Badly behaved child at funeral

[bizzybeing]

My Granddad died recently at the age of 102 and the funeral was this week. DM and her siblings let all the grandchildren know that the great-grandchildren were very welcome at the funeral but not expected and that it was up to us, as parents, to decide whether or not to bring them.

The great-grandchildren range in age from 14yo to 3mo. The older kids all came as did the baby which was no problem. My cousin decided that her 2yo and 4yo would never sit still so didn't bring them.

We discussed it with our boys and they were all keen to go. DS1 (11yo) and DS2 (8yo) are both generally well behaved so I was happy they should come. DS3 is 5yo and can be a menace so I was less sure about taking him but it was a 4hr drive from home and so we'd have to leave him overnight by himself with the PILs. The PILs were happy to do that but DS3 really didn't want to be left so we agreed to take him. Beforehand we set out clear expectations for him and also agreed that if he didn't cope with sitting still then DH would just take him out and go for a walk.

My DB and SIL also decided to bring their kids. My nephew (10yo) was a delight as always. However my niece (5yo) was, in my opinion, a badly behaved brat. DB and family arrived late (they delayed the coffin to let them into the chapel first) because DN refused to get dressed and then DN proceeded to demonstrate her gymnastics skills at the front of the chapel through the entire service! DB and SIL made a few half hearted attempts to get her to sit down but basically just let her carry on doing cartwheels and twirling around waving a scarf over her head.

AIBU to think that if she couldn't sit at least reasonably still then DN should have been taken out of the service?

FWIW this is fairly standard behaviour for DN and DB and SIL could easily have left her at home. They only had a 45min drive to get to the funeral which started at 11am and was on a day they both normally work so have routine childcare from 8am-6pm.

Awful, unacceptable behaviour. I’d have had to quietly/unobtrusively make my way over to DB and tell him to take her the fuck outside. Now, though, there’s nothing that can take it back or make it better, so try not to dwell. Hopefully there are no more funerals on the horizon but if there were, I’d be having a chat with DB first about how he plans to stop a repeat performance.

Could be a fork of behaviour management. Keep them occupied with eating to keep them quiet 😂

At 5 years old she really should have known better to be able to sit still and her parents should have removed her if she was becoming an unwelcome distraction.

All I will say though - and maybe this is different because your grandad died at 102 after a full life and my example is from a 34 year old man who died by suicide - but when we were at my husband’s cousin’s funeral, the 2 year old walking up and down the rows of seats and posting orders of service through chairs was honestly an antidote. Her mum who was struggling with her grief and was alone as her partner had declined to attend didn’t have the capacity to parent and engage in the service, so she let her wander. When she apologised both me and my husband made sure to tell her that we didn’t mind at all and we had both watched her for a welcome break.

Disgusting behaviour. The child should have been removed after the first warning

Put it this was I had lots of children at my wedding and made it clear that I had no problem with them dancing or singing our laughing or playing during the service yet only one did and my SIL took him out immediately despite me saying i was happy for them to be kids. But SIL told me afterwards that it was my day and not to be disrupted.

My point is a wedding is a happy time and doesn't really matter if kids are messing about but a funeral is a time to think about your loved one and if a child can't do that then they can't be there

Poor behaviour but I'm not sure a funeral for a beloved 105 year old is a solemn, heart breaking event. He outlived all his contemporaries and his death can't have come as a shock.

My dear gran was 90 when she died and we had tears and laughter. A long life well lived is not a tragedy, it's a wonderful achievement. God speed to your glorious granddad.

Another point of view might be, that she reminded a few folks that life goes on and there is joy to be found.
I imagine there are some people would love the idea of people cartwheeling at their funerals!
I am sorry for your loss. Focus on healing and embrace your family for who they are (because they won't change... they will just drive you potty).

I see this all the time. People let their children roam free in churches/funeral chapels. It's beyond me how they think it's acceptable behaviour.

I feel sorry for your DN. Her behaviour sounds absolutely awful but her parents are truly at fault here for not dealing with it straight away. Now she looks like an insufferable little brat, when really it’s her parents totally ineffectual parenting at play.

Totally disrespectful. Are they practisers of gentle parenting by any chance? So they can’t control their child?

But she's been in formal settings in school at the very least. This girl wouldn't get up in assembly whilst the headteacher is talking and start cartwheeling around.

I wouldn't be calling her a 'brat' tbh. She's 5 years old and unless she has been to funerals before, found herself in a very different environment - surrounded by sad, emotional people. Her behaviour was inappropriate and she needed to be parented at that point. She wasn't. The blame lies fairly and squarely with her parents. The fact that other older children were a delight is irrelevant.

Her parents should have removed her - but I am also not sure why another adult did not set in and encourage her to sit down. I would have!

Neither the time or the place! Cartwheels at the wake after maybe… If someone had been doing cartwheels at my DFs funeral service I would have been appalled. I would have stopped them.

That is such shite parenting and it is no wonder the child behaves so badly because the parents behave badly. I cannot tell you the amount of times DH and I had to eat separately in restaurants because of our child’s behaviour. He has ASD and early years was a total as you say menace. But we did not inflict his behaviour on everyone around us. DH eats I feed wayward child. DH walks aimlessly around while I eat etc etc. That was the same for weddings, visits with relatives you name it. Some people are just so shit at considering others, it never ceases to amaze me.

Why can't you call a brat a brat? All this pussy-footing around children.
someone from the family should be having a strong word with the
OPs DB about being a) late for the service and b) allowing his brat to behave brattishly

I don’t understand your use of untimely in your post.

I took my 10mth old to my grandmothers funeral (I’d had to travel from overseas and if i attended she had to attend) she was unsettled and cried, I took her out and the priest came and got me and said something about us all being part of the rich tapestry of life and to go back in. I think that’s a good sentiment to apply where possible.

That is difficult - your mother decided to allow the presence of children and I am sure she knew how this child was. And I am sure she loves her great niece. It is very unfortunate that she is being brought up without boundaries, but some children find it harder to grasp that concept than others, and I never judge parents who may be dealing with things that our outside my experience.

It is unfortunate that she played up at the funeral. Did it greatly interfere with the proceedings? Was she making a lot of noise? Sometimes the presence of young people simply being young people is a positive at an old person's funeral. A reminder of the beginnings of life.

I know that having my GC at my DH's funeral was a big plus for me. They were wonderfully frank and open and fresh and honest in the context of people trying hard to say and do the right thing. But - the two smallest were not brought to the church but just to the wake.

This was my thought too. Totally appreciate it's not ideal but children at a funeral is a tricky one. As an adult I find the outpouring of grief uncomfortable so it's little wonder that small children may act out, and at 5 I would hope most people could forgive the child at least, even if not the parents who I agree should have intervened.

What can be done though after the fact? Imo it's not worth a family row, yanbu for feeling a certain way about it, but yabu for labelling a 5yo a brat

Classic crap parenting there. Let me guess, outside of the funeral, your DB and SIL are glued to phones?

Reading some of the replies I'm reminded why I dislike funerals..
We were planning on doing some life admin over the xmas break, starting to think about PoA and wills, etc. I think I need to add a condition to my last wishes, making sure there's a prize fund for Best Cartwheel at my funeral.

Couldn't have said it better.

I’m the first to say kids should be at funerals, can never figure out why people are reluctant. Death is a part of life and it should be normal they people are exposed to that since birth.

Having said that, I think everyone has to be accepting of a certain level of normal baby/kid behaviour BUT if beyond that they should be taken out. What you have described, I would have taken my kids out, or any kids I was ‘minding’ on behalf of bereft parents.

My favourite memory of kids and funerals was a baby who honestly let out the loudest fart it was heard all over the chapel. Everyone cracked up and the whole place was rocking with laughter, and they had to break until everyone was composed. That’s life. That’s death. And it’s normal they come together like this. That’s different to bratty behaviour as you describe which people wouldn’t appreciate at a bbq let alone a funeral.

Odd decision to bring the child with them if they’ve got routine childcare in place.

Not fair to have the child be called a brat, the whole thing is on the ineffective parents. She wouldn't get dressed, one parent waits with her and the other goes on. Prewarning like you did, and take out if unable to sit. It's not rocket science.
I find it strange, as an Irish person, that people say no children at funerals. Mine were there at 4 and 7 and again at 7 and 10 for my DPs and they were wonderful throughout. The older one did the offertory both times and the youngest sat cuddled into me the whole time. However, they are used to the church and expected behaviours. This little girl wasn't clearly and her parents haven't helped her.

It's very telling that not one person at the funeral felt able to have a word with DB and SIL about their child's behaviour while it was happening. Normally there's at least one with the gumption to intervene. I was thinking same as a PP, that the nephew is a calm and biddable child who's been no trouble to his parents, while his younger sister is likely a lot more difficult and stroppy or prone to tantrums if she's told no.

I could imagine a toddler behaving so inappropriately but a five year old is a different kettle of fish, they should have some idea of how behaviour has to be moderated at different times - I can't believe school would allow her to do cartwheels and scarf whirling in an assembly, for example. Either way, parents should have appraised her beforehand on what she should and shouldn't do and stopped her when she stepped out of line. It's their job...