To think that now is the time for powerful voices to speak up…

[Alifemoreordinary123]

I’m not highly educated or hugely politically savvy. But like many people, I’m horrified by Trump and Musk’s approach, propaganda and ideology. It’s increasingly possibly they will take the world to a very dark place. I keep thinking, surely there are enough counter powers - people with power and influence, leaders from business, media, the arts, politics across the Western world to try and counter some of their rhetoric. I’m not naive to the immense power they hold, but surely reason, sense, logic and hope will win over?

Appeasement of a bully just means giving in to their demands.

Trump is no sophisticated statesman. Putin and Musk have a hold over him and are using him for their own ends.

Trump is emboldening Russia and China.

All of us AND the USA will pay for this.

Yup. Petrifying.

Exactly that. Trump’s a useful idiot.

This! - plus to ignore the issues which provoked Rusdia to invade Ukraine is naive and childish. To think the US wouldn't invade Mexico if China overthrew their government and were encouraging them to join a military alliance against the US is ridiculous. Thsts what happened in the Ukraine. Yes Russia shouldn't have invaded. Ukraine is a sovereign state. But - that's not how geopolitics works.

1 million have died in this completely avoidable war. I'm glad Trump is trying to end it. I'm not happy with his rhetoric towards Gaza - but on this issue he's right.

It’s not about ignoring. It’s about being clear that it wasn’t grounds for invasion. It’s Ukraines rare mineral wealth everyone is after.

Russia was provoked to invade Ukraine?

I've never seen so many people keen to endorse Putin and his ambitions. It's frightening.

Luckily there are many many more people and governments who recognise Putin for what he is.

Trump is Krasnov. Has been since the 1980s.

Boris wasn’t as dangerous though. He was a knob, but he held quite liberal views

@neverthelastone the problem in the heart of government is that Boris didn't want to lock us in our homes then he and most of downing Street got covid. He's a liberalist at heart and they didn't lock us down fast enough. Boris was out shaking the hands of covid patients.
Apparently a party was sprung on him for his bday. By which point he and downing steet had covid and would have had a good amount of immunity.
It's written as though it was a great time for them, they got what they wanted, locked us all away and were having back to back parties.

Apparently this is how trump negotiates and now I don't blame him at all but zelensky has unfortunately played trump wrong.

Trump will be guided by a sophisticated team who will understand putin I imagine that they run through game plans and what has and hasn't worked on putin.
Intelligence would be guiding them as well
They wanted access to their aluminum reverses for about 1 year. I'm not sure of further details.

I'm not sure what people want Trump to do with putin, he can carry on as before like Biden in a stalemate, push putin to the brink of nuclear war by supplying harder weapons, call putin bluff and start to randomly threaten putin bluff? Taking the entire world to nuclear war?

At the end of one of the recent trump rambles I think at mar a lago he attacked zelensky but the last words were something like, we are the strongest military in the world I wouldn't go up agaisnt us.
Or something like that.
I'd say that's a direct message to putin.
But mixed in with the butter.

@bigvig Question for you

Do you think women who are drunk or wear short skirts deserve to be raped?

I'm not sure what people want to happen with Ukraine, it always seems to be wishful thinking, as if Putin could ever be persuaded to stop his plans for increasing Russia's power and influence. I get the appeasement comparison and the view that it just enables Putin to rearm and come back stronger but what are the alternatives? As far as I can see the only two alternatives.

One, to draw out the Ukraine war for as long as possible to act as a continued drain on Russian resources and accept that the west needs to bankroll Ukraine for the forseeable future and accept many more Ukrainian casualties. The hope being that eventually Russia will run out of money before the west does and the Russian people will overthrow their government and install a western-friendly one.

Two, for the west to go all-in and provide military support, NATO troops on the ground, taking the fight into Russia with the intention of overthrowing Putin and replacing it with a puppet regime. This means all out war, effectively starting World War III and giving a realistic chance of the nuclear annihilation of the planet because as Putin has previously stated if there is no Russia there needs to be no world.

There is no way that I can see for the current war to be ended without major and devestating consequences. The choice is to take them now or store them up for later. Trump's position is clearly the latter, save them for a few years from now when he is no longer in power and is quite possible dead anyway.

The question for the rest of us, is is Ukraine worth it? Where do we draw the line? If Ukraine falls, do we intervene when Putin invades Poland? Or Germany? France?

“There is no avoiding war; it can only be postponed to the advantage of others.”
Niccolò Machiavelli, The Prince

I don't believe putin does want Poland and I don't think Ukraine should fall at all.
The worst case scenario is putin forces an election, it's fake and he gets his puppet in.

I can't imagine the Russian people want more war either.

If zelensky was on trumps side and did accept some of the terms being banied about I'm not sure if that would make Ukraine position stronger.
If USA wants a "deal" with aluminum then that makes them more invested in the country. They said the mine isn't doing anything right now.

That’s a very simplistic view.

Putin. The comment I replied to.

Proposing ethnic cleansing? (Gaza)
Suggesting taking over a sovereign country? (Canada)
Accusing the leader of a country that was invaded of being a dictator?

There's a theme there. 1930s Germany.

This is the part I struggle with

Trump is just Putin's lapdog now. Total capitulation. He's too stupid to realise he's being controlled. But the hardcore supporters ......I wonder why his blatant cowardice re Russia isn't causing them to desert him?

The first is your feelings not fact.
The second isn’t going to happen.
The third…looking likely.

The theme is you don’t get it.

The first is based on what he said regarding removing Palestinians from Gaza. Against their will from their homeland is the definition of ethnic cleansing. Their words.

The second - so you're saving he's a liar and he didn't mean what he's said numerous times now. Good to know.

Third. Are you on glue?

Shameful.

1. It’s really not
2. Alternatively - a lot of what he is saying (such as Gaza = Dubai Take 2) is being said to act as a motivator for the people in these regions to actually wake up and DO something themselves. I know, right? Imagine that there are possibilities outside of your black and white thinking.

Yes, you’re right about something - how shameful it is that the majority of people seem to have lost critical thinking skills. I can barely muster up the energy to put the above points across in threads like these, and when I do, it’s usually short-lived. It’s simply not worth my time nor energy. I have zero desire to convince you even if I could, which I couldn’t, because you’re not interested in ideas, you’re interested in rhetoric and ideology. It’s so utterly dull.

Enjoy replying. I won’t be reading it.

I’m not convinced you’ve been reading to begin with.

You are absolutely correct that people have lost critical thinking skills. Look at the load of bollocks you've just posted. That demonstrates a major lack of any thinking skills, let alone critical ones.

The irony of your comment is clearly beyond you 😂

Glue = All news sources coming from Social
Media with a particular algorithm creating only an echo chamber of the currently very toxic and highly dangerous misinformation that is akin to Nazi propaganda at the beginning of WWII but far worse as technology means it’s much easier to spread.

Technology also means that we can seek out fact checking and search for alternatives to our own world view. Get news from various sources.

I suspect @Donotwantnot doesn’t engage in the latter from the posts I’ve read of theirs which makes me far less likely to take them seriously.

So yeah. On glue. Not likely to give up the glue. Utterly bonkers.

@Donotwantnot… ”for the people in these regions to actually wake up and DO something themselves”

Wow. Did you actually think those thoughts and then write them down publicly?

That is another level of psychopathy. ‘These people’. JFC. What have I just read?

Where is your humanity? What has gone so horribly wrong in your life that you think like this?

Further proof that you are absolutely not someone worth listening to. Get some therapy.