imane khelif has been allegedly confirmed to be a man.

[Cartwrightandson]

A leaked French medical report from 2023 has confirmed that Algerian boxer Imane Khelif is male.

Top endocrinologists found that Khelif has XY chromosomes, no uterus, internal testicles, and a "micropenis."

The report was drafted in June of 2023 via a collaboration between the Kremlin-Bicêtre hospital in Paris, France, and the Mohamed Lamine Debaghine hospital in Algiers, Algeria. Drafted by expert endocrinologists Soumaya Fedala and Jacques Young, the report reveals that Khelif is impacted by 5-alpha reductase deficiency, a disorder of sexual development that is only found in biological males.

reduxx.info/algerian-boxer-imane-khelif-has-xy-chromosomes-and-testicles-french-algerian-medical-report-admits/

You don't get it. Even though others have tried to explain it to you. It's not about 'feminine'. It's about skeletal differences. Anatomy. Lack of hips, height, hand size, feet size, adams apple, male jaw, gait and standing stance (men stand with their feet open and pointed outwards, women with their feet together), even philtrum (the space between your nose and top lip where men have their moustache) width. And that's before we even get to voice. These are PHYSICAL ANATOMICAL ATTRIBUTES that cannot be hidden with makeup.

It's ANATOMY. Nothing to do with 'looking all pretty and girly'. Nothing remotely to do with looking 'feminine' or 'masculine'.

Or when he had tests done at the clinic in France? Or when he declined to challenge the IBA’s findings?

I suppose he ‘could’ have a very manipulative coaching team who’re shielding him from the results but I find that a big stretch, particularly when he does things like allow himself to be shoulder-carried by unrelated men, declining to wear even a headscarf etc.

OFFS! The whole world thinks he looks like a man! I'm not saying he doesn't! Some of you need to develop some comprehension skills.

It is inescapable.

When a male gets the brutual facial feminisation surgery done there are many things the surgeon has to focus on.

There is a reason the entire face has to be peeled from
forehead to under the jaw.

This is just a sample of course:

Hair line (and I am not talking about baldness patterns), Forehead slope is different. Brow bone has to be shaved. Males have prominent brow bones. Eyes - slant angle is different and female people often have a wider space between their eyes. Nose ridge tend to be shaved as males tend to have more curved and prominent noses. Female people tend to have more prominent cheek bones so surgeons add inserts here.

The upper lip nearly always gets attention because generally male top lips are thinner than female people’s. And female people tend to have more defined bow from deeper philtrums. But also the surgeon may attempt to shorten the space between the base of the nose and the top of the lip because female spaces tend to be shorter.

The jaw line is significantly shaved. It requires extensive reshaping. The ears also tend to be different but may not be touched because enough hair can disguise this.

Facial feminisation rarely works. And it has nothing to do with ‘looks’.

The effects of people taking testosterone tend to be able to mask some of these differences through hair and fat distribution.

Khelif is male. Sex tests have shown this. The way the IOC spoke about him is very strong evidence that they accept this but take the view that biological sex is irrelevant and that males ought to be able to take part in female sport.
I have yet to hear an argument from anyone as to why this is acceptable. 'Inclusivity' or 'be kind' are not arguments in themselves. They are soundbites.
What I would like to see anyone try to do is to make a case for why it is acceptable, equitable, fair, sensible or safe to include males in female sport.

This

Agree here.

Do you really think that seeing a male person in real life, listening to them speak and move doing a variety of tasks, particularly those involving hip movement and stance that female people cannot reliably tell a male from their body cues?

I have found that because my long distance vision is slightly blurred that movement is the biggest indicator for me. And my brain filters it rather well. Even with clothes on, a male arm and leg joints show up with movement. But the hip movement is usually clear too. As others have said hand shape and size and feet size is also a cue. And I say that when the female people in my family have larger than average feet and hands.

But even if the rate is 98% not 100%, what of it? Because for me to miss 2 %, who is to say other female people (including children) will be likely to pick those 2% while missing others that I, personally, can identify.

Not only that, do you think a girl or a woman who has significant trauma reaction to a male adult is not going to be hyper vigilant whereas perhaps you are not?

I am not really sure what you are trying to prove on this thread yet you seem frustrated that people don’t agree with you.

If he knew and still competed, there is no question about this. His first failed eligibility test was in 2022.

It should never have come this far.

A simple test, a cheek swab would have stopped him being able to compete but nope, apparently these tests are ‘too intrusive’! Shame on the OC for allowing this shit show to taint the Paris Olympics!

This should never be allowed to happen again in ANY sport.

He should be stripped of his medals and give them to the rightful winners!

2024, when a man can punch a woman, be lifted onto the shoulders of his coach, be applauded and given a gold medal! - everyone who argued for this should hang their heads in shame!

2024, when a man can punch a woman, be lifted onto the shoulders of his coach, be applauded and given a gold medal! - everyone who argued for this should hang their heads in shame!

Well said @ZoeZee

This absolutely sums it up. Let's hope the pendulum steers to swing back.

Some people seem to be incapable of showing empathy to women.

Wouldn’t it be terrible to have your medical records leaked while everyone muses over what your genitals might look like? Yes, agreed, it wouldn’t be very nice.

Wouldn’t it be terrible to have trained all your life for a chance of Olympic glory and then be punched in the face by someone who is not eligible to compete with you, someone who could cause you serious harm and possibly even kill you, while the world cheers that person on? And then you feel you have to apologise for crying and refusing to continue the illegal fight that could have left you seriously injured or worse?

I stand with the women whose safety was put at risk.

It uses a French News publication as their source, so if you don't believe Reddux (which go above and beyond for facts and information and have NEVER been wrong), you can choose to go straight to the French site and click on the English translator function, @hoarahloux^^

I even posted a handy link upthread.

i second that.

I agree, we should certainly be more accepting of differences and not judging someones sex on what colour they like etc. This is why a lot of feminists are seen as Transphobic - we don't think that a 5 year old boy who likes to wear dresses and play with dolls is "trapped in the wrong body". Its also why a lot of feminists hate Drag, its a paradody of what men think women should look/act like.
Being a man or a woman is pure biology, not clothes or feelings.

“Im not trolling google for photos of transexuals that are able to ‘pass’ but they exist”

Generally those that ‘pass’ in photos are female people taking testosterone. Or are male people who have had puberty blockers from very early puberty. Or are posed in particular ways.

’passing’ in photos are not an indication of ‘passing’ in real life.

Whether a male 'passes' or not is irrelevant to whether it is safe, fair or equitable for them to compete against females.
It is a fact that the vast majority don't 'pass' anyway, but whether they do or don't, whether they wear dresses or not, whether they use make-up etc etc, still doesn't answer the question of WHY, given incontrovertible biological facts about size, strength, speed etc, it is fair, safe and equitable for males to compete against females and WHY, if it isn't, they are being allowed to.
There is consistently too much whataboutery in male rights activism. For my part, I would actually rather they were honest and stated openly that they don't think females are of equal value and explained why. Then at least we could have an honest conversation about what we value, how we value it, and why.
All this 'be kind, be inclusive, but Reduxx isn't mainstream, but it's just like a short person not being in a basketball team... .is irrelevant.

There is consistently too much whataboutery in male rights activism. For my part, I would actually rather they were honest and stated openly that they don't think females are of equal value and explained why.

I agree with this.

As this clearly is the position, own it. Justify it.

The whataboutery is by now fuckwittery in my view.

You are correct though, so much of it is irrelevant. However, in saying that it is often interesting to others to see that fuckwittery countered with different answers. Because each time, it can broaden understanding.

Because each time a fallacy is posted as some kind of answer, maybe as a ‘gotcha’ and is countered with fact, evidence and logic those reading take notice.

Of course, it is very frustrating and repetitive.

Not all Muslim women wear a headscarf🙄 if being carried by unrelated men wasn't considered appropriate in Algeria I am sure they wouldn't do that either. It would be pretty stupid given the controversy don't you think?

Whilst I take your point, men in women's sports being stupid and not caring about optics is pretty much a given.

Given Khelif was brought up as a woman don't you think it more likely that they know how women in Algeria are expected to dress and act?

And yet........

Why on earth are you still defending Khalif and calling him 'they'?

Do you think he should have free reign to compete as a 'woman' now that he knows he's not.

Is women's olympic sport an option, in your mind, for men who have sad back stories?