To think Trump is right

[Donotpanicoknowpanic]

Watching the press conference last night which descended into an argument

I can't help think Trump was right and made good points

Thousands of troops are dying and being seriously injured every month

Trump wants it to stop

There are thousands of people who have children alive today who will not be alive tomorrow because of this war

They are clearly in a stalemate and soldiers are now dying untill peace terms are made as no side can win on the battlefield

Trump as brutal as it sounds was being realistic about what peace would be like

Ukraine has to be realistic

If Ukraine sign the rare earth deal with America then America will have a stake in Ukraine and they should then get a better security deal

Trump has not agreed what that is yet, it's clear he wants the European's to form a big part of that

The European's want American troops and for good reason

But this has to stop and the only way it will stop is by peace negotiations

And these have to be realistic and Trump is saying it as it is

Any war can stop if one party surrenders but where do you stop? Or are you happy for your kids to be under Russian rule in 10 years time FFS. It’s Ukraine’s land! What’s to stop Putin deciding he wants somewhere else next?

If Ukraine sign the rare earth deal with America then America will have a stake in Ukraine and they should then get a better security deal

"Should" doth butter no parsnips

Try some critical thinking classes , OP

No, Putin is a loser whatever anyone replies.

But he's not losing is he? And he's less likely to lose if the world's most powerful nation does nothing to stop him. That kind of is the point.

It would all stop if Putin stopped.
Trump is an arrogant bully who has behaved atrociously.
When Germany invaded France should we have said, well Hitlers got a point he can have it?

Zelensky has to stand up for his country.

So imagine it was the uk. What part of it do you think would be fine to annexe and hand over to a foreign invader? What about the people who live there who don’t want to be under that country’s rule?

Why would it be different for Ukraine?

Trump is an arse but he should remember that just because he and Putin are pals doesn’t mean Russia is the US’s ally

It was a disgrace and I don’t understand that you don’t get that. Ukraine didn’t start the war and it’s insulting and dangerous for Trump to call resolving it a deal - with an aggressive country that can’t be trusted

Good to know. Ok, OP, if you give me your address I'd be delighted to invade your home and make myself comfortable on your sofa. Going by your values, I'm assuming you'll agree to give me your kitchen and living room in exchange for me not also taking over the bedroom. Fair's fair, it's the sensible solution, don't you want peace?

The more I think about it the more I think this was a put up job. The US never had any intention of signing. This is what they wanted to happen.

They're setting Ukraine up

I suspect everyone wants peace OP, i doubt anyone is revelling in prolonging war and the loss of life and trauma that accompanies it; but you've swallowed the 'accept our deal or else you don't want peace' even though it's unreasonable, and they were awful to him yesterday. If Trump is such a purveyor of peace, why did he sign over billions of pounds worth of weapons to Israel yesterday? He's out for America which is fine, but it doesn't mean Ukraine should roll over and accept a poor deal whilst also being expected to stop speaking the truth and asking reasonable questions.

As Zelensky said
“But during 2014 till 2022 the situation was the same, that people are been dying on the contact line. Nobody stopped him. You know that we had conversations with him, a lot of conversations, my bilateral conversation, and we signed with him. Me like a new president in 2019 I signed with him. The deal I signed with him, Macron and Merkel. We signed ceasefire, ceasefire. All of them told me that he will never go. We signed him with gas contract... but after that, he broken the ceasefire He killed our people, and he didn't exchange prisoners we signed the exchange of prisons but he didn't do it. What kind of diplomacy, JD, are you talking about. What do you mean?"

Can you answer Zelensky's point there?

Not least when he started the meeting with a thank you, and has thanked the US many times before.

Yes and there are a lot of people/organisations/countries who need to shoulder some blame for emboldening Putin as it is. They should never have been allowed to host Olympic Games and the World Cup. And let’s not forget Putin sent his agents to this country with nerve agent, killed, seriously injured and threatened the lives of our citizens and we did fuck all!

If Trump really wants peace OP why didn't he behave in his meeting with the Russians the same way he did with Zelensky. His actions bely his true views.

Trump can want whatever he likes, but Putin does not want peace, he has repeatedly said Ukraine isn't a state and cannot exist.

These young men and women who have died, have all died because Putin invaded... he can end this right now and call a ceasefire.... he will not, he will keep taking land until he gets all of Ukraine.... rearm and then go for the Baltic states.

Neither Trump nor Vance have ever criticised Putin.... why do you think that may be?

To be fair, despite him invading neighbouring countries we did have a policy of appeasement towards Hitler for quite a long time.

Trump was perfectly aware of how he was coming across , as he said at the end that it would make for great television , He made it all about him as per usual , rather than what was being discussed .

This.

They are and were absolutely fucking vile. It's terrifying that they felt emboldened to act like this.

The US needs to stand up to Putin, even if ultimately, some small concessions are made. It's Ukraine today, who knows what it could be tomorrow. For some reason - which isn't entirely clear - Trump has always put Putin on a pedestal. Trump is not neutral in these negotiations. He's on Putin's side.

Yes I actually agree with you. Real people are dying every day. Asking for more money (millions) from America and the Uk doesnt seem like a long term plan either. Peace talks need to be made. They can't just copy Palestine and Israel, and keep fighting for years, it's crazy. They need to sit down and come to an agreement.

Zelensky was a fool to publicly try to embarrass the Americans. They have given more than double the amount the Europeans have with no sign of an end to the conflict. Neither Russia or Ukraine can win this.

Trump and Vance were appalling in the way they behaved and were definitely trying to provoke Zelensky.

Trump has failed to acknowledge that his mate Putin is the aggressor here. He has failed to offer Zelensky anything in return for the rights to Ukraine's mineral wealth.

Any 'deal' must not reward Russia for acts of aggression, otherwise he will invade Ukraine again in the future or the Baltic states.

China will no doubt be watching this and if Russia is effectively rewarded for their actions, you can bet China will invade Taiwan. Why wouldn't they?

Agreed OP. People also need to look at the deep corruption behind Ukraine’s mineral mining industry and make the link between what might happen if Trump gets his hands on it, a big part of the “peace deal”. It will all come flooding out, who’s involved, who benefited and how etc. There is much more going on than “We Have To Stand Up To The Nasty Ruskies!”

So Putin invades Ukraine and it is Ukraine that has to sign over its minerals and Russia has to do nothing?!

Oh and if I spoke to anyone the way Vance and Trump did, whilst working, I'd get the sack.

Underlying. Their.
And you're wrong.

Do you think world war 2 could have been prevented by sitting down and talking to Hitler?

Do you think murder can be prevented by sitting down and reaching a deal with a murderer?

Putin does not want peace. He wants Ukraine to not exist. He wants to expand Russian borders.