Aibu to drop racist student

[HeadacheEarthquake]

Aibu to run a mile
Yes YABU teach her to behave
YaNBU - run away and find new clients

I am currently teaching a pensioner to the tune of £320 a month to play piano and violin

She has often referred to German composers as "Krauts" and French composers as "Frogs". She does not know I am part French.

I assumed this might be generational and have gently discouraged it but this weeknsje used the terms "gayboys" when referring to some local salon owners after a breezy conversation about nail polish then went on to remark thay the ABRSM books always seem to "have to have a coloured on the front"

I said "does that matter" and she was visibly shaken and messed up her piece terribly.

I want to end the lessons with her but would like to know whether anyone would consider paying something and appealing to her better nature and having a conversation about appropriate manner in lessons rather than just writing them off.

Yours,

A multinational teacher in turmoil.

But often it IS generational. Of course, many older people - like your parents - have moved with the times but plenty of people haven’t. The casual racism I’ve come across is often in the talk of older people who seem oblivious to the fact they are using outdated terms. It’s as much ignorance as anything else.

OP - it sounds like your student is generally sympathetic. Why not say to her ‘You know I’m half French?’ And then say your piece… Her reaction will tell you what you need to know.

Yes. It wasn't that long ago that I was told to say 'coloured people' instead of black etc in teacher training.

No, use it as a teaching opportunity. Explain why it's offensive.

Maybe print up a list of new “rules”
for your classes.
No derogatory comments about …
No unpleasant remarks about people of other cultures
Not to waste time on this sort of chat
Concentrate on music lessons only
Encourage her no chit chat about her hair.
We are here to learn music

If the lessons become too upsetting and difficult, it’s time to let her go.

With many older people, it's a generational thing. I wouldn't drop her,.Just keep using the correct terms so.she learns from you.

Wow, cancel culture at its finest in these answers @HeadacheEarthquake

It def is a generational thing she is being rude but it is reflective of hiw her generation sees the world. I would not drop her would talk to her. There is something called reverse mentoring. It's used in business a lot, pls use that philosophy and help her appreciate the world through your eyes and the injustice of using terms and descriptors she uses etc.

Good luck.

Exactly. I used to work with a Lady who was from Namabia. At a very recent "diversity awareness" training, the tutor was explaining how the use of the word coloured was offensive and the "correct" term was "Black".

This lady and the tutor, who for context described himself as "Black British", had a full on "robust argument" about the issue.

The lady explained that she was from a tribe that had been banished to the scrublands shortly after the first World War, because a number of women in the tribe had slept with German Soldiers and had given birth to mixed race babies.

Over the decades, members of her tribe embraced their "different skin" and even though they are largely accepted and integrated now, the memory of the decades of banishment are still strong in her tribe.

She describes herself as "coloured" and took great offence at someone telling her she shouldn't use the word, even to describe herself.

It just opened my eyes to how differently people see things. I had no idea about any of that stuff.

I still have no idea who was "right" either.

I once went on a course and we had actual role plays of how to challenge things in a non confrontational way. I have never forgotten it and do use the techniques. So something like, ' I don't use that term because of x' it may be something that they have not thought of before.

You’re welcome.

Um....is this your first day on mn?
The very first thing OP would have been asked (then repeated multiple times) would have been exactly what the words were, then accused of drip feeding

Besides i think it is accurate - racist and outdated covers a huge spectrum. The 'n' word is very different to 'frogs' in terms of context and history. 'Gay boys' isn't particularly pejorative at all in itself - if they are openly gay then it's literally an exact description, the offensiveness comes from reducing them to a stereotype rather than the words themselves, unlike if she'd called them "poofters" or whatever.

OP you'd be surprised at how uneducated some people are about the "correct" terms. I grew up in the 90s and was told "coloured" was polite then - obviously that changed but I was surprised when I heard a friend still using it in about 2017 when we were in our 20s. Its possible that people get confused with "people if colour" which (particularly in the us) is still seen as acceptable and preferred.

It's up to you. While its obviously not your responsibility to educate her, in 70 years she obviously hasnt managed to do it herself. Given the way she reacted to your mild comment it seems more likely than not nobody else in her circle has mentioned it to her either, which means unless someone tells her she will continue. Surely it's better (both for her and for those who might overhear her using even more pejorative terms to describe them that someone does, and if you are comfortable doing so it would probably come better from someone she has a relationship with.

Whether you do so as a warning/last chance or reason for terminating her lessons is up to you. Personally I would give her a chance.

From the examples mentioned, it doesn't sound she really feels badly about the other groups, she is just naming them in a strange way.
Maybe she just sees you a bit too friendly and feels she doesn't have to adjust her language to the 21st century around you, because she doesn't have to do it "with mates".

You can drop her, or, you can start with telling her it makes you uncomfortable, and see what happens. If you don't like the reaction, you can drop her later and be sure about it.

Oh come on. Age in this situation is absolutely relevant.

Really? You HAD to read them did you? Who was forcing you? Wow I've seen it all now! If OP hadn't included quotes everyone would've said they couldn't judge if they didn't know exactly what was said. If reading those terms has offended you then I suggest MN isn't the place for you.

I think it’s generational. She’s liberal in her attitudes, in that she hasn’t been nasty about the “gayboys” etc. It’s just that she’s using old-fashioned terms that she doesn’t realise are now considered to be offensive.

That. Just gently correct her and get on with the lesson.

I'd she was actively racist and homophobic it would be another matter. But she's not. She's a pleasant person using outdated terms, which can easily be corrected. And it seems that she's open to learning, given her embarrassment.

So you can dump her, in which case she'll carry on doing it, it you can have a quiet chat, and spare others those words.

Not acceptable - yes, If I were you I'd say something! It might be useful to have a written policy you could point all students to - to head this off in future.

(NB threads like this are getting targeted by bad-faith posters, if you were wondering why some of the replies are so weirdly hostile and defensive of the poor old lady who couldn't know better.)

Just on the word Kraut - there is a music genre called krautrock (aka kosmiche Musik), the term is still used. Not sure if you can get sheet music for any tracks though?

I would just tell her not to make those comments around you or you will have to let her go. It's definitely a generational thing.

It's not generational. My parents were born before WW2 and they or their friends would never have used language like that. Maybe time to gently call her out.

I used to have a cleaner who would make racist remarks. She used to tell me horrible anecdotes about telling people to "get back to where they came from" which I would hear in stunned silence. Of course I stopped employing her.

My DH is Chinese so we are a mixed race family.

It sometimes seemed as if she had not noticed this

OMG!The ageism in this thread!

Anyway, just drop her if you can afford it. Personally, I would feel way more uncomfortable with clients still using X (Twitter) than old language.

Who's being weirdly hostile?

Some people are simply reminding OP of her own words where she said that this person is otherwise pleasant, empathetic and kind. So she's not irredeemable, and there's no reason for OP to lose the money. All she has to do is express discomfort with the students wording and point out that it's not acceptable these days, and she doesn't want to hear it.

I wouldn’t drop her unless she continued to use offensive language after you made it clear you didn’t like it.

She was clearly upset and hopefully embarrassed when you called out her inappropriate comment so I think she will be receptive to similar strategies. You have an opportunity to help her here.

I would probably make my point in a relatively light hearted way as an entry point to the conversation, but then make it clear I didn’t like it. With mock horror, ‘You can’t say ‘k…t any more (name) people find it offensive!’ Then with a more serious expression, ‘I find it offensive actually.’

Complaining about a book having “coloureds” on the front isn’t only using racist language, its having an issue with the existence of people who are not white.

"Kraut" is not "just a nickname". It's a derogatory term used to refer to Germans at a very dark time in history. She might as well call Brahms or today's Germans "Nazis". The book comment was also completely racist. I'd give her one warning before dropping her OP.

She’s using ignorant and outdated terms, rather than actually expressing racist views from what you say. I have a couple of lovely aunts in their 70s who use ‘coloured’ all the time and are genuinely baffled as to why it’s offensive. They are not racist, it’s a generational thing. Presumably your student has been around people all her life who used such terms and she’s never been challenged on it.

The best approach, as others have suggested, is just to calmly address the terms when they are used. “Can we just say French please, ‘frog’ isn’t acceptable these days Marjorie”, etc. She’ll probably be mortified and get the message. If people aren’t challenged on their language, they will infer that others concur and assume it’s ok to carry on.