Gov refuses home office investigation into historic child sex abuse in Oldham

[Perzival]

I've just read on x that Jess Phillips has formally declined Oldham council's request for the HO to investigate the grooming gangs in Oldham. Why on Earth would they do this? Apparently JP says it should be a local investigation? Clearly that is a conflict of interests and if the council are asking for help they should?

The only link I can find other than x is GB news (apologies).

https://www.gbnews.com/news/oldham-grooming-gangs-labour-government-inquiry-abuse-scandal

The cost of trying to deport these awful men… and the audacity to say ‘I couldn’t have groomed anyone I don’t speak English’ - abhorrent!

amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/oct/26/rochdale-grooming-gang-members-adil-khan-qari-abdul-rauf-to-be-deported-to-pakistan

Can’t see anything saying they have actually been deported, despite losing their appeal in 2022.

www.rochdaleonline.co.uk/news-features/2/news-headlines/154785/gm-mayor-to-seek-update-on-deportation-of-adil-khan-and-qari-abdul-rauf-who-still-live-in-rochdale-six-years-after-2018-home-office-pledge

And if anyone doubts the men hate white girls then here’s a link to sentencing remarks. This isn’t grooming, that suggests a man love bombing with flowers and gifts in order to have sex. This was violence, threats to kill. Parents having to sell their homes to move. It is very clear they despised the girls. Its get worse as you read more and more. This is not just about sex in my opinion, they clearly hated the white girls.

The details are horrid so TRIGGER WARNING if you click.

https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/JCO/Documents/Judgments/sentencing-remarks-r-v-dogar-others.pdf

Labour and Conservatives are both to blame. As are councillors. Police. Social workers. THEY need to be investigated.

If the current Labour Gov and the former Conservative government feel they did a good job at investigating and prosecuting and deporting and handling the community etc then they won’t mind it going global. If they continue to say Far Right and

The Jay report only mentioned Rotherham once apparently (I haven’t read it) and criticisms include the fact the gov only looked at some towns and not the main towns affected. Happy to be wrong on this but there is only so much you can read in 36 hours.

One ringleader was welfare rights officer at the council.

news.sky.com/story/oldham-grooming-report-finds-police-and-councils-failed-to-protect-some-children-from-sexual-exploitation-12637246

Since I've been overwhelmed with the fact that these gangs are everywhere and I've been getting the locations mixed up I think it should be clear that these sentencing remarks relate to Oxford and not to Oldham (or Rotherham).

I do think it's important not to have the messaging be "this all happened because nice middle-class people were afraid of seeming racist in front of their other white friends at dinner parties".

That definitely seems to be part of it but it also seems to be blatant corruption in many places as well. Which needs to be punished. The "nice" enablers are a problem but they aren't the abusers!

But even from the DEI angle it may not be just a matter of "harden your hearts and stop being scared". There may be deeper "hard" structural issues - for example if there are any equalities laws that made it difficult to collect ethnicity data, or if anyone cited specific hate speech laws to shut down discussion etc. Those should be identified and rooted out.

"Inflaming community tensions" also goes beyond just "it might make things a bit awkward in the lunch room". When you have critical mass it can mean physical violence, riots etc. And that in particular includes riots from the white community, which is much larger, and would be almost impossible to police at scale without corresponding violence from the state. There are concrete reasons, that of course SHOULDN'T affect how we seek justice for abused women and girls, but nevertheless might be very important for understanding why they HAVE.

"Inflaming community tensions" also goes beyond just "it might make things a bit awkward in the lunch room". When you have critical mass it can mean physical violence, riots etc. And that in particular includes riots from the white community, which is much larger, and would be almost impossible to police at scale without corresponding violence from the state. There are concrete reasons, that of course SHOULDN'T affect how we seek justice for abused women and girls, but nevertheless might be very important for understanding why they HAVE.

If anything though, how this was handled has been catastophic in terms of inflaming community tensions.

There is now a wide perception that it has been condoned and covered up and that Pakistani Muslim men have been protected and allowed to rape white children with impunity, and that anyone speaking up will be imprisoned for it.

What am I missing?

What is that supposed to mean?

Or is this another way of saying people should shut up for the sake of diversity?

Oh I agree.

But it worked for 20+ years.

Some of the transcripts circulating now are from trials from 2013.

I think so, there seem to be alot of posters who dont like the fact the fingers are not being pointed at white people for once.

Anyone who can shine a light on subjects our government are apparently frightened to confront.

absolutely anyone.

there was an inquiry into this in 2022 - and several others over the years into different localities I think.
Let alone why Musk is getting involved - why are the Tories calling for a "long overdue" inquiry so soon after the last one? If that one was not deemed thorough enough, why? Why did they not commission another, or ask the original inquiry team to revisit? - or do the job properly in the frost place?
Money would be belter spent on addressing the problems

Link to the 468 page report attached

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20221020120938/www.iicsa.org.uk/key-documents/31216/view/report-independent-inquiry-into-child-sexual-abuse-october-2022_0.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Wayback Machine

I read both the Jay reports last night. I do think they skirt around the issue of race, but the point of the reports was to understand the systematic failure of the government agencies that were supposed to identify, stop and intervene in CSA. The inquiries weren’t set up to understand whether the rape gangs were endemic to any particular cultural group, or more likely to flourish in particular cultures.

My ultimate take home message was that the police are utterly incompotent, deeply misogynistic and society is unable to trust them with the safety of women and girls, or the prosecution of those who do violence against women or girls. The local taxi licensing department at the council repeatedly failed to get South Yorkshire Police to take action, even though taxi drivers must be licensed and pass a DBS check.

The Jay report has been criticised due to not including the main towns and mentioning Rotherham only once. I have not read it (only so much I can read). I am happy to be corrected if someone has had chance to read it.

Charlie Peters on X appears to be very knowledgable and has researched extensively. Again I have not had chance to read all his tweets (are they still called tweets on x?).
He has also interviewed dozens of survivors.

At lease some one on here does their research 💯%

Every. Single. Word. 👋

My ultimate take home message was that the police are utterly incompotent, deeply misogynistic and society is unable to trust them with the safety of women and girls, or the prosecution of those who do violence against women or girls. The local taxi licensing department at the council repeatedly failed to get South Yorkshire Police to take action, even though taxi drivers must be licensed and pass a DBS check.

All of this is true, and it is an important point. But I do think the ultimate message should focus on the perpetrators of the crimes, including the cultural context in which these criminal behaviours arose. The police played their appalling role, but they weren't the ones doing the actual raping.

I think social services also deserve their share of opprobrium.

Yes - important to not lose sight of this.

The cultural patterns are the same in dozens of towns.

It's not enough to prosecute individual gang members and call it a day while leaving the cultural setup exactly the same.

Agree entirely but I don’t think anyone in government is brave enough to start an inquiry into the behaviour of Pakistani Muslim communities that enabled mass rape gangs to thrive, are they? We’ve had inquiries into institutions and government organisations, but not into more nebulous communities, let alone ones that would come with significant cultural/racial/ethnic baggage.

And so long as we aren’t brave enough to have those conversations, we leave that playing field to the Elon Musks and Nigel Farages….

Rupert Lowe MP

I have calls lined up all afternoon with campaigners and victims of the rape gang scandal - if the Government won't hold a proper inquiry, we will do it ourselves. Thank you to everybody who has got in touch - these atrocities go far deeper and far wider than we realise

This is from X

Not sure if this means they are looking at doing a private enquiry or whether that is possible but I am glad he is trying.

Another man who has researched this topic - Raja Miah - he explains what was going on in Oldham.

x.com/recusant_raja/status/1874794846348595696/mediaViewer?currentTweet=1874794846348595696&currentTweetUser=recusant_raja&mode=profile

Please watch the videos on urban scoop ..they explain everything

Goodness me, Channel 4 will be showing a documentary next week about a woman who made false grooming claims against Asian men. Reprehensible to lie, of course, but this is one false victim among tens of thousands of genuine victims. And that's who Channel 4 focuses on?!

www.channel4.com/programmes/accused-the-fake-grooming-scandal

They'd be well advised to pull that 😵‍💫

What I’d like to know is who in the British government made the decision to make the Muslim community untouchable and enable them to carry out crimes with impunity. Somewhere along the line it has been decided that this community will be allowed to police itself. The police - certainly the Met - won’t investigate crimes involving the community, and in my experience (I own a nursery in an area of London where there are a lot of vulnerable families and safeguarding issues), social workers won’t take referrals involving community members, even when those referrals flag up as ‘red’ on their traffic light system. One of them actually told me, ‘Yes, it’s a red, but it’s not safeguarding.’ The father was a community leader and the social worker knew him.

How has it come to this? Who is pulling the strings in this country and why is it being allowed to happen? Are individual members of the government being blackmailed or threatened like the teacher in Batley? Who exactly is Lord Ali and how much of this is his influence? Were any members of the government involved in these crimes or did they just cover them up? Why are comments on here trying to deflect attention onto Elon Musk and the so-called ‘far right’. Have people been brainwashed to the extent that they can’t see this for what the crime against humanity that it is or do they have an agenda to protect themselves?

How have we sunk so low as a nation that this hasn’t brought the government down?