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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that now is the time for powerful voices to speak up…

289 replies

Alifemoreordinary123 · 20/02/2025 20:14

I’m not highly educated or hugely politically savvy. But like many people, I’m horrified by Trump and Musk’s approach, propaganda and ideology. It’s increasingly possibly they will take the world to a very dark place. I keep thinking, surely there are enough counter powers - people with power and influence, leaders from business, media, the arts, politics across the Western world to try and counter some of their rhetoric. I’m not naive to the immense power they hold, but surely reason, sense, logic and hope will win over?

OP posts:
neverthelastone · 20/02/2025 21:26

Donotwantnot · 20/02/2025 20:21

I wish our government was being as forthright as Trump and Co are. I’m cheering them on. It’s world changing, yes. But in a good way.

What exactly do you object to? Cost cutting? Reducing financial waste? Stopping fraud? Efficiency?

You, sir, are what is traditionally known as a “useful idiot”.

You’re welcome. Thank me later.

RoastDinnerSmellsNice · 20/02/2025 21:27

Bearing in mind the minute someone writes on here about their parent behaving uncharacteristically, many MNetters immediately say 'he/she may have dementia', I'm really surprised that no one has suggested this about Trump. After all, when you look at how Joe Biden went downhill, and Trump is only 4 years younger, and talking the amount of shit that it does, it certainly makes me wonder whether he's lost his marbles.

rabbitwoman · 20/02/2025 21:30

If you are interested in one of those 'idiots', I have been a left wing labour supporter all my life. I cried when Trump won in 2016. I cried when Boris won, but last year I voted Conservative for the first time ever (possibly the last, because I am a socialist at heart), and I was glad when Trump won. I kind of admire him for his amazing comeback, and he seems to have been listening and is a very different type of guy now.

You want to ask me why? Or call me an idiot again?

ThenUm · 20/02/2025 21:30

LambriniBobInIsleworthISeesYa · 20/02/2025 21:04

Yeah, this. Thanks for linking to the specific parts of history @ThenUm so that those unfamiliar can read and see the parallels. This is why this stuff needs to be taught in schools.

Show quote history

Copied from wikipeadia. Can’t take credit for that. I struggle with technology!

ThenUm · 20/02/2025 21:31

rabbitwoman · 20/02/2025 21:30

If you are interested in one of those 'idiots', I have been a left wing labour supporter all my life. I cried when Trump won in 2016. I cried when Boris won, but last year I voted Conservative for the first time ever (possibly the last, because I am a socialist at heart), and I was glad when Trump won. I kind of admire him for his amazing comeback, and he seems to have been listening and is a very different type of guy now.

You want to ask me why? Or call me an idiot again?

Can you explain what you mean by ‘different kind of guy’ please?

TimeWarSoldier · 20/02/2025 21:32

Andwhoisasking · 20/02/2025 21:13

Meh. The west have been moving to populism for quite some time. The issue is people haven’t spoken up and in fact tried to shut people down. The far left really need to look in the mirror there. No good hand wringing now. The damage is done. Not addressing people’s concerns around immigration, wealth, tax, jobs, etc, etc. People have moved to populism and people who think they will ‘hear them.’ It happening here in the UK and across Europe. We aren’t far behind voting in populist leaders. Especially with the car crash that is Labour. They aren’t the answer people hoped for.

People try to shut it down shouting racist, far right etc and it just fuels it further. It almost seems unstoppable now. The time to speak and listen was at least 5/6 years ago.

I'm afraid I agree with this, and I'm just as guilty of it as I get so fucking furious with people who voted for Brexit or who support people like Farage, that I lose my head when a cooler one should've prevailed.

When America sneezes, Britain catches the cold. Personally, I'm praying for the meteorite.

ThenUm · 20/02/2025 21:34

59thStreetBridgeSong · 20/02/2025 21:10

History is my specialism - graduated in the early 1990s and have taught Germany in the 1930s for so many years that I can see all the parallels right now.

Show quote history

Thanks. So depressing. I watched a documentary on the development of WWII and the parallels were frightening then in his first term. It seems even more stark now. Even banning certain books from military schools. Chilling.

neverthelastone · 20/02/2025 21:36

Andwhoisasking · 20/02/2025 21:24

Oh look. Can’t think why populist leaders are taking hold. The hard left really need to take responsibility for this shit show.

Show quote history

You think Trump and MAGA aren’t idiots and liars? And is there really a hard left in America? The Democrats are as soft left as they come -- more like our Tory party.

Sure, the left needs to dump the excesses of gender politics and so on. But none of that was in the wider public sphere in 2016, and Trump was still a mendacious thick liar then. He hasn’t improved in the intervening years.

Musk was on Twitter/X today telling a genuine NASA astronaut some total bollocks about how he had offered to send up SpaceX spaceships to rescue astronauts at the International Space Station, and Biden had refused. SpaceX can’t even get a rocket out of the atmosphere without it blowing up. That’s the level of total, absolute, ketamine-fuelled, copper-bottomed delusion that’s going on at the top of American politics. (Last month the man was caught pretending he was a top scorer in a computer game he hired other people to play for him.) The level of absolute delusion and batshittery is, if you’ll pardon the pun, out of this world. And this is who is running amok “advising” Trump, the man who thought you could cure Covid by injecting bleach into your lungs.

TankFlyBossW4lk · 20/02/2025 21:37

Donotwantnot · 20/02/2025 20:28

It’s been debunked. Repeatedly. Next.

Show quote history

It absolutely has not been debunked. Next!

Original poster
Alifemoreordinary123 · 20/02/2025 21:38

@rabbitwoman thank you for sharing - I appreciate your view. Whilst I don’t share the view, I can understand admiring Trump - his accomplishments are those very few manage. But do you trust him to contribute and co-create a safe world for Americans and the rest of the world? I completely get the point that the alternatives (internationally) are uninspiring.

OP posts:
rabbitwoman · 20/02/2025 21:39

@ThenUm he seems to have listened and learnt. He's a bit more dignified. I think he sees his political comeback as vindication and old Trump may have gloated, but this Trump is a bit more humble.

He takes so much criticism and ridicule and contempt on the chin, but I think because he is confident of public support behind him, and the comedians and actors and pop stars who take aim are out of touch with the real lives of the voters. He's done something amazing, whatever you think of his politics, and he's gracious in his victory.

And no matter how much anyone disagrees and voiced their feelings, the people voted for him. Do you agree with democracy or not? Or do you think only people who pass some kind of IQ test should be able to vote?

outerspacepotato · 20/02/2025 21:40

I'm in the US and the dead silence from every Democrat but Bernie and AOC has been notable and dishesrtening. The moderate Republicans too. They're all MIA.

madamweb · 20/02/2025 21:41

rabbitwoman · 20/02/2025 21:30

If you are interested in one of those 'idiots', I have been a left wing labour supporter all my life. I cried when Trump won in 2016. I cried when Boris won, but last year I voted Conservative for the first time ever (possibly the last, because I am a socialist at heart), and I was glad when Trump won. I kind of admire him for his amazing comeback, and he seems to have been listening and is a very different type of guy now.

You want to ask me why? Or call me an idiot again?

Oh do elaborate. What a fascinating viewpoint.

ThenUm · 20/02/2025 21:42

RoastDinnerSmellsNice · 20/02/2025 21:27

Bearing in mind the minute someone writes on here about their parent behaving uncharacteristically, many MNetters immediately say 'he/she may have dementia', I'm really surprised that no one has suggested this about Trump. After all, when you look at how Joe Biden went downhill, and Trump is only 4 years younger, and talking the amount of shit that it does, it certainly makes me wonder whether he's lost his marbles.

He spoke rubbish in his first term too. Drinking bleach as a cure for covid. Not being able to say ’origin’ are two that I remember easily.

madamweb · 20/02/2025 21:42

outerspacepotato · 20/02/2025 21:40

I'm in the US and the dead silence from every Democrat but Bernie and AOC has been notable and dishesrtening. The moderate Republicans too. They're all MIA.

Yes I cant work this bit out. I am hoping it is a sign of lots of stuff happening behind closed doors.

Midnightlove · 20/02/2025 21:43

Ablondiebutagoody · 20/02/2025 20:19

Trump is just withdrawing the US from (expensive) stuff that he doesn't think they should be involved in. Totally fair enough. Every other country in the World can step in to fill the void if they want to.

I do agree with that part, I don't agree with all the complete lis he's been spreading about the situation though

HRTQueen · 20/02/2025 21:44

Isn’t that part of the problem calling Trump thick

Similar happened here calling Farage thick

when you call them thick you are calling their supporters thick and both have excellent political acumen

hence why they are where they are and we have now left the EU

ThenUm · 20/02/2025 21:44

rabbitwoman · 20/02/2025 21:39

@ThenUm he seems to have listened and learnt. He's a bit more dignified. I think he sees his political comeback as vindication and old Trump may have gloated, but this Trump is a bit more humble.

He takes so much criticism and ridicule and contempt on the chin, but I think because he is confident of public support behind him, and the comedians and actors and pop stars who take aim are out of touch with the real lives of the voters. He's done something amazing, whatever you think of his politics, and he's gracious in his victory.

And no matter how much anyone disagrees and voiced their feelings, the people voted for him. Do you agree with democracy or not? Or do you think only people who pass some kind of IQ test should be able to vote?

Ok. I think we may have to agree to disagree because I don’t see any of that.

More humble? He recently referred to himself as ‘king’ and regularly says how great he is.

Narcissists don’t change. Ever.

Andwhoisasking · 20/02/2025 21:45

neverthelastone · 20/02/2025 21:36

You think Trump and MAGA aren’t idiots and liars? And is there really a hard left in America? The Democrats are as soft left as they come -- more like our Tory party.

Sure, the left needs to dump the excesses of gender politics and so on. But none of that was in the wider public sphere in 2016, and Trump was still a mendacious thick liar then. He hasn’t improved in the intervening years.

Musk was on Twitter/X today telling a genuine NASA astronaut some total bollocks about how he had offered to send up SpaceX spaceships to rescue astronauts at the International Space Station, and Biden had refused. SpaceX can’t even get a rocket out of the atmosphere without it blowing up. That’s the level of total, absolute, ketamine-fuelled, copper-bottomed delusion that’s going on at the top of American politics. (Last month the man was caught pretending he was a top scorer in a computer game he hired other people to play for him.) The level of absolute delusion and batshittery is, if you’ll pardon the pun, out of this world. And this is who is running amok “advising” Trump, the man who thought you could cure Covid by injecting bleach into your lungs.

Show quote history

Again what is it with you guys? Why does this was obvious = Trump supporters.

I am centrist. I am FURIOUS with the far left and the shit show they have enabled. The US is only a couple of years ahead of us. What is it now? Reform are 2nd behind the Conservatives. This lurch is appearing all over the west. Why?

The ordinary person on the street have had their rights trampled on whilst being told to shut up and pay. We are in dangerous territory in this country. The working class thought they’d be saved and they haven’t. We are facing huge squeezes on living costs, on top of: job freezes, redundancies, wage stagnation, etc. People don’t feel heard. People who have had genuine concerns about immigration or gender politics have been told to shut up. Racist, bigots, knuckle dragger, thick, arse holes, the list goes on. Those people are now more disenfranchised than ever and are going to leaders who make them feel heard. It’s almost like people don’t understand our own history.

The politics in the west from all sides needs to have a good hard look at itself. One side fuelling hate and the other side dismissing concerns as racist bigotry. It’s like how a fold mountain forms. The two sides have smashed into each other and the rock is filtering out in a forceful manner away from either side. A visual metaphor if you liked for exactly what is happening now.

neverthelastone · 20/02/2025 21:46

rabbitwoman · 20/02/2025 21:39

@ThenUm he seems to have listened and learnt. He's a bit more dignified. I think he sees his political comeback as vindication and old Trump may have gloated, but this Trump is a bit more humble.

He takes so much criticism and ridicule and contempt on the chin, but I think because he is confident of public support behind him, and the comedians and actors and pop stars who take aim are out of touch with the real lives of the voters. He's done something amazing, whatever you think of his politics, and he's gracious in his victory.

And no matter how much anyone disagrees and voiced their feelings, the people voted for him. Do you agree with democracy or not? Or do you think only people who pass some kind of IQ test should be able to vote?

Have you lost your mind? Trump has grown gracious, humble and dignified?

Have you actually listened to any of his recent speeches? Like the ones threatening Zelensky by repeating false propaganda? Or the ones denouncing his political opponents? Or the ones spouting unhinged and fact-free nonsense about NATO? Or the ones in which he threatens to annex Canada and invade Greenland? Or the ones where he rants about immigrants and tariffs?

Do tell. I’m looking forward to the explanation of his very humble new aspirations to invade other sovereign nations. Liz Truss has just given a speech about how much we should admire and envy Trump.

Come to think about it … Liz, is that you…?

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 21:46

madamweb · 20/02/2025 21:42

Yes I cant work this bit out. I am hoping it is a sign of lots of stuff happening behind closed doors.

Show quote history

This is interesting.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/feb/19/trumpism-bernie-sanders

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 21:49

The working class thought they’d be saved and they haven’t. We are facing huge squeezes on living costs, on top of: job freezes, redundancies, wage stagnation, etc. People don’t feel heard

Like the 1930s. Facism wasn’t the answer then and it isn’t now.

Andwhoisasking · 20/02/2025 21:50

BIossomtoes · 20/02/2025 21:49

The working class thought they’d be saved and they haven’t. We are facing huge squeezes on living costs, on top of: job freezes, redundancies, wage stagnation, etc. People don’t feel heard

Like the 1930s. Facism wasn’t the answer then and it isn’t now.

Quite. Doesn’t mean history isn’t repeating itself because it is. No-one has learnt.

Whimsicalgrape · 20/02/2025 21:54

Andwhoisasking · 20/02/2025 21:13

Meh. The west have been moving to populism for quite some time. The issue is people haven’t spoken up and in fact tried to shut people down. The far left really need to look in the mirror there. No good hand wringing now. The damage is done. Not addressing people’s concerns around immigration, wealth, tax, jobs, etc, etc. People have moved to populism and people who think they will ‘hear them.’ It happening here in the UK and across Europe. We aren’t far behind voting in populist leaders. Especially with the car crash that is Labour. They aren’t the answer people hoped for.

People try to shut it down shouting racist, far right etc and it just fuels it further. It almost seems unstoppable now. The time to speak and listen was at least 5/6 years ago.

The "far left" were not in power 5-6 years ago. Wtf are you on?