To think that now is the time for powerful voices to speak up…

[Alifemoreordinary123]

I’m not highly educated or hugely politically savvy. But like many people, I’m horrified by Trump and Musk’s approach, propaganda and ideology. It’s increasingly possibly they will take the world to a very dark place. I keep thinking, surely there are enough counter powers - people with power and influence, leaders from business, media, the arts, politics across the Western world to try and counter some of their rhetoric. I’m not naive to the immense power they hold, but surely reason, sense, logic and hope will win over?

We partly did that for a reason, we were not prepared for war and were stalling for time while starting to re-arm. We can't afford a sudden break with the US but it will come gradually.

You think that's all he's doing? Pay better attention.

Nope. Russia failed in a quick victory, its now in a war of attrition and they haven't had any significant gains recently. Russia has about 20% Ukrainian territory. Which for a military the size of Russia vs Ukraine to take in 16 months is not winning.

Lying, sacking people, sucking up to Putin .. just off the top of my head.

Bloody hell, are you for real?!

Trump's meddling in Ukraine and fawning Putin is not a good thing for the wider world.

I'm sad that we seem to be moving rapidly towards a place where the Americans are the bad guys.

Really? The Daily Mail were huge Nazi supporters for way too long into the war, I know that much is true. I’m not sure the British government were really just stalling to be honest but history is not my specialism.

Yeah, this. Thanks for linking to the specific parts of history @ThenUm so that those unfamiliar can read and see the parallels. This is why this stuff needs to be taught in schools.

You’re not missing the point. This piece of writing is famous for good reason.

History teacher here - it is taught in schools.

History is my specialism - graduated in the early 1990s and have taught Germany in the 1930s for so many years that I can see all the parallels right now.

Not many are going to outside of Europe

Putin has powerful allies China, India and Iran and now the US

collectively Europe could be one voice but many European countries are very divided at present and with Europes most powerful country Germany going to the polls this weekend this makes it even more challenging

European leaders were foolish over Putin for a long time too reliant on Russian fuel just how he wanted them to be

Oh here we go...

Meh. The west have been moving to populism for quite some time. The issue is people haven’t spoken up and in fact tried to shut people down. The far left really need to look in the mirror there. No good hand wringing now. The damage is done. Not addressing people’s concerns around immigration, wealth, tax, jobs, etc, etc. People have moved to populism and people who think they will ‘hear them.’ It happening here in the UK and across Europe. We aren’t far behind voting in populist leaders. Especially with the car crash that is Labour. They aren’t the answer people hoped for.

People try to shut it down shouting racist, far right etc and it just fuels it further. It almost seems unstoppable now. The time to speak and listen was at least 5/6 years ago.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/19/world/americas/us-migrants-panama-jungle-camp.html

It hasn't taken long for the Trump and Putin apologists to turn up.

@user1471453601 interesting point, I hope you are right. I’m not so sure that there is hope of that in America.

@Andwhoisasking completely agree - we’ve ignored the struggle of the average, working person at a time when expectations have risen exponentially. Not a good mix.

He’s throwing away the US’s power as well as everything else, because he’s a thick mendacious idiot who trades on lies and deceit and is easily flattered. He and Musk both spout absolute unmitigated fact-free nonsense, and his supporters (and clearly, you too) fall for it.

You’ve been had, I’m afraid; and by dangerous idiots to boot.

Who are you referring to? Put your money where your mouth is and say it aloud. I can’t stand either. However, it’s no good for those on the far left of the spectrum to be pearl clutching now. This is a situation that was clearly predictable and is now replicating itself here and across Europe. Shutting down the conversation is exactly what’s landed us here. Congratulations.

Ok sure. A bit like Hitler was just trying to make Germany a better place to live.

No-one’s shut down the conversation. Idiots and liars are just shouting over it.

Far left do you all just read off the same script?

And here we are.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/19/world/americas/us-migrants-panama-jungle-camp.html

Oh look. Can’t think why populist leaders are taking hold. The hard left really need to take responsibility for this shit show.