to say no more DC - occasional verbal abuse from DH

[climbelon]

DH and I have 1 DS, age 2. There have been around 10 instances of verbal abuse since DS was born. (Thank you to a poster on a thread a few days ago who linked to a free PDF of Why Does He Do That - I am less than halfway through and already it has been very enlightening.)

There is no physical violence and I do not feel afraid or like I am walking on eggshells.

DH agreed (my idea) would pursue counselling after the last instance. The conversation in which this was agreed felt like a step forward to change. He had various reasons not to pursue free avenues and was too overwhelmed with choice of private practitioners to choose.
I told my friend that he was going to try counselling (not about the abuse). He was upset I shared this and as a result said he will no longer go to counselling. I waited it out as he often says things he doesn't mean when he's angry. Nothing further was mentioned.

A few weeks later I came to the conclusion that we should not have another child while I don't know that this abuse won't continue and/or escalate over time. While I love the idea of DS having a sibling, and I have leaned on my own siblings for support and validation managing the relationship with our abusive DM, it does not feel fair to have another DC, on me or the potential DC, and I guess would make it harder to leave if it comes to this.

The evening of this realisation, DH could see something was wrong. I told him I was upset he wasn't pursuing counselling and that it doesn't feel he is taking how he has spoken to me seriously. He minimised it, saying it's not a big deal, it only happened 3 or 4 times when he was stressed at work. (It has been more like 10 and the first time was while he was on pat leave.)

I also said that I don't think it's a good idea to have another DC. He said he doesn't want one anyway and called me manipulative for saying I wouldn't have another DC unless he gets counselling (which is not what I said). He went to sleep in the spare room as he was 'stressed' and we haven't spoken about it since.

Outside of these incidents, DH is a wonderful husband and father and speaks to me respectfully, if critically at times. However I cannot overlook the 0.1% of the time he is verbally abusive, nor his minimisation or 'are you STILL upset' when I'm not over it.

AIBU to rule out more children?

Are you still going to be staying at your sister's? Or are you now going to be staying at home as he's going away? If the latter and he knows that, then he WILL turn up to get you alone.

I was planning the latter but have just realised this. If I stay, she will stay with me. For now, we have put noisy things in the way of the doors so that we would hear if he tries to sneak in. But I will probably stay away.

Just a thought OP, but if you do want to move back in, could you install some locking door chains, that would stop him coming in without you being aware of his presence, AND enable you to be in your own home, which would presumably be easier for you and your baby? It's very reassuring to hear that your sister is so supportive.

Yes, I wouldn't stay in the house alone. It's a worry that he has your car but if he really is going to his sister's it will at least give you time to remove more belongings and essentials from the house.

Maybe you should ring his sister and tell her he's coming and you're worried because he's suicidal and you think he has pnd-for-men. (Not serious, obviously.) I would seriously question whether he actually is going to his sister's though. More likely imo that he's planning to stay near at hand and either observe you or ambush you.

Good shout re chains. Won't be on such tenterhooks and then can leave with the car once he's back.

I texted his sister an hour ago asking her to let me know when he arrives. No reply yet. If she says she isn't expecting him I will be phoning 101.

Sister is expecting him. Sent me a nice text. I assume she has been told about his unhealthy way of arguing/my mental health perspective.

Try not to engagexwith him.
He needs to talk to his family etc
Arrange for him to see ds in public place If you really think is necessary (frankly keeping away for a week would be best )
He will
Be nice
Cry
Be angry
Say he will kill himself

All of those
Might keep ds from you
Might be violent to you or objects

Assume he will do the worst and prep your strategy I e 999 And always have third party present if you speak to him

He is not a wonderful husband and father OP. Verbal abuse is not acceptable.

Hmmmm I know he was very wrong but I think you should have gone to therapy first before going nuclear

@femfemlicious

I disagree.

The Op may benefit from counselling / therapy one day but I believe couples therapy he will just say what is expected and put all the ' blame ' on the Op, he won't gain anything from going to therapy by himself as he thinks he is right !

Sadly now the emphasis is to keep the Op safe and to ensure he does not remove baby from her.

Thank goodness for her sister, I hope her sister continues to be a help and is not taken in by his words.

His sister's confirmed he arrived.

just out of curiosity - how far away does his sister live ?

2 hours away.

No, I'm sure my sister will stay strong. She's been amazing.

Never go to joint therapy with someone who is even 0.1% abusive.
They will turn it to them

Totally agree with you @OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon - couples therapy with a manipulator is a complete head melt. It's shocking how even very experienced practitioners don't seem to see what's going on either. This kind of abuser is extremely plausible when an audience is present.

@climbelon how are things this morning? Are you all okay?

Thank you, we are ok. Staying with my sister for the foreseeable, have collected all the things we need and work have said not to worry until I'm settled. Feeling much calmer (for the moment!).
Missing him but I know I'm doing the right thing. And I've realised I won't need to see him again for now, get my head and my ducks together, my sister can take DS to spend time with him in the meantime.

@climbelon

I hope you got a fairly decent night's sleep and are able to relax a bit as you have gone through a lot in just a few days.

Thank you for remembering ' us ' and giving an update.

Don't know whether to text him that he can stay in the house until he's got himself sorted, as I'll be staying away until DS and I can go back alone or find somewhere else to live. I had told him he needs to stay in a hotel until he finds somewhere.

I would wait until Monday I suspect he will be in touch one way or another...

Do not arrange his life. He will sort himself out.
Focus on you and dc

Any advice re mediation for child arrangements?

In case anyone wants an update. I am now in my own place with my DS. I have done some courses and reading and can now see that things were even worse than I recognised. He was/is so controlling which I didn't see at all and has escalated hugely since I left and involved flying monkeys from both families. It was absolutely the right move to leave and I am so glad I did this while DS is relatively young and before I had any more DC.

I get upset about behaviours but much better at taking them in my stride the more I educate myself. I am so much happier and able to use my instincts to parent and funnily enough decision making is suddenly much easier without someone scrutinising my every move. I feel free.

Thank you to everyone that commented. You've all made such a difference- I don't think I would have started this process without you. Appreciate so much all the wisdom, clarity, support and encouragement.

Glad it’s all working out for you. It takes a lot of strength.

Your last update, before tonight's, asked about child arrangements - how is that going ? as I recall you were at that time breast feeding.

I am so pleased to read that you are safe and well - well done !
you mention flying monkeys from both families - I hope your sister is still supportive ?