Brilliant article about the rape gangs in the UK

[Petrine]

I’ve put this on AIBU as it appears to be most read. A brilliant article about the rape gangs and the ensuing cover up.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/07/elon-musk-has-ripped-cloak-of-deceit-off-britain-scandal/

I’d rather just leave the thread if that is how it is going to be. This is getting too political for me anyway and I’d rather like to use this forum in the future for more mundane life issues.

Im listening to Woman’s hour right now.
Absolutely horrific.
Its still going on.

There isn’t a limit of the number of victims in a situation. The girls who were, and are being, abused are victims and innocent Muslims who face hate and physical attacks for their faith are also victims.

If they are targeted for abuse because of their faith, and they are not the perpetrators they are victims. They aren't victims simply because people are talking about the decades of organised abuse carried out by thousands of men from their community.

and innocent Muslims who face hate and physical attacks for their faith are also victims.

Yes but this is precisely why it is imperative that these things are not brushed under the carpet and abuse should not be allowed to continue or be left unsaid because it is considered 'right wing' to discuss.

Turning a blind eye because of the faith of these abusers is causing hate not stopping it.

I have no idea why people can't see that.

"their’ women are choosing to be with these dark, handsome and confident ‘foreign’ men, over them.

Dear God! Have you seen some of the mugshots of these "dark, handsome" men? You have got a strange idea of what a desirable looking man looks like if you have.

Do you know anything about the rape, abuse and torture these vulnerable little girls (not "women" in most cases) have suffered at the hands of these men?

You must be out of your mind if you think they are "choosing to be with" them.

You have said some pretty outrageous and offensive things on this thread. You must be either incredibly ill-informed or a troll.

You can’t accuse Tories of wanting diversity. Why didn’t they do anything?

Yes but this is precisely why it is imperative that these things are not brushed under the carpet and abuse should not be allowed to continue or be left unsaid because it is considered 'right wing' to discuss.

Turning a blind eye because of the faith of these abusers is causing hate not stopping it.

I have no idea why people can't see that.

Exactly. People are going to continue to discuss it, anyway. It would be better to be able to demonstrate that it isn't being ignored. Or the pressure will continue to mount on Starmer and the government.

I’ve been pretty clear that I don’t think anyone should turn a blind eye because of faith. I don’t think the solution is never talking about perpetrators religion or ethnicity but how we talk about it, and who we blame and expect to take action, is important.

Every instance like this should be FULLY investigated- every single avenue should be explored as to why this happened. In France people are openly talking about misogyny in French Society and what consent means, together with how the internet was used. It is important to look at ALL potential factors so the causes can be addressed. No one in France is saying don’t look at whether misogyny was a driving force here.

But it is documented in the reports that there was a fear of discussing the perpetrators ethnicity and religion as no one wanted to be called racist or Islamaphobic. The statement from the Muslim Council of Britain is basically setting out its stall that these things are off limits.

Yet these things are common to the vast majority of members of these child rape gangs. The documented descriptions by the scum who did this indicate an othering of white girls seeing them as legitimate targets. Therefore, in order to address past and continuing atrocities by these child rape and torture hangs it is important to look at how ethnicity and/or religion feeds into this. Only by looking at all possible angles will the problem be addressed. Nothing should be off limits. The only thing that matters is justice for the victims and to stop this happening again. This requires leaving no stone unturned.

Just repeating Andrew Norfolk's comment from an article in The Times yesterday. He's also quite complimentary to Starmer which will please some posters here.

“Why one very small sub-section of one minority ethnic community was so overwhelmingly, disproportionately responsible for these crimes — that is work that would be vital in bringing about understanding that could enable changes to take place. How do you address it and stamp it out if you don’t understand why it is happening in the first place?”

He warned that “everybody is still too scared”, but it was a vacuum that allowed the far right to continue exploiting grooming victims.

“It’s the void into which Elon Musk and [the far-right activist] Tommy Robinson can shout, spread lies and poison.”

Yet these things are common to the vast majority of members of these child rape gangs. The documented descriptions by the scum who did this indicate an othering of white girls seeing them as legitimate targets. Therefore, in order to address past and continuing atrocities by these child rape and torture hangs it is important to look at how ethnicity and/or religion feeds into this. Only by looking at all possible angles will the problem be addressed. Nothing should be off limits. The only thing that matters is justice for the victims and to stop this happening again. This requires leaving no stone unturned.

YY.

If you are referring to Musk here then he's been given something to poke at by the inaction of the police and politicians of all parties who have turned a blind eye.

He is a provocateur.

Women and children's safety should not be a party political issue. It is certainly not a far right discussion point.

So if a report finds for example there is widespread extreme misogyny being unchallenged within the Pakistani Muslim community and that this is actually a reflection of the way that Islam is taught and practiced in that community what would you suggest doing? What would you suggest the Muslim council of Britain do?

I’ve been pretty clear that I don’t think anyone should turn a blind eye because of faith. I don’t think the solution is never talking about perpetrators religion or ethnicity but how we talk about it, and who we blame and expect to take action, is important.

Completely agree. But if it's left up to rabble rousers to have the conversation because reasonable, thoughtful people won't go there, that conversation will take place in a way that might be difficult to steer.

What’s disgusting about it? They support an enquiry but also warned about those with a racist agenda.

Maybe that hits too close to home for some hence the posturing.

Maybe you’d like the MCB to take the blame for Covid and Brexit whilst you’re at it.

They support an enquiry

Good, let's crack on then.

Nothing should be off limits in looking at the causes of these heinous crimes. I agree.

But the trouble is race is being used as a divisive tool here by people with nefarious aims.

Race and heritage can be a part of the understanding of a crime, when it is part of the specific crime, but the exploitation of vulnerable young people is carried out by all manner of monsters. White, brown, and if there were purple skinned men, you bet there would be purple skinned men doing this too.

By focussing too much on race, heritage and religion, we are missing the bigger picture and playing into the hands of racists.

The inquiry, if there is one, should be a broad one into how agencies worked to protect vulnerable young people and bring perpetrators to justice - what went right and what went wrong. If there were cover ups then this needs exposing.

But, it should be focused on the heinous behaviour and how we sort it out, not used as a tool to embolden the racists and give credence to their views.

It’s a perspective that only lives in your head.
It can’t be easy being you.

Are you ?? Ok you’re reading your old notes then.

The inquiry, if there is one, should be a broad one into how agencies worked to protect vulnerable young people and bring perpetrators to justice - what went right and what went wrong. If there were cover ups then this needs exposing.

There WERE cover ups precisely because of fear of allegations of racism.

This is why the race of the rapists is important.

Interesting that India Today want to make it clear that the gangs should not be referred to as Asian Grooming gangs but Pakistani Grooming gangs.

Ann Cryer mp in the early 2000’s tried to raise the issues of grooming in Keighley.

In Keighley, she tried to get the Pakistani community on side after learning that the News of the World had offered the seven mothers £1,000 to tell their story. "I thought, if this happens, knowing the way the News of the Worldwould handle it, it would cause chaos and ruin any sort of race relations that we had. We could have race riots, the works."

So she asked a friend, a Muslim councillor of Pakistani heritage, to approach the elders at the mosque with a list of 35 names and addresses of the alleged perpetrators. "He said to the imams, 'Ann Cryer would like you to go around to these families and explain that this behaviour is totally un-Islamic.' But the upshot was that the elders allegedly said, 'Go back to Ann Cryer and tell her it's nothing to do with us.' "

I do wonder if there is an inherent misogyny angle to this that hasn’t been explored, as in men on the right are frustrated that,
in their eyes, ‘their’ women are choosing to be with these dark, handsome and confident ‘foreign’ men, over them. There could be some crossover with incel culture, racial inferiority complex’s and being part of a culture that is rightly ostracised by polite society

Tweens and teens are not “women”.

Victims do not “choose” to be raped and abused by scores of men. It is vanishingly unlikely that any female would ever consent to being vaginally raped with a hairbrush, having a bicycle pump inserted into her anus, or being branded with a hot pin, which is what happened to these young girls (amongst other things).

What about the Sikh victims of rape and abuse, who I presume were PoC?

The perpetrators are repellent, not “handsome”.

If this utterly offensive tripe is genuinely what those seeking justice are up against, it immeasurably strengthens the case for a review. The lunatics have taken over the asylum.

The MCB doesn’t decide if there is an enquiry.