Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Hoping that Greg Wallace is forgiven, rather than cancelled

1000 replies

Toodaloo1567 · 03/12/2024 18:00

Just a few concerns about this whole GW thing. Caveat: I do not condone behaviour that is illegal.

  1. It does kind of look like a whole bunch of privileged TV luvvies are clamouring to denounce someone with really quite humble roots. I grew up in London and am constantly paranoid about how I come across to my mainly middle class colleagues. The thing is, middle class and privileged people operate by a set of unwritten rules. It’s like a full time job in itself trying to emulate their way of interacting, lest you be called out for not being ‘nice’ enough or doing something odd to them, like forgetting to start an email with ‘Hope you are well?’. Only, they won’t let you know to your face that you’ve accidentally been too sharp or direct, or maybe that your joke wasn’t woke enough - no, that stuff just goes straight to HR.
  2. The equality act 2010 makes it the employer’s responsibility to prevent sexual harassment in the workplace. Why wasn’t all this lewd stuff dealt with? GW said that no one had made a formal complaint. Again, it makes me wonder whether the middle class luvvies just didn’t want to call things out at the time because it’s ‘beneath’ them to even consider doing something about it.
  3. Even though he’s apologised, the public doesn’t think that’s good enough. It’s like only perfect people get to keep their careers. Woe betide you if you said something crass on twitter 10 years ago, or got caught speeding or something.

Of course, lots of you would want to shout me down over this, but you know what? We’re all mums here and many of us have sons. Boys and young men do and say crass things. GW hasn’t raped or systematically abused anyone. It doesn’t make what’s happened right, but I also don’t think it’s right that swarms of pitch-fork waving strangers get to play judge, jury and executioner. I’m a big fan of forgiveness. Am I the only one?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
18
RedToothBrush · 05/12/2024 07:52

Fizbosshoes · 05/12/2024 07:31

But the paragraph about his mum might partly explain the middle class women of a certain age comment?

Actually having read it, it's fascinating. But I think that's about a wider chip on his shoulder rather than his mum.

This is about his mum shortly after she married Gregg's biological father (who he hadn't known was his father earlier on)

‘She became middle-class overnight, and that wasn’t the person I knew. I was expected to be middle-class as well, which was completely alien to the Peckham I’d grown up in. She started to look down on where we’d come from and then vocalise how bad it was. That was where I’d come from.

He's MASSIVELY insecure that's for sure.

Northernladdette · 05/12/2024 08:07

RedToothBrush · 04/12/2024 20:56

Hmm maybe half a dozen posts would have done the trick.

As I say the same point has been on pretty much every page

And you seem to have lots of time and inclination telling us you haven't got any time or inclination.

Funny dat.

If you say so 😂

Fizbosshoes · 05/12/2024 08:11

How and why are people getting the idea no one said anything at the time, or everyone has only started complaining this week? 🤔

You don't need to read 30 + pages of a thread to find this info "hidden" amongst all the posts 🙄

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 05/12/2024 08:18

Fizbosshoes · 05/12/2024 08:11

How and why are people getting the idea no one said anything at the time, or everyone has only started complaining this week? 🤔

You don't need to read 30 + pages of a thread to find this info "hidden" amongst all the posts 🙄

Some people just seem to be willfully blind.

Commonsense22 · 05/12/2024 08:20

I'm still shocked at how endemic it all seems to be. And shocked it didn't come out during "Me too" in the past few years. It's so disgusting and not one peer or higher up stepped in.

HarrietBond · 05/12/2024 08:22

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 05/12/2024 08:18

Some people just seem to be willfully blind.

It’s also quite tiring to see people having to explain all the reasons someone might NOT have reported it at the time roughly every 50 posts. If people are asking it as a genuine question 🤔but don’t have the level of interest to read through a few pages of posts then there’s a real lack of intellectual curiosity at work.

NarnianQueen · 05/12/2024 08:22

When people go on about forgiving celebrities who've done this kind of crap I always think why not just try giving these highly paid jobs to somebody new instead? There are lots of potential presenters out there looking for a big break.

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 05/12/2024 08:33

HarrietBond · 05/12/2024 08:22

It’s also quite tiring to see people having to explain all the reasons someone might NOT have reported it at the time roughly every 50 posts. If people are asking it as a genuine question 🤔but don’t have the level of interest to read through a few pages of posts then there’s a real lack of intellectual curiosity at work.

Oh absolutely and we're a week into this story now, and in this day and age when the news is everywhere without us having to even look for it there is NO WAY people can be unaware of the exact nature of what GW has been accused of (we are well past the point of a few off colour jokes now), the fact that women did complain years ago and the ones that didn't had valid reasons for doing so.

For anyone to claim unawares of any of that they must either have nothing but fresh air between their ears, be walking around with their eyes and ears closed all day, be a Wallace relative or just out to stir trouble to liven up their little lives.

BubblePerm · 05/12/2024 08:54

It's not for you to forgive. It didn't happen to you.

Rhinostone · 05/12/2024 09:53

RedToothBrush · 04/12/2024 23:13

Yes I believe we are probably going towards a Weinstein style issue at this point.

Quote from this article by Katie Razzall
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cj90jp7yjy7o

Philippa Childs, the head of union Bectu, told Radio 4 on Wednesday "the time has come for the whole industry to come together and accept that there does need to be some independent scrutiny of how broadcasters [and] production companies work, to try and address this endemic problem".

The Wallace story may be a wake-up call for the production sector. For years, we’ve heard about junior staff feeling unable to speak truth to power in these sorts of scenarios.

Now, some women are refusing to stay silent. If the sector doesn’t get its house in order, it could be career limiting not just for high profile names but for executives as well.

I think it's Bectu who backed the collective Dawn Elrick complaint on behalf of a number of women in 2022

Of all the articles above this, I think this is the key one, and is ultimately the one that raises some of the biggest issues:
https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2024/nov/30/gregg-wallace-behaviour-letter-bbc-2022-masterchef-presenter

Dawn Elrick, the director and producer who sent the 2022 letter on behalf of other women who had contacted her, said the BBC suggested each individual would have to make their own, direct complaint to the corporation.

“This is very tricky for freelancers to do without identifying themselves, which makes life extremely tricky in the freelance world,” she said. “Placing the onus on individual employees/freelancers means they failed to see that I was trying to tell them there was a pattern of alleged behaviour.”

Elrick, who submitted her letter with the support of industry union Bectu, had received the allegations against Wallace through her Instagram account, Shit Men in TV Have Said to Me, which has become a place for workers in the UK film and TV industry to share instances of workplace sexism and sexual harassment. She had received multiple submissions about Wallace and felt compelled to report this to the BBC.

Elrick said that, soon after sending the letter, she also submitted the allegations to the BBC via Navex Global, an external whistleblowing service. She said she had received no further contact with regards to that report.

Elrick said the BBC’s lack of action showed there is “no satisfactory means of reporting sexual harassment and bullying within the TV industry”.

A BBC spokesperson told the Observer: “If issues are raised with us we have robust processes in place to deal with them swiftly and appropriately. We will always listen if people want to make us aware of something directly.

The key question Katie Razzall asks in the first article is about the BBC post 2018.

But BBC News has not been told whether the BBC executives involved in Wallace’s shows were made aware of any complaints about him after 2018 and the conversation between him and Phillips. If they weren’t, there is some plausible deniability that they thought the issues raised had been sorted.

Then again, that defence may only go so far. There are wider questions about how much a TV executive should probe, if they are aware that rumours have begun to swirl.

Popbitch, the weekly celebrity newsletter that makes its way into the inboxes of most media executives, had run stories involving allegations about Wallace’s language and behaviour in the past, for example. When does the odd gossipy claim about talent misbehaviour become an issue bosses should take a look at?

Should more questions have been asked by the BBC after 2018?

Remember Elrick's collective union backed complaint is dated 2022...

The BBC has a union shaped issue here about institutional level failure to deal with sexual harassment of women.

That makes it a scandal comparable to Weinstein.

It's very firmly NOT about Wallace as an individual at this point and very firmly about how women in television have no power to deal with complaints of this nature, even if they try and there is no joined up oversight between individual production companies and major broadcasters.

The BBC have got the heating on this however Gregg Wallace did a production for C4 last year and one of the productions caught up in this was C5.

I also really don't think it will be an issue restricted to the main TV channels. This will be a broadcasting issue for all the paid channels too.

I know what I've heard privately about the industry. It makes my skin crawl.

This is a much bigger deal than a lot of people want to admit.

This is exactly right.

The scale and length of time the allegations span is the real story - the fact that women are considered so unimportant that channels will continue to allow men with multiple complaints against them to helm shows.

If they decided to give him another chance after the complaints were upheld in 2018, there should have been significant oversight on his behaviour and at the first hint of repeats of his inappropriate conduct, he should have been out.

Tbh, it should have happened much sooner, but there is absolutely no excuse for the very senior exec at the BBC telling him off for 90 mins and then him being given free rein again.

mirrormirror5 · 05/12/2024 10:36

My husband said he feels sorry for him - HELP!

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 05/12/2024 10:38

@mirrormirror5 LTB.

Gonnagetgoingreturnsagain · 05/12/2024 10:51

mirrormirror5 · 05/12/2024 10:36

My husband said he feels sorry for him - HELP!

I suppose it’s a bit of a witch hunt re Gregg but can I bring myself to feel sorry for him?No. He’s brought it all on himself.

I was speaking to DM briefly about him as she has form for excusing this type of behaviour, until I mentioned Gregg had been seen with a sock covering his penis and she thought that was vile.

cardibach · 05/12/2024 11:13

This week’s episode of The Rest Is Entertainment podcast is interesting on this - on how it could happen, the general tone in broadcasting and some useful ideas about how it could be tackled.

Quitelikeit · 05/12/2024 12:42

I did feel for him a touch but hearing that he asked someone to eat eton mess from his Willy has kind of changed my thoughts

I still feel uncomfortable the way the media goes after people tho

I have noticed these things all happened over ten years ago - maybe he changed his ways?

Either way if I was him I would step away from media for a good few months - they will find someone else to come after!

Gettingbysomehow · 05/12/2024 12:53

What tripe.
My adult DS would never behave like that. I had a terrible upbringing and Im not a criminal.
There is NO excuse for his awful behaviour.
It's about time men learned this behaviour is never acceptable

Gettingbysomehow · 05/12/2024 12:56

He'd better consider himself lucky he never did that to me. I would have unleashed hell onto him.

StrikeForever · 05/12/2024 12:56

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 04/12/2024 23:25

I know what I've heard privately about the industry. It makes my skin crawl.
This is a much bigger deal than a lot of people want to admit.

Do you think the genie is very, very slowly starting to come out of the bottle now @RedToothBrush ? I'm hoping that the more of these that are being revealed (and we all know there will be more next year and onwards) the pressure is ramping up on the channels and production companies. Making it harder for them to shrug and look away like they have for years. The volume of outrage to the middle aged woman jibe possibly gave them a jolt too.

I’m not optimistic. There have already been so many since Saville and still nothing has changed 😡

StrikeForever · 05/12/2024 12:59

BubblePerm · 05/12/2024 08:54

It's not for you to forgive. It didn't happen to you.

Absolutely

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 05/12/2024 13:14

StrikeForever · 05/12/2024 12:56

I’m not optimistic. There have already been so many since Saville and still nothing has changed 😡

I know what you mean. Currently if I'm watching something, particularly on the Beeb then I find myself gazing at whichever male is on screen and thinking "will you be next?". It is at best distracting and at worst bloody depressing.

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 05/12/2024 13:18

I have noticed these things all happened over ten years ago - maybe he changed his ways?

Just woke up on morning and thought "think I'm done with all that sexual harassment and inappropriate touching. Maybe I'll take up watercolor painting instead" 🤔.

TarantinoIsAMisogynist · 05/12/2024 13:26

The Nestlé incident was in 2023, wasn't it?

StrikeForever · 05/12/2024 13:27

Quitelikeit · 05/12/2024 12:42

I did feel for him a touch but hearing that he asked someone to eat eton mess from his Willy has kind of changed my thoughts

I still feel uncomfortable the way the media goes after people tho

I have noticed these things all happened over ten years ago - maybe he changed his ways?

Either way if I was him I would step away from media for a good few months - they will find someone else to come after!

So you think his behaviour was what? ‘Not that bad’? FFS!

StrikeForever · 05/12/2024 13:30

Gettingbysomehow · 05/12/2024 12:56

He'd better consider himself lucky he never did that to me. I would have unleashed hell onto him.

Me too, but these creeps tend to save the worst of their behaviour for young women freelancers, who would probably never work again in their chosen careers if they “made a fuss” about ‘the talents’ behaviour. 😞

TrixieFatell · 05/12/2024 13:35

My son won't be saying crass things like Gregg Wallace. I'm also not sure what him having a working class background and those accusing have middle class backgrounds has to do with anything. I'm working class and have a number of middle class colleagues and have managed to not be offensive. I've certainly not gone on about how I don't wear underwear or simulated a sex act.

He's cancelled himself

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is not accepting new messages.
Swipe left for the next trending thread