Page 16 | To wonder why more men don’t get the snip?

Rainallnight · 2024-10-19T11:01:05+00:00

When their family is complete. Sparked by two (separate) people I know who recently got pregnant with or gave birth to their fourth child. Both shared freely that it was an accident - contraception failure. Life with 3 DC is full on and a bit of a struggle already in both cases. Neither felt abortion was an option for them. When you’re 3 DC in and your family is complete, why on Earth are the men not going for the snip to bring an end to it all? And stop birth control being all on the woman?

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 15:36

GiddyRobin · 21/10/2024 15:23

I've literally repeated the same issues time and again, and they fly so far over your head they're a dust speck on the horizon.

Maybe go back, read properly. Use your big brain. All you've done is offered other contraceptive options when you've been told they cause many and various issues or aren't effective.

If you're trying to make another point, maybe learn to use your words properly. If not, all I can assume is you think you're some kind of caped crusader in a land of stupid and bitchy women.

Which is laughable, frankly. You sound like Dave down the pub. I also didn't say you should leave or even suggest it. I assume comprehension skills aren't your strong point?

Anyway. I'm bored, as I said. Have a nice shot of whiskey to applaud yourself, your job here is done. You showed us pesky girlies!

Edited

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You know, i did just go back and re read and i missed your reply about the issues you had and I'm sorry for that and understand your strong feelings on the issue. but shitty comments above do no good.

'other contraceptive options when you've been told they cause many and various issues or aren't effective.' but when someone says that a vasectomy is not always plain sailing and has it's own share of issues it's brushed under the carpet and compared to the shit women have to deal with, I dont remember comparing the two or saying one was worse than the other, in fact i said women do get the shitty end of the stick when it comes to this side of things.

I've said men should play a part and if you're done having kids it's a pretty compelling solution. But yes, I will call out bitchy comments for no good reason.

3 edits - maybe I'm not the only one who should re-read what I've written.

GiddyRobin · 21/10/2024 15:39

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 15:36

You know, i did just go back and re read and i missed your reply about the issues you had and I'm sorry for that and understand your strong feelings on the issue. but shitty comments above do no good.

'other contraceptive options when you've been told they cause many and various issues or aren't effective.' but when someone says that a vasectomy is not always plain sailing and has it's own share of issues it's brushed under the carpet and compared to the shit women have to deal with, I dont remember comparing the two or saying one was worse than the other, in fact i said women do get the shitty end of the stick when it comes to this side of things.

I've said men should play a part and if you're done having kids it's a pretty compelling solution. But yes, I will call out bitchy comments for no good reason.

3 edits - maybe I'm not the only one who should re-read what I've written.

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🥱

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 15:42

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 15:36

You know, i did just go back and re read and i missed your reply about the issues you had and I'm sorry for that and understand your strong feelings on the issue. but shitty comments above do no good.

'other contraceptive options when you've been told they cause many and various issues or aren't effective.' but when someone says that a vasectomy is not always plain sailing and has it's own share of issues it's brushed under the carpet and compared to the shit women have to deal with, I dont remember comparing the two or saying one was worse than the other, in fact i said women do get the shitty end of the stick when it comes to this side of things.

I've said men should play a part and if you're done having kids it's a pretty compelling solution. But yes, I will call out bitchy comments for no good reason.

3 edits - maybe I'm not the only one who should re-read what I've written.

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Do you not recognise the hypocrisy though? You/men don't want to take the small risk, but you/men happily let women do so?
You said there are options when a condom splits for example - that's you passing the risk to your partner.
Fine, if those are the choices a couple makes, if they're both happy, great. Not my business. But I do think men should be exploring why they are happy to pass along risks that they themselves won't take. It's not some great coincidence that women are mostly happy to do so, and men aren't. We are not biologically predisposed to love family planning measures. Do what you (not you, you, general you) want, but dig deep and really think about why you think what you think and do what you do.

GiddyRobin · 21/10/2024 15:51

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 15:42

Do you not recognise the hypocrisy though? You/men don't want to take the small risk, but you/men happily let women do so?
You said there are options when a condom splits for example - that's you passing the risk to your partner.
Fine, if those are the choices a couple makes, if they're both happy, great. Not my business. But I do think men should be exploring why they are happy to pass along risks that they themselves won't take. It's not some great coincidence that women are mostly happy to do so, and men aren't. We are not biologically predisposed to love family planning measures. Do what you (not you, you, general you) want, but dig deep and really think about why you think what you think and do what you do.

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Considering he thinks the possibility of an achy vagina would be enough to put women off operations, I doubt he does see the hypocrisy. He clearly doesn't even consider what women's bodies go through if he's using that as his excuse to not get the snip.

Hence I don't think there's any point in even speaking to him. Maybe mature in body, but perhaps not in thought.

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 15:59

GiddyRobin · 21/10/2024 15:51

Considering he thinks the possibility of an achy vagina would be enough to put women off operations, I doubt he does see the hypocrisy. He clearly doesn't even consider what women's bodies go through if he's using that as his excuse to not get the snip.

Hence I don't think there's any point in even speaking to him. Maybe mature in body, but perhaps not in thought.

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I 100% do, and I can't think of any men who would want to see their partner suffer; the onus has been on women for too long, and just because that's how it's always been doesn't mean that is how it should be. I was just giving an insight and questioning some opinions given here, i should be able to do so in a constructive manner, without being verbally attacked. I think the first thing I said was, 'I feel whatever I say in this debate, I'll be wrong!' and the very first reply was skewed straight away, straight on cue.

Some people won't listen to anything if it doesn't fit their narrative, and a lot of the time on here, it's all men are bastards.

@GiddyRobin I don't think i ever said i wouldn't get it done, in fact it's been a topic of choice the last couple of days, hence me taking a look at this thread. All i did was share an opinion and for that i must be a terrible person. I'll say again re read what I've written, because I'm all in favour of having it done, but for a lot of men the risks sound horrible, i dont ever remember comparing them to anything women go through or do go through. all that has been done by women.

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 16:01

sorry, thats more of a reply to Fluufer

Boobygravy · 21/10/2024 16:07

A work colleague wouldn’t push her dh to have a vasectomy after 3 dc because if she died he might want more dc.
He did have another dc, but she hadn’t died and it wasn’t hers.
I think she regretted being so magnanimous.

GiddyRobin · 21/10/2024 16:11

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 15:59

I 100% do, and I can't think of any men who would want to see their partner suffer; the onus has been on women for too long, and just because that's how it's always been doesn't mean that is how it should be. I was just giving an insight and questioning some opinions given here, i should be able to do so in a constructive manner, without being verbally attacked. I think the first thing I said was, 'I feel whatever I say in this debate, I'll be wrong!' and the very first reply was skewed straight away, straight on cue.

Some people won't listen to anything if it doesn't fit their narrative, and a lot of the time on here, it's all men are bastards.

@GiddyRobin I don't think i ever said i wouldn't get it done, in fact it's been a topic of choice the last couple of days, hence me taking a look at this thread. All i did was share an opinion and for that i must be a terrible person. I'll say again re read what I've written, because I'm all in favour of having it done, but for a lot of men the risks sound horrible, i dont ever remember comparing them to anything women go through or do go through. all that has been done by women.

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When did I (or anyone?) suggest all men were bastards? Funny, because if you read my posts you'll find a lot of them talk about how glad I am DH is a good man. I love him very much.

I just don't have time for selfish babies whimpering about a bit of bruising when I've been sliced from vagina to anus. 🤷‍♀️

You just have an agenda, and you know it. I've seen your posts around, and you think you're some voice of truth.

And that's the last post you're getting from me now, once and for all. I don't have time for going in circles with men who know full well they're being provocative. Have a delightful day.

Noname99 · 21/10/2024 16:15

Just use condom & diaphragm? Male uses condoms & female uses diaphragm. That’s a fail safe as a vasectomy. Why would you want to risk it? Even if it’s one in a 500 or 1000. Why would you want to risk your partner being in pain or incontinent when there is a ready made solution that’s as near 0% as you can get? Seriously, why??

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 16:27

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 15:59

I 100% do, and I can't think of any men who would want to see their partner suffer; the onus has been on women for too long, and just because that's how it's always been doesn't mean that is how it should be. I was just giving an insight and questioning some opinions given here, i should be able to do so in a constructive manner, without being verbally attacked. I think the first thing I said was, 'I feel whatever I say in this debate, I'll be wrong!' and the very first reply was skewed straight away, straight on cue.

Some people won't listen to anything if it doesn't fit their narrative, and a lot of the time on here, it's all men are bastards.

@GiddyRobin I don't think i ever said i wouldn't get it done, in fact it's been a topic of choice the last couple of days, hence me taking a look at this thread. All i did was share an opinion and for that i must be a terrible person. I'll say again re read what I've written, because I'm all in favour of having it done, but for a lot of men the risks sound horrible, i dont ever remember comparing them to anything women go through or do go through. all that has been done by women.

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I think you have to remember as well, that you joined late in the thread. You're not adding anything that hasn't already been covered. It's not a "narrative" to disagree with you and point out flaws in your argument. You're not doing much listening either are you really?
But we get it. You hypothetically would, but haven't and we should never ever ask. Ok.
Oh, and you 100% can think of men like that because it is lots of them. Sitting and watching something happen when they could do something about it, is for all intents and purposes, wanting it to happen.

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 16:27

Noname99 · 21/10/2024 16:15

Just use condom & diaphragm? Male uses condoms & female uses diaphragm. That’s a fail safe as a vasectomy. Why would you want to risk it? Even if it’s one in a 500 or 1000. Why would you want to risk your partner being in pain or incontinent when there is a ready made solution that’s as near 0% as you can get? Seriously, why??

That's not much fun though is it?😂

40YearOldDad · 21/10/2024 16:38

GiddyRobin · 21/10/2024 16:11

When did I (or anyone?) suggest all men were bastards? Funny, because if you read my posts you'll find a lot of them talk about how glad I am DH is a good man. I love him very much.

I just don't have time for selfish babies whimpering about a bit of bruising when I've been sliced from vagina to anus. 🤷‍♀️

You just have an agenda, and you know it. I've seen your posts around, and you think you're some voice of truth.

And that's the last post you're getting from me now, once and for all. I don't have time for going in circles with men who know full well they're being provocative. Have a delightful day.

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It's not a voice of truth; it's just slight reason and different opinions. because it would be boring if everyone were the same.

Have a good one -

Themaghag · 21/10/2024 17:01

Noname99 · 21/10/2024 16:15

Just use condom & diaphragm? Male uses condoms & female uses diaphragm. That’s a fail safe as a vasectomy. Why would you want to risk it? Even if it’s one in a 500 or 1000. Why would you want to risk your partner being in pain or incontinent when there is a ready made solution that’s as near 0% as you can get? Seriously, why??

Ah yes, the diaphragm! I remember those and the hours I spent fiddling around in the bathroom, only to watch the bloody thing ping out and roll across the floor, more often than not. And even on the few occasions when I was reasonably confident that I had put it in the right place and it remained intact, I returned to the bedroom only to discover that my husband had got bored of waiting and had simply fallen asleep. Maybe that's how it's designed to work?

Comedycook · 21/10/2024 17:12

I returned to the bedroom only to discover that my husband had got bored of waiting and had simply fallen asleep. Maybe that's how it's designed to work?

😂

Utr90 · 21/10/2024 17:39

All these comments about men not wanting it done because they want to keep their options open or might want a second family!

This is EXACTLY why, if I ever marry, I'd want him to get the snip: To protect any children we might have, in the event of a split/divorce, from unwanted half siblings to some random new woman who is unrelated to my child. I would also consider getting steralised after a split as I also wouldn't dream of having a second family with a new partner at my child's emotional and mental expense. So many separated parents do though and don't seem to consider their existing children- drives me mad!

Wellingtonspie · 21/10/2024 17:42

Utr90 · 21/10/2024 17:39

All these comments about men not wanting it done because they want to keep their options open or might want a second family!

This is EXACTLY why, if I ever marry, I'd want him to get the snip: To protect any children we might have, in the event of a split/divorce, from unwanted half siblings to some random new woman who is unrelated to my child. I would also consider getting steralised after a split as I also wouldn't dream of having a second family with a new partner at my child's emotional and mental expense. So many separated parents do though and don't seem to consider their existing children- drives me mad!

Helps in chase of a cheating husband too let’s face it. Any no other women coming knocking with a baby in arms for some child support.

Winner winner

ThisOldThang · 21/10/2024 17:45

"So basically snip or no sex."

To be honest the no sex bit wouldn't bother me too much. I'm kind of over it these days.

The ultimatum/attempted blackmail to try and force me into a medical procedure would be a deal breaker, though. I'd consider that to be abusive / coercive control, so I'd probably walk and go 50/50 custody.

Wellingtonspie · 21/10/2024 17:51

ThisOldThang · 21/10/2024 17:45

"So basically snip or no sex."

To be honest the no sex bit wouldn't bother me too much. I'm kind of over it these days.

The ultimatum/attempted blackmail to try and force me into a medical procedure would be a deal breaker, though. I'd consider that to be abusive / coercive control, so I'd probably walk and go 50/50 custody.

Is it attempted black mail though or just setting out your stall?

“Look I love sex with you dh, however you know how shit contraception is for me and I also don’t want to go though an abortion or the hormones in the map (which doesn’t work if you’ve already ovulated) if a condom broke. Which kinda leaves us with no sex or the snip. What do you think? “

Because if you think getting the snip on the nhs can be hard getting a women sterilised unless she’s already having a C-section well you might as well buy a lottery ticket.

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 17:51

ThisOldThang · 21/10/2024 17:45

"So basically snip or no sex."

To be honest the no sex bit wouldn't bother me too much. I'm kind of over it these days.

The ultimatum/attempted blackmail to try and force me into a medical procedure would be a deal breaker, though. I'd consider that to be abusive / coercive control, so I'd probably walk and go 50/50 custody.

It's not blackmail for a woman to refuse to risk sex with a fertile man. Everyone is allowed their own sexual boundaries.

BigFatLiar · 21/10/2024 17:56

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 17:51

It's not blackmail for a woman to refuse to risk sex with a fertile man. Everyone is allowed their own sexual boundaries.

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Indeed and it would basically mean that you were no longer compatible as a married couple so divorce and 50/50 could well be on the cards.

Perhaps with so many failing marriages he wouldn't want the snip in case a future partner wanted children.

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 18:00

BigFatLiar · 21/10/2024 17:56

Indeed and it would basically mean that you were no longer compatible as a married couple so divorce and 50/50 could well be on the cards.

Perhaps with so many failing marriages he wouldn't want the snip in case a future partner wanted children.

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If he's thinking about future partners at all, then good riddance imo. I'll see him to the door.

BigFatLiar · 21/10/2024 18:04

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 18:00

If he's thinking about future partners at all, then good riddance imo. I'll see him to the door.

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Perhaps he's a mumsnetter. It's fairly standard to be advised to set yourself up in case your relationship fails. He'd just be doing the same. Or would you suggest that anyone with a hidden fund to get away should simply leave now.

ThisOldThang · 21/10/2024 18:46

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 17:51

It's not blackmail for a woman to refuse to risk sex with a fertile man. Everyone is allowed their own sexual boundaries.

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People are free to refuse sex for any reason they like, but unless it was explicitly discussed before marriage and kids (i.e. "We're having x kids and then I expect you to have a vasectomy or it will be a sexless marriage."), then it's quite a big change to the T&Cs of the marriage contract.

I don't think it would be too surprising if the marriage ended or if the man felt he was being blackmailed into a vasectomy.

ThisOldThang · 21/10/2024 18:50

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 18:00

If he's thinking about future partners at all, then good riddance imo. I'll see him to the door.

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As I previously stated up thread, I don't need a vasectomy due to fertility issues, but I wouldn't get one due to the risk of incontinence, impotence and lifelong testicular pain - I had a testicular infection as a teenager and the pain was absolutely horrific.

Fluufer · 21/10/2024 18:54

ThisOldThang · 21/10/2024 18:46

People are free to refuse sex for any reason they like, but unless it was explicitly discussed before marriage and kids (i.e. "We're having x kids and then I expect you to have a vasectomy or it will be a sexless marriage."), then it's quite a big change to the T&Cs of the marriage contract.

I don't think it would be too surprising if the marriage ended or if the man felt he was being blackmailed into a vasectomy.

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T&Cs of the marriage contract? I'm sorry but I don't remember my marriage vows including an itemised list of every scenario ever conceivable that we must never deviate from, even for our spouses sake. I'm sorry if yours did. It must be awful to be beholden to that inflexibility.