DS wants to charge

[CompleteOvaryAction]

DH and I are planning a big birthday party in the near future - live music , catering, marquis etc, for a joint "big 0" birthday.
Our DS will be in his third year as a music student and we mentioned we'd like his band to play for some of the evening. He wants us to pay him going rate for his services.
I feel that, for close family you waive your professional fee (we'd expect to pay his band mates) but he's adamant he wants paying too.
It feels like he doesn't appreciate that he's only where he is now because we have funded him. Whilst we don't expect "payback" it would be nice if he thought to acknowledge our help with a gesture of his time for our special celebration.
Is this just his inexperience talking? should we stand our ground, or does he have a point?
I'd rather not have him play, and just have him there as a guest if he insists on charging to play. What do you think?

If he wad a brickie or a sparky or similar would you expect him to do work for you for free?

No I get that. But so what? OP shouldn’t muddy the relationship.

YABU. Pay none or all.

Your son is right but then that gives you the option of going elsewhere. It’s nice to get a family discount but it should not be expected - especially when his mates are being paid full whack.

This screams of influencers 'give me stiff for free for exposure'

Why would you expect your son to work for free? This is his job, just because it's within the creative industry doesn't make it less so!

So…you’re saying he can’t earn any money that night, either by playing at your party, or by taking a paid gig? You wont be hiring him. If you hire someone, you pay them for whatever they’re doing for you.

I think the way it would play out in our family is us offering to pay him to perform, him saying no, that’s fine, and us giving him something anyway! Presumably you are better off financially than he is?

No you should pay him too, he's part of the band. If you'd spent the money on kit and lessons for him because he was good at a particular sport rather than music related you wouldn't be able to consider a freebie like this.
You've soured things between you now, might as well go and hire an established professional band who charge MU rates, have him sat there purely as a guest and people wondering why his band weren't asked to play.

Musicians are always being expected to play for "exposure" or free drinks rather than actual money which pays, you know, bills and expenses.

I think you're being very tight claiming a freebie from him and possibly uttering the immortal words "after all I've done for you" your son is absolutely right to be standing his ground. I hope modern music colleges actually give some coaching these days on how to deal with people wanting freebies.

Whichever band you use, I hope they'll be getting the same food as your guests rather than curled up sandwiches in a dusty cupboard round the back somewhere.
Your post and attitude indicates your party might well find its way on to a gigs from hell page somewhere in the internet...

I think you need to pay the band as a whole, or none of them. It depends if they usually get booked for paying gigs and how willing the other band members are. I don't think you can pay the other band members though and not him. It's probably better to just get another band and avoid the problem altogether.

Ah come on, getting a paying gig is a big deal! And if you're paying the rest of the band it's just mean.

Invite him to the party.
Hire different musicians.

He might not really want to perform at your party, this takes that aspect away. He should of course expect to attend a special family event, he clearly has had plenty of notice and doesn't have another job booked.
Separate the ideas of your son attending and performers. It becomes much easier.

Yes, within reason.
I myself have provided professional services free to my parents, in-laws and best friends. I've also charged mates-rates to less close family and friends.
It feels strange to ask for payment when you love someone.

She already said she understands having to pay his mates.

Initially I thought 'entitled - no way' - but when you add in paying the other band members, it's a bit more complex.
I'd go for an alternative - if he wants to do a solo number at the event, that would be nice (FOC)

As a matter of interest, are you funding him at uni while he is earning from his band activities?

I can see your point about not charging family, and that as parents you’ve funded his studies.

However, I do think the right thing to do here is to pay the whole band their going rate, and let them figure it out rather than isolating your son. It seems a bit patronising to expect any of them to work for free- I just don’t think it’s a battle to fight over.

That is your choice though

Perhaps he wanted you to acknowledge and take seriously his profession and would have turned around and said "I don't want paying, happy birthday" when you tried to pay him. Or would have returned it.

But you expecting him to give you freebies is the problem

@CompleteOvaryAction If I were your DS, no way would I expect or demand to be paid. It'd be a thank you gift to my parents for everything they'd done bringing me up, and for their special birthday.

He's also still a student, not a professional with global clients. (Are you funding his third year?)

But, if he feels like this, I agree the best thing would be to drop it and hire other music, not argue about it.

Well I agree I’d be pissed at him, but don’t dwell on it - just hire someone else.

If he was a solo artist, I'd agree with you OP but he has his bandmates to consider.

Why should they give you a free session?

And what's "within reason" ?
Presumably you'd know you needed to pay costs for equipment and parts? You wouldn't expect those funded?

She's said she'd pay the bandmates.

I play in a band and have played friends' and family functions.

They'll get mates' rates to an extent (generally 10-15% less than MU rates), but no more, mostly because I think it devalues the work of others.

In addition, getting to a gig costs us, in terms of practice time, travel/fuel (sometimes accommodation), not to mention our gear (PA and lights) and insurance.

Generally speaking, if I have taken on a mate's gig, I will take the hit so that my band mates still get paid in full (I can afford to do that because I have a professional day job, but two members of the band are full-time musicians).

If your son's band has X number of members, then you should agree to pay six (for example) members, but perhaps your son could negotiate his share down.

It feels strange to me not to treat a son you love, and presumably want to carve out a successful career in the music industry, as a musician worthy of payment, to show how proud you are of him, if nothing else. You are proud of him being in a band good enough to get paid gigs, aren’t you?

Yay we’re having a big joint birthday party, shall we get a builder to pop a wall up or a sparky to do some re-wiring whilst we light the candles on the cake?

Not the same at all!!!

Of course you should pay one fee to the band, not indvidu Members. Maybe with a parent discount. But if they regularly get paid work then they should be free to earn full whack somewhere else.

its tricky as a band as he doesn’t get final say it’s a group choice. His other members might not want to play a discounted show when they can earn more.

tell him what you can offer and let him take or leave it. There’s no need to guilt him, it maybe less hassle to just hire someone else.

@CompleteOvaryAction comes across as entirely reasonable. Says she has done work for family and friends and charged nothing. This is a really normal thing that nice people do.

Of course she'd pay expenses/costs of materials if her son were an electrician and did some work for her.