Child Safeguarding Win, Puberty Blockers have been indefinitely banned across the ENTIRE of the UK (for off label use, precocious puberty use remains)

[MrBungle]

A great day for child safeguarding, this is evidence, reason and medical expertise over pressure groups.

https://archive.ph/mWufj

A terrible shame for those children that this is too late for, who have been permanently harmed by ideologues and will never be able to have their body back the way it should have grown.

"Puberty blockers for under-18s banned after warning of ‘unacceptable risk’ to children
Existing emergency measures in UK outlawing sale and supply to be made indefinite following official advice from medical experts"

So are you just going to carry on posting and pretend you didn't just blatantly lie about knowing young people whose deaths have been hidden from stats for nefarious transphobic purposes? Illuminating.

So are you just going to carry on posting and pretend you didn't just blatantly lie about knowing young people whose deaths have been hidden from stats for nefarious transphobic purposes?

... and, in addition, explaining why you don't seem to have any concerns about the safety and risk implications to* *yourself and others, given that these medications haven't been properly assessed over the long term? Mystifying.

Affinity seem to be an up and coming union?
The Free Speech Union have a good track record of intervening to protect rights?

There are a number of links to alternatives in this thread:

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5074101-i-need-a-new-union

Strange that Streeting's most recent announcement mentioned targeted mental health support resources for those who have had their future options removed, and Prof Appleby's own roadmap statement has mentioned the need to downplay the link in upcoming releases.

Why would they need to do this if there is no increased risk? Rather odd behaviour isn't it?

If it were proven that there's no link, why would they be running damage control on something that doesn't exist? Why would they be rushing to discredit the next stats release? Why would they have p-hacked the previous dataset?

It rings particularly hollow when you personally know - and knew - people affected by the reality of this grotesque ongoing culture war.

As with all such matters, it's easier to pretend and turn a blind eye when you are talking in broad hypotheticals. It's a lot harder when you have to walk past the sad little bundles of flowers and tear-stained unread letters every day enroute to work, and when you cannot help but hear the agonising echoes of desperate voices praying for politicians to listen.

and Prof Appleby's own roadmap statement has mentioned the need to downplay the link in upcoming releases

Because suicide is known to be something that can lead to copycat behaviour, and has been shown to be influenced by online sources and reporting.

Read the Samaritans guidelines.

Summary of conclusions
The data do not support the claim that there has been a large rise in suicide in young gender dysphoria patients at the Tavistock.
The way that this issue has been discussed on social media has been insensitive, distressing and dangerous, and goes against guidance on safe reporting of suicide.
The claims that have been placed in the public domain do not meet basic standards for statistical evidence.
There is a need to move away from the perception that puberty-blocking drugs are the main marker of non-judgemental acceptance in this area of health care.
We need to ensure high quality data in which everyone has confidence, as the basis of improved safety for this at risk group of young people

This is the summary from Prof Applebys review of suicides and gender dysphoria at the Tavistock

Thankfully the people with the power are listening to the scientific facts rather than all the emoting.

You have repeatedly lied Butterfly. You claim that there are studies showing how excellent puberty blockers are. I asked for links four days ago. No studies have been forthcoming. Because there aren't any. We all know that here, but you are trying to push fake news.

Oh for goodness sake. We are talking about pre-pubescent children, most of whom desist post puberty.

What kind of person are you to say that they should be medicated rather than have their mental health issues treated?

Many of these children are autistic girls like my daughter. The harms to female children are horrific but I don't suppose you care too much about that?

Honestly Butterfly you've got a nerve to come on here to tell us that we need our autistic daughters made infertile and mutilated rather than receive appropriate mental health care.

The future options of kids are being removed by not allowing them to develop naturally and go through appropriate puberty, not the 'mengelesque' treatment you propose. The hippocratic oath is first do no harm. Any reasonable doctor would now refuse to be involved after the Cass Review.

From the link posted by @ArabellaScott

•   <strong>*Young people are more susceptible to suicide contagion.</strong> When covering the death of a young person, do not give undue prominence to the story or repeat the use of photographs, including galleries. Don&rsquo;t use emotive, romanticised language or images &ndash; a sensitive, factual approach is much safer. Coverage that reflects the wider issues around suicide, including that it is preventable, can help reduce the risk of suicidal behaviour. Include clear and direct references to resources and support organisations Read our guidance for covering suicides by young people <a class="break-all" href="https://www.samaritans.org/about-samaritans/media-guidelines/guidance-covering-youth-suicides-clusters-and-self-harm/guidance-reporting-youth-suicides/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">here</a>e*.
  

"It's a lot harder when you have to walk past the sad little bundles of flowers and tear-stained unread letters every day enroute to work, and when you cannot help but hear the agonising echoes of desperate voices praying for politicians to listen"

Like this manipulative, ghoulish prose, for example.

Lies and emotional manipulation. That's all they've got.

Your lies are clear to anyone reading the thread, and your mawkish attempts to manipulate are just as clear.

And that's all you've got.

What a shameful post. Of course vulnerable gender questioning children need targeted mental health support for their complex mental health needs. Why would any responsible person object to that?
The guidance on suicide has for decades recognised the impact of social contagion on suicide - not just for children but adults as well. Hence the insistence on responsible discussions rather than using grim shroud waving emotive language.

It's not a coincidence that two ideologically opposed governments have both taken the same view about the protection of children from transactivist demands. Cass has exposed the harm done to children and no amount of tedious, self absorbed emoting and whining is going to stop society from waking up and finally protecting the young.

Don’t use emotive, romanticised language or images – a sensitive, factual approach is much safer.

Children deserve evidence based healthcare.

In relation to suicide figures, we know there is a disproportionate number of children with autism identifying as trans, we also know that autism is a factor in suicide risk.

The autism is the risk factor not the access or not to puberty blockers.

From Louis Appleby's report, his conclusions. I've bolded some bits I consider particularly relevant:

1. The data do not support the claim that there has been a large rise in suicide by young patients attending the gender services at the Tavistock since the High Court ruling in 2020 or after any other recent date. The figures for the 6 years covered in this review are 12 suicides in total, 2 per year on average, of whom half were under 18. With small numbers, single-figure differences can be expected and causal explanations are unreliable.

The patients who died were in different points in the care system, including post-discharge, suggesting no consistent link to any one aspect of care. They had multiple social and clinical risk factors for suicide.

However, it is likely that there has been a rise over a longer period as young people at risk have increasingly presented with gender dysphoria and referrals to GIDShave risen.
There is a degree of uncertainty about the deaths recorded as “suicide not confirmed”. It is possible that more information on these cases would result in amended figures for individual years but the numbers remain too small to affect my conclusions.

1. The way that this issue has been discussed on social media has been insensitive, distressing and dangerous, and goes against guidance on safe reporting of suicide. One risk is that young people and their families will be terrified by predictions of suicide as inevitable without puberty blockers - some of the responses on social media show this.

Another is identification, already-distressed adolescents hearing the message that “people like you, facing similar problems, are killing themselves”, leading to imitative suicide or self-harm, to which young people are particularly susceptible.

Then there is the insensitivity of the “dead child” rhetoric. Suicide should not be a slogan or a means to winning an argument. To the families of 200 teenagers a year in England, it is devastating and all too real.

1. The claims that have been placed in the public domain do not meet basic standards for statistical evidence. To be reliable, evidence should be objective, unbiased and open to independent scrutiny. It should admit uncertainty.

Campaign groups are often selective about evidence - there is nothing wrong with this until it becomes misleading and potentially harmful. The evidence put into the public domain for an “explosion” of suicides is not unbiased nor has it been independently verified. There seems to be no suicide expertise behind the claims.

1. Suicide by any young person is a profound tragedy: it should be seen as an indictment of our society. Young people with gender dysphoria may well have experienced ostracism and abuse, and their distress is likely to be heightened if services are perceived as rejecting. It is unfortunate that puberty-blocking drugs have come to be seen as the touchstone issue, the difference between acceptance and non-acceptance. We need to move away from this perception among patients, staff and the public.

This is a group of young people who need compassion and security, skilled clinical assessment, early treatment for mental illnesses such as depression, support within their families and schools and online, and an expectation of recovery and a fulfilling future. It is vital that these are the assurances the NHS and its partner agencies are able to convey.

1. In the end this is about a group of young people at risk of suicide and our collective responsibility to their safety. This means specialist health services with the capacity to respond to rising demand and appropriate skills in general services. It means a measured public discourse, making sure we do not stoke up prejudice or cause unnecessary alarm to the young people and their families.

We need to ensure also that we have high quality data in which everyone has confidence. The number of deaths should be monitored, not only in gender services but other mainstream databases, as is now happening in NCMD and in my own unit, the National Confidential Inquiry. Future prevention will depend on it. www.gov.uk/government/publications/review-of-suicides-and-gender-dysphoria-at-the-tavistock-and-portman-nhs-foundation-trust/review-of-suicides-and-gender-dysphoria-at-the-tavistock-and-portman-nhs-foundation-trust-independent-report

You try walking every fucking day past the place where a desperate kid you knew personally died cold and alone for completely preventable reasons only to see triumphant headlines and callous culture warriors on social media rejoicing over what a great fucking victory it was to shut off their hope for a future. What a vile thing to say. I'd like to be able to say I expected better of you but I've learned not to get my hopes up.

Don't abuse your children.
Don't abuse other people's children.
Don't abuse adults.
Show other people kindness and respect.
Act humanely toward them and allow them to live in dignity.

Life is hard for trans people for a lot of reasons, but one of the most prominent is transphobia.

Your argument amounts to saying 'people shouldn't transition because I'm going to do everything in my power to make their lives a living hell if they do'.

For god's sake please just stop, and help us make life just a little bit easier for other vulnerable people.

No. It doesn't. It's saying: look at evidence of benefit. Value all children equally. Try to figure out the actual, long term, realistic balance for them. And don't lie to them, or force others to do so.

Of course you are gutted by the loss of a child or young person you knew .

But why are you putting it down to lack of puberty blockers (if that is what you mean)? The child I mentioned was not helped by transition at all, and is equally valuable.

Giving medication which doesn't work and causes measurable harm is abusing children. As is telling them that their struggles are because they are the wrong sex. As is lying to them that they can become the other sex.

You want children, many of whom are mentally ill or neuro-diverse, and all of whom who are too young to consent or to understand what they're signing up for, to be given drugs which lead to reduced IQ, osteopenia, anorgasmia and which cannot change them into the opposite sex.

It's not transphobic to want children to only be given medical treatment which works and doesn't harm them. Your attempts at manipulation don't work.

rejoicing over what a great fucking victory it was to shut off their hope for a future

Point at anyone who has done that.

Also read, Professor Appleby's conclusions, helpfully bolded for you on the thread.

This one, for instance:
Then there is the insensitivity of the “dead child” rhetoric. Suicide should not be a slogan or a means to winning an argument.

Ghoul.

NothingcomestoNothing, I think I should apologise then for mentioning another child's post-transition tragedy. Shall I ask MN to remove those posts?

Your argument amounts to saying 'people shouldn't transition because I'm going to do everything in my power to make their lives a living hell if they do'.

I'm shocked by this accusation. I haven't seen anyone saying this here, and certainly not ApriCat if that's who the poster means.