To think poorly of the OW in this situation?

[Itsnotpink]

3 years ago my children’s dad left after having an affair with another women. They were working away on a job together. The women knew full well he had two young children. One in nursery and one in primary. For months they snuck around acting like love sick teenagers. Going out to dinner, renting holiday homes. All the time ex partner was calling home and lying to me and the kids FaceTiming us. Constantly telling us how busy he was and how stressful work was:

They continue to see each other but live in different countries. Time with our kids is limited with their dad as it is but he seems to find time to holiday and see this women. He will go months without seeing our children.

I still feel raged occasionally about it. I had children with someone who is totally checked out of every physical and mental aspect or parenting. Unless it suits him occasionally. But somehow this women and him think he is a fantastic dad because he pays maintenance?! do women really find guys like this a catch. I sadly had no one to gage him against. But this women knows he is a cheat, a liar and puts himself before his kids. It’s a total mystery to me!!!

I told the ow what i thought of her. Sleeping with a married man who.has two autisitc young childrne at home. I blame my husband much more of course but I don't respect men a great deal and rightly or wrongly I expect women to behave better when it comes to morals and sex. Possibly my upbringing I guess. Yes I am aware ill get flamed but I think unless you've been through a cheating spouse you won't know how you'll feel about it. It takes 2 to tango. I feel the same about his friends who sent fake texts to cover for him. All equally complicit in the lies.

But he would only speak to me on the phone away from her..never in front. I suspect in case the I love you too comes out on the phone call and that won't fit the narrative he told her Such as we don't have sex, I'm controlling blah blah.
In my case I think the other women is both stupid and desperate if she thinks my ex is a catch And hasn't questioned what I told her and that she thinks he'd be faithful to her after cheating on his wife.
Personally I would have nothing to do with a man who had morals do low he'd leave his wife and kids and id tell a taken man to sod off ( and i have done so).. but that's just me.

@superplumb 100% agree. Sounds like we have similar situations. I hope you're ok

So sick of all the virtue signalling on every thread; "internalised misogyny" must be trending somewhere for so many to always use it when it's not appropriate.

I do understand some of you are ow so need to feel blameless but some of you just want to virtue signal. I'm sure the latter also talk about sustainable development when they're not shopping or flying on holidays.😮‍💨

She's a nasty skank. While she isn't as much of a nasty skank as your ex DH in this situation, that's a low bar indeed.

So YANBU at all.

If you think the people pointing out internalised misogyny are virtue signalling, as opposed to the people talking about their moral superiority, invoking a wholly imaginary ‘sisterhood’ and claiming there’s ’something wrong’ with women who don’t do the same, then I would strongly suggest you Google ‘virtue signalling’. As you don’t know what it means.

“internalised misogyny” is just a patronising attempt to let women who behave badly off the hook. It’s got nothing to do with being a woman. If I was bi, I wouldn’t go near a woman with a male partner because I wouldn’t want to shit on him, whether I knew him or not.
A male friends wife has recently buggered off with a much younger, single man. A horrible situation for which the OM is also to blame. He knew she was married with young children. It is really not difficult to avoid shagging married people. I have successfully managed it for decades!
I also don’t feel the need to protect any “sisterhood”. Plenty of people on here demonstrate very clearly that there isn’t one. I do however feel the need to be a decent person and that, for me, includes not shagging people with partners and children. The “I’m alright Jack” mentality baffles me.

No of course you ANBU. I think badly of OW in every single instance. I hope he cheats on her and they both end up miserable and lonely.

Very fresh for me sadly so still in the fog. Hope you're ok

@superplumb It will be ok and you will come out the other side. It's been over a decade for me but it took me a very long time to recover. My story is long and complicated though and I suffered dreadfully at the hands of ex and OW, as did my children. However, there is light and as you say your ex is no prize and it'll be her feeling like this at some point. My ex was already cheating on OW soon after he moved in with her. You reap what you sow.

Consider having some counselling, that helped me a great deal and take care of yourself in any little way that's doable...for me it was nice walks, seeing friends, plenty of exercise, a new top or lipstick. Just a bit of self care. Eat when you can and stay hydrated. Good legal advice is also vital. I wish you well love ❤️

I do however feel the need to be a decent person and that, for me, includes not shagging people with partners and children. The “I’m alright Jack” mentality baffles me.

Indeed. I expect those of us who feel this way would also not knowingly shag a married man whose spouse was male either.

Thanks. Easting and sleeping has gone out the window for me atm. 3 weeks on next Monday when I caught him . It athe lies and gaslightinf I'm struggling with as well as the general cruelty of what he put me through.
Everyone else says time heals but it's hard to believe that yet.

@ForZanyAquaViewer Let's imagine for a minute that you have a husband. You've also got some very young children at home that you are the primary caregiver for. You all struggle without him while he's at work, but know he has to work to support you and the children. You are in a vulnerable position, and you are all very reliant on him. He comes home one day and tells you about a younger female coworker who has struck up a friendship with him. They spend lots of time together as friends, she knows all about you and your little children and how he supports you all. You think she's lovely, and have no suspicions because you trust your husband.

Despite this, one day she decides she wants to fuck him. She starts making sexual advances, arranging times they will be alone for her to flirt with him, and tries her best to turn his head. Let's imagine your husband isn't a cheating scumbag, rejects her and tells you.

Do you still think this woman is as good a person as any? Do you see her in the exact same light as all his other friends (that may or may not know you) who aren't actively disrespecting you, your children and your marriage?

Would you stop them being friends?

I'm very curious about the inner workings of this individualistic perspective of yours and want to understand where your line is!

Why are some posters talking about human beings as if they can be 'taken' or 'stolen away'? They can't. They're sentient beings with free will. Nobody can take them or steal them.

The regular 'you must be an OW' crap comes up here so often and it's the laziest most risible non-comment. Just because somebody stands against the foul language and blame levied at women in an affair, doesn't mean that they're of the same view.

Nobody who is having an affair with a married person is justified in doing so, they're never in the right and what they are doing is causing misery if and when they are caught. The married party takes full blame and responsibility because they and they alone could have prevented it all. The other party has made a shitty decision to be complicit in the affair but they are not responsible for it.

Hush now! (though I'm old enough to remember when she was the devil incarnate - though TBF Charles was a figure of opprobrium too)

I don't see why we can't just say AP instead of OW. It always brings the 'internalised misogyny' brigade to the thread.

I believe affairs are abusive. They remove personal agency and our right to informed sexual consent. They involve lying, deceit, manipulation and gaslighting. They put the betrayed at risk of sexual, mental and emotional harm.

I don't understand how disliking a person who would involve themselves in the abuse of another is showing internalised misogyny.

And as for 'vulnerability' of APs all I've ever seen from affairs is the passing of their pain on to someone who didn't deserve it (and the children of the primary relationship too).

I've also not known a female AP who didn't twist the knife in to an unsuspecting betrayed when dday happened and sadly that is particularly women APs. My own case included.

I think maybe it feels better to blame The Evil Skanky Homewrecker With No Morals than the man you fell in love, deemed to be a good man, had children with and built a life together. Otherwise how could you have got it so wrong?

I think it quite natural for a wife in this situation to blame the OW, as well as her husband. What the split of blame is I don't think can be defined. No one in that situation is going to take a minute to think well I blame him 51% and her 49% or whatever.

If you've been blindsided by the man having an affair and up to that point everything seemed fine and you still love him, and maybe, at least initially, you think it could be something you can work through, while you'll have immense anger at him and might never forgive him, he is still someone you've loved, possibly for years, so that initial anger might dissipate, if they decide to stay together.

The wife's initial anger at the OW is justified. It's not misogyny. The OW is a complete stranger who has contributed to her harm so the wife owes her nothing. The OW has come into her world, affecting her life and her children's lives and all of their financial security and well-being, now and in the future - that's if the OW knew about her. Without an OW the marriage might still exist, even if it isn't a truly happy one, and most marriages have ups and downs. Does no one's own mother or parents say you just don't go there? Mine did. Or over the years I heard my mother and her friends talking about situations like these that happened to people within their circle and the devastation caused, as they saw it first hand.

So I think it natural to blame the OW in what is a completely fraught situation. That hate doesn't last forever. People move on. There's lots of variables to consider as well. It really isn't black and white that the OW is due no blame at all. Such simplistic thinking. Dare I say it, it is "fascinating" people have heard oh he's to blame as he's the one that made the promises to the wife, not the OW, and just repeated it - I think that is a trope.

I don't get why people think blame is a finite thing and blaming one party means the other gets less blame....you can entirely and completely blame both. Nothing to do with sisterhood and everything yo do with just not being a dick. It's really that simple.

Now you’re likening a husband (a human being with agency) to a pet that can be ‘lured’ or an inanimate object - a possession - that can be ‘stolen’ or ‘taken’.

And this is, quite frankly, an insane thing to say: For the love of God, please don't have children

At this point, I don’t think you’re capable of understanding my (or any) logic. As the kids say, go touch some grass.

Agree. I find a married woman and a single bloke having an affair just as rank as the sexes being reversed.

Anyone knowingly having an affair is a scumbag imo, nothing to do with what sex they are. I despise liars and cheats so can’t begin to understand the appeal of having a relationship with someone who has those vile traits.

Has the cat post been deleted?

It would appear so! Very speedily. It’s almost a shame, as it was one of the maddest things I’ve ever read.

You're really prone to exaggeration ForZany. "insane" and "one of the maddest things you've ever read"? Really.

Then you say to DonnyBurrito "I don’t think you’re capable of understanding my (or any) logic." I think you're a shit stirrer.

Ahh, how predictable... You haven't engaged at all with anything that challenges your rigid thinking.

Yes, as even kids nowadays are taught not to harm others, even if they really want to! I suspect you wouldnt agree to the status quo on that one.