To be Concerned about husband's reaction to Xmas planning making it about race

[anonymousxmasposter]

I'm a British Asian woman married to a white man, and I'm currently pregnant with our first child. I need some advice about a situation that's really bothering me.

I suggested hosting Christmas this year but separately for our families - mainly because of logistics. My family is quite large (10 people), younger (mostly teens and twenty-somethings), and celebrates with music, games, and a lively atmosphere. His family is small (4 people), much older (60s-80s), more traditional, and quieter. His father has dementia and hearing difficulties, which makes large gatherings challenging for him.

When I suggested hosting our families separately to make everyone more comfortable, my husband immediately accused me of wanting an "Asian-only Christmas where we just do our own Asian thing." I was shocked because it had nothing to do with race - I was thinking about space, comfort levels, and very different celebration styles. My sisters boyfriend is white too, so it wasn't about excluding anyone based on race.

I ended up feeling so guilty that I changed my plans to invite his family, but I'm deeply troubled by his response and how quickly he turned a practical concern into a racial accusation. This isn't the first time he's done something like this - any discussion involving race tends to end badly.

I'm especially worried as we're expecting a child. What if our child had heard that comment?

Im also keen to hear from people in same race relationships, for Xmas if you were hosting at your home, do you also blend families - was it weird of me to say I didn't want to do that?

Whether you have or haven't what the hell do I do with this as feel really alone with this and could use some advice as I have no one I can talk to about this without judgement.

Do it together.

He is not happy as he is reaching out to friends for their opinions on your relationship.

You are a couple who should be supporting and caring for each other.
Have your feelings for each other changed?

Obviously you have loyalties to your own familes but compromise is the answer. Compromise must be genuine and not bitter.

For what it is worth I never insisted on spending Xmas with my family nor my partner we just went and go with the flow.

It is usually my partner insisiting we visit my family. Im just like meh because i love them both.

And i can tell you as a family we were and are happier for it.
Some of the best parties or gatherings we had were when we had both.

Straight away too the friend he asked said how can you be racist married to a black woman 🙄. Honestly, I just think the people he surrounds himself with make everything worse

Black, Asian or any non white woman he basically said

@anonymousxmasposter

You need to sit down and clear the air.
This is anxiety will just eat away at you.
Some people can over analyze everything .
It does them no good.

He should be talking to you not friends.

Are you happy?
Or is everything about the relationship a worry?

Can it be resolved.

Slightly off topic, but is White Christmas a racist song?

@Gummybear23 he will not sit down. It ends in frustration / he NeVER sees my perspective on anything.

It's all about intent with him. So for example, if someone didn't intend for something to be how it was interpreted then the person on the receiving end should just forgive and move on.

How do you work with someone like that? If anyone has any tips I'd welcome them.

Well if what was said was not intentional then I can forgive. I wouldn't try to over analyze and interpret something else.

To make a relationship work;
Respect each other
Learn to forgive and forget if things are done without intention.
Don't sweat about small stuff
Be kind

When the child is born life will be more challenging.

If you are really unable to let things go and not understand your partner intentions after all this time is this relationship right for you?

He doesn't have any Asian or Black friends does he.
which is why he asked his white friend.

I don’t know how else to ask this…but why are you being so wet? You keep going on about how he said X, so that’s that. Or he thinks X, so there’s nothing to be done. Why are you so submissive? You are aware that you are an equal partner in this relationship, right? Or do you think that he’s your boss, somehow?

This man is saying and doing racist things, as are his family and friends. And you’re just taking it, and wringing your hands. Where is your agency, ffs?

He’s been having his way with pretty much everything, telling you he’s ‘logical’ and you’ve just sat there and taken it.

Now, you’ve been given advice. Books suggested for you to read. Books suggested for him to read. Resources. Numbers to call. You’re engaging with none of it. You just want to continue running around after this man, begging him to respect you.

I bet he doesn’t. And if this was pointed out to him, he’d be furious and claim it was a racist question.

And OP would accept that response.

'I feel really sad, really sad, alone and quite depressed.'

what does your mother or sister say when you talk to them about this ?

why are you seeing a counsellor ?

do you think you will still be married to him in 4 years time ?

We mix my partner’s family with our friends but mainly see my family just them. My family is bigger and my siblings have kids, there’s also a few badly behaved dogs in the mix - it’s chaos! I sometimes find them too much so adding in more people and different vibes seems unnecessary.

@OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon I would never talk to family about this - they would just start to dislike him it's not worth it. They are very sensitive when it comes to race more so than me, and it would make my marriage difficult I believe.

I'm having counselling as I went through a low period partly our relationship as I have no one friends or family to discuss it with.

Yes I believe we will be together in four years but I am begging him to understand me better. I am not convinced he ever will

You say communication is about what the other person understands you to have said, otherwise you are talking to yourself. You don’t seem to care one bit about how what you say makes me feel, if that’s true why are you even here? Why don’t we just fuck off our separate ways? I tell you that phrase both upsets me and really pisses me off and your only focus is on telling me I’m wrong and too emotional. Fine, I’m too emotional- again why are you here??? If you don’t care how I feel we should not be here. My baby deserves better than a dad who says racist hurtful dismissive things to her/his mum.

I think you will be together and miserable as you continue to put up with being put down and treated like crap. Please don’t give up your job. Please don’t hide everything from your family so you have no support.

Surely that's just the equivalent of saying I have black friends so I can't be racist.

Your H probably doesn't think he is racist and he may not have intended his comments to sound that way, but the fact is, he chose to make an issue about race when it wasn't really a factor. So subconsciously, he definitely holds some racist perspectives.

If he was open to actually listening, reflecting and learning, then it would probably be possible to get past this. Most of us have unconscious biases that we need to work through, and that's just part of being human. But instead of trying to become more aware of how his behaviour is affecting you - his pregnant wife! - he is just shutting the conversation down and refusing to engage.

As far as I'm concerned, white privilege is really about the luxury of never really having to think about race. When you choose to marry and have children with someone from a different race, you don't get to keep that privilege in quite the same way. Your H really needs to educate himself, but sadly, I'm not sure that he will.

You sound very unhappy, OP, and I fear that things are going to get much harder for you when your baby comes along. If you can get your H to go to couples counselling with you, that would be good. If not, I think you need to use your own counselling sessions to work through whether you really want to stay in a relationship with a man who doesn't appear to treat you with any respect or consideration.

I would never talk to family about this - they would just start to dislike him it's not worth it. They are very sensitive when it comes to race more so than me, and it would make my marriage difficult I believe.

They aren’t ‘very sensitive’, though, are they? They just don’t tolerate it, like most self respecting people. And they would encourage you to stop tolerating it. It would make your marriage more difficult because everyone would know your husband was a racist who treats you like shit. If you’re so embarrassed by your relationship that you can’t talk to anyone about it, surely that indicates you shouldn’t be in it?

I'm having counselling as I went through a low period partly our relationship as I have no one friends or family to discuss it with.

As above.

Yes I believe we will be together in four years but I am begging him to understand me better. I am not convinced he ever will

So, your relationship is awful. You’re literally begging him to understand you and you don’t think he will. He doesn’t respect or listen to you. He is racist. But you’re still going to be with him in four years. WHY?!

You can keep ignoring my comments, and others that say things you don’t want to engage with, but I know you’re reading them. I very much hope at least some of this is making you think.

He doesn’t give you the same grace though—does he? So this “its all about intent” is just bullshit. You really are under the thumb of a very manipulative, nit nice, man. He basically holds you at a distance. He can say ir do any selfish thing and he excuses himself and shuts down discussion with “you are so sensitive! I didn’t mean to hurt you” but woe betide you if you express a reasoned/equitable plan like how you are going to handle post partum fairly or how you would like Christmas to be organized. Then you are a racist bitch with no sense of values.

Talk seriously with your own therapist about this. It is not going to get better. Maybe he flattered you and love bombed you when you were dating and for the first few years of marriage but the real him is come to stay now. The real him is selfish, misogynistic, lazy, proud, mean, and (yes) racist. He wants an easy life and he doesn’t care if yours is hard, or lonely, or frightening, or sad. His attitude is that if it didn’t happen to him it doesn’t matter.

OP, he is using race as a stick to beat you with. He will use your hormones, your sex, large family, or just anything that is different to him. He is manipulating you into a corner where you will eventually lose your voice in this relationship. (My post)

Yesterday, he asked his white male friend for his opinion, who, unsurprisingly, said I was being ridiculous.

You do realise that is a classic manipulation and control tactic? My friends , colleagues, family, pet dog, dave down the pub all say you're wrong so shut up. Yet another stick.

I am begging him to understand me better. I am not convinced he ever will.
You should NEVER beg or plead for respect or support. If you find yourself doing that then this person/relationship is not for you. It will ultimately destroy you.

I repeat - this is not about Christmas. It is not about race. It is about a nasty man who belittles and dismisses someone he supposedly loves. Implying you are too stupid to understand his clever play on words. Making out you are needy, emotional, stupid. Making you beg to be heard. Open your eyes to ALL of it OP as you will soon have a child that you will need to protect from all this emotional bullshit he's piling on you. No wonder you are in counselling - make sure they understand EA and how it affects MH, many don't unfortunately.

@Saschka I never mentioned Christmas! I was responding to how you keep your parents and your DH separate! You're clearly ashamed of one of them.
Calling me 'sweetie' just makes you sound about 12! 🤣

This! This is exactly what I meant, OP!

I see my family and DH’s family separately (because they live geographically distant from each other). Which is what OP asked about. The two extended families have met twice. DH sees my DM weekly, and has worked with my brother.

Nobody else seemed to have trouble understanding the difference between “his [family]” and “DH” - maybe make sure you have actually read posts properly before writing shitty little comments to other posters? It makes you look like an illiterate little cow, and I’m sure nothing could be further from the truth.

@Twistybrancher I'm not sure which thread you've been reading but it's def not this one! You've completely misunderstood the entire thing. OP's husband racially abused her! That's not up for debate

@Lookingatthesunset Why are you attacking everyone on here who has a differing opinion to you?! That's not how forums works and it's not how life works! My opinion remains that OP's husband racially abused her and that's not for you to contest.

You are trying to please the unpleasable. Your DH wants you in a place where you are confused, on the back foot, constantly trying to defend yourself. If you're sticking around (I would recommend making a plan to leave) i'd stop trying to think that the way be behaves is rational and that he can be brought around by a sensible conversation - he doesn't want to come round. Do the best you can for yourself, family and DC and ignore his views and complaints.