Social services HELP - any social workers out there please

[Hellothere1982]

Partner and I in total shock - partner was feeling very down and told GP he had been feeling suicidal one night (first time this has ever happened and he was just down - nowhere near doing anything stupid) and the next thing we know is because he has a shot gun licence social services have had to be called. Apparently this is standard practice. We have two children never any issues and I am currently 7 months pregnant - adore being parents and do everything for our kids. Social services called and a day later said case was closed however the mental damage has been done to us as parents and we are panicking. My midwife also got in touch today about this matter and asked to chat!!!! Any social workers who can answer - Will they contact their schools? Is this a red mark? If the case was closed why is my midwife in touch - shouldn’t this be the end of it now? The children aren’t involved in any way and we are devastated and scared. You hear such horror stories about social services this has really terrified us as parents - thanks so much to anyone who can help x

You might hear horror stories about Social Services but the greater horror stories we all hear is about men with guns having some sort of moment and killing themselves, and often their families. I'm not saying that would have happened but the authorities should be aware of the risk and so I feel reassured knowing they acted as you describe.

Because he had guns in his house though?! Not in other circumstances.

I would imagine that SS would be more concerned if someone else had to contact the police to say your DH was depressed and had access to guns. For example if he went downhill and the children mentioned something at school. Or if a concerned family member contacted police.

Instead he's been proactive and gone to the GP himself. There's absolutely nothing to reflect badly on either of you - you've done the right thing.

Glad to hear he's getting support. My DH had depression and I can remember the feeling of total helplessness so hopefully this at least takes some of the unknown away. As I understand it, just having access to guns increases the risk of suicide. So everyone has done the responsible thing for now.

Yes, thankfully rare but sadly it happens and sadly, ending one’s own life in this way is more common than that. Which is why the safeguards are in place. And exactly why it is so rare, because action is taken to prevent is as much as possible.

I agree though that there is nothing to fear in asking for help and it is always better for the sufferer and the family to actually reach out and ask.

And I’m sure you’re not one of the ones who shouts about not enough being done the next time someone shoots himself and his family. Everyone did the right thing here

Just looking at the stats. There are approx 550,000 gun licenses in the UK, and suicides by gun shot are at 2.5% (approx 100 per year) so indicates it is a risk factor.

Think yourselves extremely lucky that health services cared enough to put safety first. It's more common for overworked health professionals not to have time.
Concentrate on helping your husband get well and try to reframe the whole incident as a positive step

This 1000% Your DH disclosed to his GP that he is suicidal and the GP knows he has guns in the house. Everyone acted appropriately in this situation to safeguard the children.
I can't believe you cant see this. Stop complaining about people doing their jobs properly and be glad the support/safety network kicked it.

I hope you and your family can take the support that is being offered and things improve for you. You would do far better to concentrate on this aspect of the situation.

So little accountability other than to the court, the ombudsman, their employer, their regulator Social Work England and the overall inspectorate Ofsted you mean?

I havent read all the responses, but as a Social Worker - and one that recently worked for MASH (Multi-Agency Safeguarding Hub), I can tell you what will have happened. As you are pregnant, and your partner said he was suicidal and had guns in the house, they would have put in a referral into MASH as a serious safeguarding concern. Under the unborn baby protocol (we take unborn risk VERY seriously), the Social Worker would have done numerous checks in the 48 hours they had to work the case - in that time they would have called your midwife, got a police record, health record, followed up with GP if necessary, looked at social services record if there was any (sounds like there wouldn't be), contacted your childrens school (im sorry I know you are anxious about that but that would have been done), and contacted you. If all you got was a phonecall from the Social Worker stating case was closed, and not a visit, then it stopped there. However, the schools, GP, midwife etc would all have been informed about the SW involvement and it will be on all your children's record.

If you got a visit (which doesn't sound like you did) it meant the Social Worker deemed it worthy of a child and family assessment, which would have meant a face to face with yourselves, school etc, but then they deemed it worthy of closure.

If there is ever any concerns again then this incident will be taken into account by the Social Worker when making the decision to move things further investigation or close the case.

If you are acting protectively and your children are well cared for you have nothing to worry about - but I just wanted you to know what will have happened behind the scenes, as often the fear of the unknown is what scares parents.

At MASH we make calls all the time to parents - especially regarding unborns - that even I think are a bit overkill as it scares parents, but it is to protect the most vulnerable as stats show that if we can get involved during pregnancy there are better outcomes for those really at risk of harm. eg. we commonly make calls if a mother has had a history of DV or SA from a previous partner as research shows they can be more vulnerable. I loathe making those calls because often it frightens the mother who through no fault of her own had a past she is trying to get away from, but as I always explain it is designed to catch those who repeating a cycle of abuse and to support them as early as we can.

Hope that helps to explain and reassure you and others going through it somewhat. We arent monsters trying to interfere, we just want to safeguard kids.

Your blase ness about this shows it's a good thing they did get involved. You're minimising someone who is suicidal with kids in the house who owns firearms as being a bit down and professional intervention as being over the top.

They need proof that he hasn't got the guns anymore. Sadly family annihilators are not unheard of.

SS have closed the case, they've done everything exactly right. If the GP didn't pass this info anywhere, and your husband died by suicide by shooting himself, or due to being depressed he was cognitively impaired and forgot to lock the cabinet and one of your children got hold of a gun, everyone would be criticising services for not intervening.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

I won’t post the details of the case as it’s too outing. This BBC report gives a pretty clear picture of what I’m talking about.

www.bbc.com/news/uk-66531409

So many people have mental health issues or episodes - over 30% I would say of my friends however I would now be terrified to tell a GP if I had mental health problems if I had children

Most parents who go to the GP with mental health problems don't own shotguns. The issue is not that your husband had a depressive episode, it's that he talked about being suicidal while in possession of a shotgun. Of course that would trigger a safeguarding process.

Of course your husband wasn't going to do anything bad and of course your children are fine. But surely you must understand that it's absolutely essential for social services to have acted just in case? How many times have we read in the news about a case where a father in distress killed himself and his family and then the authorities are vilified for 'ignoring the warning signs'?

You need to be a lot calmer about this. Your husband has been struggling with depression and you have a baby on the way, so don't make your lives more difficult by getting paranoid about a totally normal, routine and sensible safeguarding process which is purely there for your family's benefit. You and your husband aren't being accused of anything. This whole thing is there to make sure you're OK, nothing more.

This is about the family courts and not a decision by social services.

“Researchers studying the family court say they are concerned that claims of parental alienation appear to be increasing in private law cases like these - where one parent takes another to court, rather than an intervention by social services.”

Your bigger concern is your husband's mental health. Describing something as "just an episode of depression" IS minimising. People don't tell their doctor they are suicidal if they're fine. And bad bouts of depression can make people suicidal. Your husband needs treatment and support, right now.

All of these agencies work hand in glove. I’ve seen it in reality. A co-parent with a long documented history of abuse is given every opportunity to continue contact as long as he makes the right noises to SS whereas the co-parent who alerts SS to children’s disclosures is accused of parental alienation just for raising the concerns, and is made aware that she needs to agree that he has reformed, even while he continues to be covertly abusive.

You’re conflating different issues.

In this case, the professionals did their due diligence.

I wasn’t talking about OP’s case, though I did express understanding of her concern.

As they should be. Everything happened as it should - which is a relief to us all. I understand that it’s worrying - but you can’t really expect anything else when a gun owner divulges suicidal thoughts. Hope he’s getting the support he needs.

What would you have done if SS and police hadn't intervened? Would you have removed the guns?

1 in 3 people have a mental health issue at some point in their lives. However services will be working to assess risk via the factors that have been proven to be the most dangerous statistically. In your husbands case there are three high risk factors - suicidal thoughts, gun ownership and having a pregnant wife.

I'm glad your husband got the help he needs. It sounds like support would be helpful for you too.

I think this is quite likely, he may have been trying to spare you the worry, especially with you being pregnant.

Hopefully he is getting support now x

This is just not true, certainly not in any social worker I have worked with.
I think most social workers are very suspicious of men like this - your perspective really isn’t what I have experience in real life.

We were just unlucky then? I don’t think so. The use of the ‘parental alienation’ trope seems too much of a give away.

I agree. Some abusive men do get away with using PA allegations against their partners - much has been written on this. Many people seem to cling to the idea that the system is infallible, but there are some cases (even if they’re a small minority) where manipulative people are able to hoodwink SWs and other professionals. It happens— thankfully not the majority of the time, but it happens.

Social worker here. No they won't contact the school. I think its much better to have people involved and nothing to happen, than for no one to know and for something to happen. Not sure how they've closed it so quickly as there is usually requests for information and risk assessments and then a senior manager has to sign it off.