit misleading to try and paint for example European airpower is doomed/is useless just because of (insert Russian weapon system of choice)…

Vance I think is out of his depths and reminds me of a bullies side kick who has little idea of facts but is going all out supporting his mate and ending up embarrassing himself by spouting complete nonsense thinking it is the truth because he hasn’t the critical thinking or ability to research or look at things from any side but the one he has been fed

Remember when the right wing in the US exploded because Obama war a tan suit?

They aren't actually offended by clothing choices, just deflecting in the most superficial and pathetic way imaginable.

Don't be taken in for a moment

I also think the excuse that we all know Trump is arrogant is just bullshit.

Sometime people need to stand up to the arrogant bullies. Which is what trump and Vance are.

@ZooAccountant
I am sure Zelensky’s attitude was different when he met the US leader who supported him (Biden). Trump has made it clear since the election campaign that he has no intention of supporting Ukraine. As the President he has made it clear that he is not going to give any more aid to Ukraine. Zelensky does not owe anything to Trump, he has nothing to thank him for. Had 2020 US election ended with different result, Zelensky wouldn’t have gotten any support.
As to Zelensky’s clothes, he wore the same attire meeting King Charles and other world leaders and nobody raised an eyebrow till vain MAGAs made it an issue.

Spot on. But in this case his little mate is just as thick as he is.

The thing is though, as much of a sniveling, pathetic sidekick he is....he isnt thick.

It'd be more excusable if he was

Bullies aren’t known for being bright

If Russia invaded Alaska what do you think the American response would have been?

Anyway hopefully this shows European leaders that MAGA is an unstable place and Trump is an unstable ally. We should be forging strong ties elsewhere

(it’s not just Ukraine but how Trump and Commander Waterford have been acting with Mexico, Canada, showing support for the German Nazis etc.)

Politics aside. You think this is acceptable behaviour from leaders??? Go away. You’re ridiculous.

Ok Putin is not backing down anytime soon and Ukraine can’t win the war so is Europe going to go broke over the endless war? If so Putin then takes the lot of countries he wants anyway?

Yes he is definitely thick. Just because he has a degree doesn’t mean he can read a room or understand that people lie or have the critical thinking to understand that if you have a deal to be made, there has to be something in it for the victim

Sorry @Yalta I am a bit confused. Are you saying that Trump won't last till Christmas? You know that means we get President Vance?
He is a loathsome individual and would arguably be even worse than Trump but stupid he ain't.

Even if that was to happen, do you think JD Vance would be any better? He's the one with a real vendetta against democracy. I said this on another thread, but Vance and Rubio are worse than Trump because they're smart enough to know what they're doing. Trump is just a demented, moronic, deluded narcissist.

It was the Allies too. The Treaty of Versailles was too punitive and pushed Germany too far.

A winners / losers narrative has everyone losing in the end. And that is the lesson we have NEVER learned.

I personally don't like the mineral deal, because it forces an ongoing American presence in an unstable region of the world. The US doesn't need minerals from Ukraine. We have the second largest known deposits of rare earths after China, and we have been working hard at developing new extraction and refining technologies. We don't need to mine on Russia's doorstep and possibly tripwire Europe into WWIII.

My strong preference would be for the US to leave NATO, which is beginning to be discussed at high levels. The idea has some support in the Senate, but not enough yet to abrogate the treaty. My hope is that US forces completely leave Europe, and a whole lot of other places, very soon. Then you Europeans can either play well in the sandbox together, or not. Not our continent, not our circus.