Absolutely shit scared about the future in the UK?

[JDNCh]

Name changed - I’m genuinely terrified by the hate, division and atmosphere here right now, online and spilling over on the ‘the real world’. I’m scared by how quickly things are changing, and just how much influence the US/Elon Musk/Reform+supporters are having. I’m scared of what the actual point of it all is - what’s the endgame? And what’s the solution? Why is no one protesting/rising up from the other way? Do people generally agree with all this?

I’m in no way a minority (white, female, 30s), I’m not super left, I have one little boy and I’m so scared for his future. I don’t want to live somewhere so intolerant with this constant atmosphere of distrust and something getting ready to blow.

What’s the general consensus? Is this what the people of the U.K. want?

I do know quite a lot about it. I do my research. I agree completely that more needs to be done, not only in terms of prosecuting grooming gang members but holding those in authority to account. I feel there were strong elements of classis and mysogyny in the way it's been handled.

How is that saying your experiences were irrelevant?

Because I wasn't just talking about taxi drivers. I was talking about my experience predatory men I had come across who I could imagine might have been part of these gangs, operating as they often did as taxi drivers. It's said that 1 in every 73 Pakistani men in Rotherham has been prosecuted for their involvement in a grooming gang. Yes, men of all races are rapists, but i wasn't trying to claim they weren't.

And "I'd rather walk past a mosque than Wetherspoons" is a fatuous comment, that someone else made. Wetherspoons is a pub, a mosque is a place of worship. It doesn't mean you're actually safer with men from either background. It's a non point.

What does the data on sexual assault crimes by ethnicity once you take into account per capita?

Its not a non point at all.
Its about groups of men gathering together - and nobody outside a mosque has ever shouted "nice tits" at my 12 year old daughter!

and nobody outside a mosque has ever shouted "nice tits" at my 12 year old daughter!

Men who went to mosques anally raped other 12 year old girls, so it is an absolute non point. All men can be rapists.

Honestly, the attempts by several posters to "prove" that white men are worse than all other men are shocking. This is about decades of organised rape gangs with specific common features, and the response to it, not whether one race is better or worse than the other. I'm not a far right agitator.

Again, putting words into people's months. We're not trying to prove white men are worse. I believe most people are OK, most men are OK, bad people exist in all races.
I agree that more needs to be done about the Asian grooming gangs (and all other grooming gangs). I agree it's an absolute scandal if this was brushed under the carpet by those in power.
We all agree with you about the horror of what's happened.

We're not trying to prove white men are worse.

You went out of your way to say that you had only had problems with white men. Why is that relevant to whether organised gangs of men from a particular culture violently preyed on girls in multiple locations for decades, and thousands of people who had a duty of care either didn't care or didn't want to intervene for fear of "racial tensions"?

I don't think white men are worse, I don't think any colour of men is better/worse.

This is not a thread denying that white men can be rapists, or sexually harass women in the street. It's a thread started by a person who is worried about the far right and the platform social media is giving them.

The far right have seized on this issue for years because many people, particularly in the areas affected, don't believe that the issue of grooming gangs is being dealt with adequately, and the far right are pointing to immigration as the root cause. Many of the men involved aren't recent immigrants, so this is misleading, but it's an easy sell.

You will feel a whole lot better if you stop using social media. Yes, things are bad, but social media highlights the worst of the worst and brings it right to your attention, from the second you wake up to the second you go to bed. Getting rid of it would be the best thing you ever do, I promise you that.

It won't make the world perfect, but the world never has been perfect. It's just that these days the imperfections are right at our fingertips.

The reason I and others are saying we've had more problems with white men is because we feel the current rhetoric is rather dangerous. We can absolutely condemn the situation with these grooming gangs and they way it was handled and feel concern that right wing people are using this to malign all Muslims and stir up division and hatred. Both of these things are true: the grooming gangs are horrific and evil and the vast majority of decent, law abiding Muslims being targeted and harassed is concerning and unacceptable.
I have nothing against people discussing the grooming gangs and examining the fact that these men were predominantly Asian. In fact, I think it must happen. But you can't deny that people setting fire to mosques, ripping the hijab of Muslim women, harassing people in the street is unacceptable. As I said, I know people this is happening to abd my own Indian husband has been harassed. It's not because the facts were reported objectively, it's because people have been deliberately using this awful situation to cause division. The people doing this don't care about the abuse of young girls when it's EDL members raping them.

The reason I and others are saying we've had more problems with white men is because we feel the current rhetoric is rather dangerous.

Yes, so you and others feel the self righteous need to step in and handwave away accounts of violence or harassment by other races of men as if your anecdotal experience of white men is supposed to cancel them out. It's dismissive and patronising.

This is about this specific issue. It's not a competition as to whose "values" are best.

The more people go "nothing to see here, nothing extraordinary is happening" regards this issue, the more the far right will capitalise on it.

I agree. That's what scares me more for my children's futures.

But you can't deny that people setting fire to mosques, ripping the hijab of Muslim women, harassing people in the street is unacceptable.

Why on earth would you think I would deny it? Those things are appalling too. People need to be able to talk about all these things openly. You wouldn't agree that those Muslim women shouldn't be heard due to "inflaming racial tensions" either, would you? Yet it's exactly what people in various locations and various levels of government have said about these girls and young women.

Once again, you're misrepresenting what I said. I am not handwaving away accounts of violence. As I just said, these issues must be discussed and examined. At the same time if everywhere you look you see people claiming that Muslims are peados, Muslims are rapists' then it's entirely reasonable to say "Hang on a minute, white men do this too."

Every time I go on X, every time I go on Facebook I see people making claims like "Muslims are peados. They don't belong in this country." As we know the vast majority are not sexual offenders and innocent people are being attacked we do need to speak out against this rhetoric.
To emphasise, (because no doubt you'll twist my words again). We mustn't be silent about the grooming gangs, we must examine what happened closely. We must also speak out against hateful language and misinformation against Muslims.

Yes and that's very wrong

It’s not self righteous, it’s giving perspective. The home office data is the majority of grooming gangs are white. The majority of rapists are white.

There is an issue with the males in a particular community (Mirpuri) that needs to be tackled through education and police action.

The females affected are white girls but Mirpuri women have also said they’ve suffering with sexual harassment and then also being married to men in the Mirpuri community. This needs a whole lens view, not just the lens of Musk supporters looking to demonise all Muslims.

I find it shocking that this has been brushed under the carpet. All men can be awful, all men can be sexual pests, rape and sexually abuse.

however, quieting voices who speak up due to “sensitivities” is in my mind continuing to deny what happened to these girls, the more people are trying to shut up others who discuss this, or to minimise it due to “the right thing” and not “inflame tensions”, the more the far right will move in. Not discussing this does not work. If it had worked, it would have stopped,

I want an investigation. I would like to have every single email, communication and decision by all authorities who came into contact with this. Anyone who turned a blind eye should be prosecuted.

i don’t care who you are, if you are an ethic minority or the Archbishop of Canterbury. If you look the other way when children are abused you should go to jail.

It’s not self righteous, it’s giving perspective. The home office data is the majority of grooming gangs are white.

The "home office data" is incomplete, and that "conclusion" is just agenda based whitewashing to cover up the reality of the grooming gang phenomenon as a specific thing. They have framed it in a particular way to get that.

I find it shocking that this has been brushed under the carpet. All men can be awful, all men can be sexual pests, rape and sexually abuse.

however, quieting voices who speak up due to “sensitivities” is in my mind continuing to deny what happened to these girls, the more people are trying to shut up others who discuss this, or to minimise it due to “the right thing” and not “inflame tensions”, the more the far right will move in. Not discussing this does not work. If it had worked, it would have stopped

This, exactly.

What exactly about Reform or Trump scares you? What awful terrible things happened last time Trump was in power....nothing

Maybe you're scared Reform will get in and the country will actually be better off

You're acting as if Nazi Germany are about to take over. In the nicest possible way, you need to calm down

I don't believe this. What evidence do you have?

If the Labour government do a good job the next 5 years, then people won't vote in Reform.

Maybe you should be more worried about Labour doing a bad job