I want to find clever friends

[NeverSatisfiedYou]

I want to find interesting people who I can chat about highbrow (and lowbrow stuff) with. I have friends but the ones who fulfil this brief and nourish me live far away and my local friends make me feel like I’m faking it.
I know it makes me sound like a dick but ‘clever’ is how I phrase it, I think I mean engaged.
How do I meet people who are like me? Have you?
my AIBU is - is it unreasonable to require this and look for it specifically? Or am I being a snob?

@Sugarysugar I wasn't dismissing Mensa, it was a warning that it might not be a guaranteed supply of people wanting the sort of conversation she was after.

I left Mensa many years ago, and I found knowing my IQ fueled my sense of failure - why, if my IQ was so high, wasn't I achieving world-changing stuff? So you and I have the same feeling of underachievement, but are approaching it from different viewpoints.

Yes, if you looked at my later post, you'll see I said that a high IQ was not the same as having intellectual interests..

There may be some correlation between IQ and being intellectually engaged, but I’m not mensa material and I’m very familiar with the issue the op is describing. I don’t really talk about my hobbies and interests with most colleagues and even friends as I’m aware they come across as unusual and - to some people - pretentious.

Completely agree that groups and courses are the way to go. There are many, many people out there who want to get into discussions about politics, art, history, and that’s where they are. Book groups that go for more challenging books and are actually about the book at least as much as the social side are great. I also do a lot of continuing education-type courses at weekends or online. Unfortunately, these obviously have a price tag. I have kept in touch with some people I’ve met on these, but even if it’s just chatting in the bar on a residential course with someone you’ll never meet again, it’s fantastic to be able to be able to indulge niche interests with others!

I think you have to go out of your way to find friends you have that kind of connection with, they don't just fall in your lap.

A lot of friendships form from situations you happen to be in like school, work, the school gates etc, Friendships form from spending a lot of consistent time with the same people. I think we often don't really vet who we spend time with on more than a superficial level.

I have found myself feeling almost bored with some friendships because they weren't feeding my curiosity or interests. I'm not really interested in shopping or other traditional 'feminine' activities which doesn't help. No one to blame just a mismatch of interests and often values.

Now I actively seek out similar souls and have joined a book club, art classes and various courses which are a goldmine of interesting and sometimes unconventional people. Volunteering at CAB has also led to some great connections. They are out there, you just have to put yourself in the right environment.

What an utterly ridiculous generalisation. You appear to have had some pretty niche and unusual experiences to conclude that anyone with children cannot be interested in broader topics, and just want to talk about poo. It is also worth bearing in mind that a conversation is a two way dynamic. You are likely not as good a conversationalist as you think you are! You seem pretty bitter.

Do you play an instrument? I've noticed that my musical friends are generally much 'cleverer' and engaged than those of us (including me) who just potter along. If you do play, would a local orchestra or band be somewhere you could find friends?

I sat the exams for MENSA many years ago in my 20s - I left school at 16 went into work in retail management and a guy who came through the graduate training scheme was treating me like I was stupid.

So I went and sat the Mensa exams to try to get over my inferiority complex 😂 At the time, you had one sent through the post to self time and if that scored high enough you had to go and sit the exam in person. Mine was near /at Somerset House.

I passed 😜 and was offered membership but never took it further - I just dropped it casually into the conversation at work!

I think it's about this (for me) that's been hard in my new town rather than finding specialist interest groups. People on a wavelength

I think there's no such thing as clever. If you mean highly educated, that's different. Many more people are capable of this than do so. Conversely, there are highly educated people who are good rote learners, rather than clever.

I think you need to think about what you want from your friends. Similar values, decent politics, formally educated, good readers, what?

I feel EXACTLY the same. My local friends are lovely but I am on a different planet to them and all of our interaction is superficial or stuff I am not interested in,

My interesting friends live too far away, only see them once a year if even that.

I do feel very alone because of this, it makes me sad.

To add, I am now a Prof at a good university as I did a degree in my 30s - I often speak to local groups and societies and there are some very smart people there - I get much tougher questions than I do from students! They are really switched on and interested and active in the community.

Also, your local university may well have series of talks and seminars that the public can attend.

MN itself throws up an enormous range of topics that bear meaty discussion. How often have posters read a thread and thought, I'd love to have a good chat about this sat round a table down the pub? I know I have. And then regret that your friends and family wouldn't be the kind of people to have such a convo with? So I get the OP's point.

I was in MENSA many, many years ago. My dad thought it would be a great opportunity... a lecturer at University told me that they regarded MENSA as a society for intelligent underachievers and, tbh, they were right.

Lots of people with high IQs but little beyond that. A lot of them thought they were better than other people and I didn't find any intellectual common ground with anyone tbh.

I also know what you mean, OP. It's just about being able to debate and discuss and theorise for fun with people who are quick enough to process and formulate a response without feeling you've backed someone into a conversational dead end when you hadn't intended to do that. Someone you can share 'big ideas' with.

Have you looked at meet up groups? Tbh, though, really, those people can often be where you least expect it. But I really need that too. It's what kept my ex husband and me together for so long!

Why do you live where you do? Life is too short to live somewhere that makes you feel sad and alone.

Don't write mums off! I've been stay at home and part time. I also have a PhD in a very academic area and love more in-depth conversations. OP, I have found my voluntary roles have been very stimulating and as they are.not work, I can be very boundaried in how and when I give my time. This is important to me as I also want to be a very hands-on amd engaged mum. I have broadened by skillset so much and this has been helpful in my paid work. Maybe also, book clubs, historical societies, school governor, charity trustee.

unintelligent people bore me. Life is too short.

It can be really hard to find friends who are engaged with, and want to talk about, current affairs, theatre, literature, politics, society etc. I've seen many of my former friends descend into only wanting to talk about their kids' potty training or spelling homework once children come along. These aren't unintelligent people - but it's like they get lobotomised when they become a parent. It's really odd - and certainly not inevitable - and I've come to the conclusion that many feigned interest in cultural/political stuff because it was what was expected of them and now they've just reverted to the norm.
I actually have more time for people who never feigned interest in 'high brow' things and just enjoyed Love Island etc. It's more honest (and definitely more fun than chatting about how their child has their ninth cold of the year).
Anyway, yes, it's challenging to find like-minded conversationalists. I'd recommend groups that reflect your interests - be it a local history group, bird watching, am dram, painting, book club etc. At the very least you can then chat about shared hobbies and interests. And great friendships can cut across generations, gender, class and geography.

Avoid mums?? Didn't realise that I expelled my brain along with the placenta. What a load of fucking rubbish.

I have a PhD and have worked in an academic field my whole life, so most of my friends from young adulthood and work are "inelligent" in the classic academic sense. I like these people, and in a sense they are the people I most naturally get on with.

Yet the most interesting, engaged and like minded friends I have, I made at baby and toddler group. I'm ashamed to admit that I expected the chat to be boring, no doubt as a result of internalised misogyny that litters many of the comments upthread. The women I found were simply amazing. Articulate, interesting, thoughtful, knowldegeable, all of them with interesting jobs or hobbies or experiences to share. It was just amazing watching these women go from explaining financial risk analysis to gently unsticking a tiny finger from a toy car and back again without missing a beat, or giving political insights while wiping a baby's nose. These women were not only intelligent and switched on, but kind, welcoming and friendly. I had never experienced an all female environment before, and much preferred the intellectual conversation when it wasn't a show to impress me or other women, or where the person talking to me didn't look down on me for being a mother. More open and genuine, somehow.

Wow this is a little generalising! I’m a mum who works a ‘basic’ part time job (clinical NHS) but I also have a PhD, play a number of musical instruments and play a competitive sport. I have loads to talk about with the right people!

You don't sound like a snob. Have in mind you wouldn't want to talk to some smart people lol I think what you lack is friends on the same thought process level as you, someone to vibe with. :) I think there are some really good suggestions of finding hobbies or activities to meet people or get close to some work colleagues? You can always reach out to mumsnet people as well if you feel like you would connect and can have interesting discussions.

Has it occurred to you that parents often talk about their children because people like you open the meet-up with the obligatory polite “how are the kids doing?” I reckon a lot of people are at cross-purposes- one asking because they think it’s polite, the other replying because they don’t want to be rude and not answer the question.

As an experiment, just stop mentioning the kids or even acknowledging their existence. I find it tedious in the extreme when people ask about my child, would much rather talk about something else!

Sugarysugar · Today 12:12

I was going to suggest Mensa.

No way! Mensa is mostly for people who want to 'prove' they are 'clever' because they have never achieved anything in their life, often not been to university, but are good at IQ tests. The only well known British people in the history of the universe who have been members are Clive Sinclair (remember him), Carol Voderman (desperate) and Jimmy Savile which telss you everything you need to know!

OP sounds like she wants intellectual ability combined with social skills and actual education - this is not an IQ test job.

@NeverSatisfiedYou I have no idea - most people I know like this I met through my profession but I would love to meet people interested in arts, literature and theatre at a high level. No idea where to find them! Maybe postgraduate short courses now I think about it?

A clear delineation would be… some friends they just talk about other people (boring) . Other friends talk about life, what’s happening in the world, a good book, careers, their own ideas and opinions. So much more interesting. I found being self employed unlocked these friendships for me.

I find that most people aren’t very deep or 3D or analytical & if they are I don’t see that side often. I think the area you live in plays apart - not in terms of intelligence but personality types & thinking styles & interests. You can be the smartest person but not as emotionally intelligent or lateral, there are so many ways to be ‘clever’ but I think you mean deeper types ?

Don’t apologise for wanting to find people who think on a different plane. I truly hope you find them xox

Politics is so insufferably frustrating for many people that they tend to give it a wide swerve as a conversation piece.

Unless one has similar views, and then it just becomes an echo chamber.