To be absolutely furious with my father?

[PortaSix]

My father and is wife are both in their 50’s and are having another baby. None of my business, it’s not what I would want to do but it’s up to them.

We were at a family gathering and the subject of death came up and what would happen with our children. My dad then announced “oh I just assumed Porta would take them in”

Like, wtf?! Did he not think this was a conversation to have BEFORE having babies in old age? They have a 10 year old, a 3 year old and now another one on the way.

I’ve had my babies. I had mine in my early 20’s so that my 40 my kids will be grown. I do not want to take on any ther children. I am so mad that he just thought I would take on his children like this without any sort of discussion. Aibu?

Sometimes (not necessarily always) being raised by a person who is doing so unwillingly can actually be harmful to the child, if they are aware or pick up on the fact that they're not genuinely wanted. The adult doesn't even need to be deliberately making the child feel unwanted; sometimes it's unconsciously shown in their behaviour.

This is a very important point - and one that should also be remembered on the depressing number of threads where women are advised to push unwilling men into parenthood.

Very much so indeed.

There is a chilling level of selfishness on display on this thread. I'm so lucky I have a family where I know any of us would prioritize the needs of a bereaved child.

But isn't it equally selfish of the father to mentally make his mind up that his daughter will care for his children without having the respect for her to ask what she thinks and feels about that first?

“Chilling”. Bloody hell, talk about a drama overdose.

I think the drama overdose is coming from the posters who think that people in their 50s are practically dead, and should be making plans accordingly.

I think the father would be being unreasonable and selfish to assume OP would look after his children if he decided he and his wife were going to work in the Antarctic for a couple of years, or join a mission to Mars.

Expecting a close family member might want to help his bereaved children in the UNLIKELY event that both their parents died, not so much.

Expecting a close family member might want to help his bereaved children in the UNLIKELY event that both their parents died, not so much.

From how the OP has described her relationship with her father, it doesn't sound like they are close family members, though.

OP doesn't think her Dad was a great parent to her, although says he is a very good parent to his other children. I don't know the full facts of the matter, but it's OP's personal feeling that her father wasn't all that great a parent to her personally.

She has also said that her father lives miles away and she only sees him a few times a year.

So they're not exactly close family members.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1125118/death-rate-united-kingdom-uk-by-age/

if you have a baby in your 50's, there's a significantly increasing rate of mortality in the 60's and 70's onwards. That's actual death; rates of illness and disability which may make caring for a child difficult or even impossible are obviously notably higher.

Like it, lump it or stick your head in the sand about it, these are the facts.

Anyone with any hint of either intelligence or common sense knows this. You might be alright, but the chances are increasing that you might not be. Becoming a carer losing a parent can be devastating. So to actively go out of your way to have children when both of you are in your 50's is taking a high risk and not necessarily thinking about the long term best interests of the child. As others have said, it's not like you hit 18 and never need your parents again - and at that point, they'll be mid-70's, and more or less likely to be in ill health depending on where you live in the country.

So to make deliberate extenstive efforts to have children without even actually talking about who will take care of them in the non-unlikely event of ill health before they hit 25 and then not even talking to the person you want to take care of them - that is the absolute height of selfishness. Specially when you only see said person twice a year and have no intention of leaving them much, as the OP has said.

I think the drama overdose is coming from the posters who think that people in their 50s are practically dead, and should be making plans accordingly.

I don’t think anyone has said they’ll be dropping dead any day now. But yes, it IS worth considering that there are greater risks in becoming a parent at 53 rather than 33. It’s just a fact.

But the age of the parents isn’t the main issue here. It’s their assumptions about something that should never be an assumption. A close friend of my sister’s died of cancer before she was even 40. If her husband hasn’t got some kind of plan in place for their daughter, it’s ludicrously irresponsible, even if the chances of him getting terminal cancer too are tiny. He could be hit by a bus tomorrow - and “Oh well, I assume she could live with her auntie” is NOT good enough.

I think its those of us in our fifties seeing .the sunlit uplands of less responsibilities that are the most horrified on ops behalf.

It’s an extremely hypothetical situation.
I wouldn’t get worked up over it.

or to put it another way
cross that bridge when you come to it

which is likely to be … never.

@AnnaFrith Every parent regardless of their age needs to have plans in place for their minor children in case the worst happens. People die in car crashes every day. I know a couple of people who suddenly died in their 30's, one was knocked off his bike and the other was taken ill. Even if one parent survives, most need life insurance, so their family isn't left in financial difficulties.

I really couldn’t get worked up about this. It’s unlikely to actually happen. Most people don’t have plans for what will happen if both parents die. Perhaps more people should think about it. I’m sure lots of people when asked, on the spot, might just say they’d assume the closest relative would take care of them.

In addition to the point some people make about both parents dying being unlikely:

Statistically, emergency situations on aeroplanes are very unlikely. But would you want to be a passenger on a plane that didn't have proper plans in place just in case the "unlikely event of an emergency" was unfortunate enough to happen?

We cannot predict what's going to happen to us, so it's only sensible to plan ahead.

The father making the assumption that his oldest daughter would care for his children (without asking or checking with her first) doesn't qualify as making a proper plan.

@PortaSix do you need to have the conversation? Should anything happen to both of them and they are no longer here then at that point you can say no you can't take over parental responsibility.

Perhaps I mix in paranoid circles @GiraffesAtThePark but all of my friends have "just in case" plans!

That’s right. The age only makes it still more prudent, but everyone needs to address it.

Mine too. And my sister. And I know my parents did.

I can believe it’s not universal. But the idea that “most” parents haven’t even thought about this? I just don’t believe it.

I remember at school all discussing who was in our parents Wills look after us. I wasn’t sure and was surprised how many of them had been told. I remember asking my mum about it after school and whether we had anyone named. She said “ yes of course.” She then kept saying “well let’s not think about it” when I asked who, but she finally told me. Like some of the children at school had said they felt, a little part of me thought the plan sounded fun: they had children my age!

Oh and one girl had a much older sister. She kept whinging ” oh you’re all SOOOO lucky!!! (!) I just have to go to my stupid sister…” In hindsight it was all rather amusing.

Well maybe I’m wrong. That would be a good thing as I agree it’s good to plan for such things. Though I’m not sure mumsnet is a representative sample so who knows. A lot of people stick their head in the sand when it comes to issues around death. More than half of adults don’t have wills for example.

I'm older than the OP's father. I have adult children, all of whom are more or less settled.

The idea that I would have had a child eight to ten years ago and blithely assumed one of my older children would take over my middle age crisis vanity project children if the need arose, without any discussion, is gobsmacking. There is no way I would do that.

I know what bringing up children entails. The OP's father clearly has no clue.

The likelihood of the worst case scenario coming to pass is never zero.

i have 3 young children, dh and I are healthy early 40s adults. But we have a will so that our dc are taken care of if the worst did happen! We took a while but it was high priority before conceiving a third baby as even with a large number of capable and solvent siblings between us 3 is a lot to suddenly need caring for and as parents it is our single biggest priority that our children be ok?? I see no drama overdose here, only a very poor understanding of statistics and reality from all the posters mocking the idea these parents might die or be incapacitated.

It is indeed never zero - and, incidentally, the choice of stand-in parents is never perfect either: you want to be there for them yourself. But the parents are in the best position to choose and it’s far better to have it addressed than leave it for others to grapple with when children are freshly bereaved. It’s a bitter pill to swallow, but swallowed it must be.

Also, I think it can be important to keep updating and revising thoughts. A grandmother with mobility issues who is very close to and shares of the same interests as a DD might not be the best choice while DD is a leaping, bounding toddler; but she once DD is a 14 or 15 year old who can catch the bus etc, GM might now be the perfect guardian.

Agree with you.

It's also VERY unlikely that any kind of emergency will happen on an aeroplane in flight, but we all know that it happens occasionally. I doubt anyone would wish to board and fly a plane that didn't have instructions in place in case of an emergency.