I feel like the 'poor one' compared to DH

[likespiano]

I actually know I’m being unreasonable and I’m trying to figure out why! We’re really lucky, financially, so I don’t know why I’m always scrimping and saving, counting the pennies, while DH buys anything he wants. It’s really jarring.

I’m from UK but live in Italy with DH (in his home town) and our two DC. DD is 10 and NT. DS is 7 and ND. DH works full time, employed, 24 000 euros a year (including tax relief because of DS). I teach, 10 hours a week, self employed, about 10 000 euros a year (6 500 euros after tax). My in-laws live round the corner and do a lot of childcare. They also gave us our house, so we have no rent or mortgage. I know how lucky I am. But seeing as I’m so lucky, why am I so broke and why isn’t DH?

I think our expenses are quite well organised, he pays all the larger bills (food, utilities, car maintenance and insurance) and I pay the smaller ones (internet, water, rubbish) and of course my personal expenses (phone, 150 euros a month into a private pension, my accountant which is 700 euros a year). Obviously any new clothes, coffee, yoga etc on top of that. Kids’ stuff since I’m with them most of the time. I’ve always managed.

Recently I’ve noticed that DH has been gradually transferring expenses that he used to cover onto me. We changed our second car, the new one is in my name and now I’m paying petrol. I know that’s fair, since I use it for work, but I didn’t use to pay petrol as I used his second car, and he filled them both up. We never explicitly agreed it, it just happened. Also, holidays. I paid for an extra holiday this summer because he didn’t come, he doesn’t like the beach. I suggested that in future I and DC go with my mother instead of him. He agreed, and he’ll cover DCs expenses, but that’s not the same as paying for the whole thing, which he did until now. Last month we agreed I was having difficulty, and now he refunds me anything I spend on DC. It’s hard to tell how much it’ll help as it’s so new. But last month, he paid late, rounded down, complained. I minimised, didn’t include everything I’d spent on them, felt guilty.

Money-saving initiatives generally seem to backfire. For example, I suggested we get a second-hand bike for DS, to save money. DH looked online and decided he wanted a BMX bike for himself, so he ended up buying that instead. Then we got DS a new bike anyway. DH used to play the drums, but sold them as he didn’t use them anymore. Then he missed it, so he rented a small hall with a drumkit for a couple of years. We went shopping for new shoes for DC and DH found a pair of trainers at 110 euros, for him. It was actually a relief – if he felt he could afford those, surely we aren’t as broke as he says? He also has a very expensive hobby, riding his motorbike. He always says I can ask him for anything and not to worry about money, but then he complains a lot about bills and how he hardly has any money, so I don’t feel I can. My yoga membership is due next month, but I’m not going to renew it. Me and DH go out for a drink together once a week, I’ve suggested we get a bottle of wine and watch Netflix at home instead. Even tiny things, I drink tap water but he hass bottled. I’d like fizzy water too, but it would only mean more stuff to lug home from the supermarket, so I don’t. I feel so petty and resentful. Can we make things fairer, or are we both just spendthrifts?

I meant it's me in that I tend to make myself Cinderella like the MIL in the PPs story. Actually we're both over ice cream and only the kids get it when we go out! I'm definitely going to talk to DH. I really don't think he's doing anything maliciously, just that he's never had to budget before.

The hypothetical ice cream is not the issue. The issue is that you make yourself Cinderella and do without, while everybody else is prioritised.
I am also a bit hmmm that one of your DC will inherit the house. Why wouldn't the other one also inherit?

I think OP you have been a bit brainwashed. Everyone can see its not a normal situation, but you seem to zoom in on insignificant details and avoid looking at bigger picture.

You have a husband, you say your income is sufficient for your family not to feel poor but for some reason you do feel poor while your husband is feeling fine. The only reason for this is that you have accepted you are subordinate to your husband and do not deserve him supporting you 100%. You should not be wanting money (for anything, including your own stuff) even if you dont work at all. Sorry to sound a bit old fashioned but this is precisely what Italian set up is - very old fashioned. Husband provides, you take care of other stuff like keeping the house and raising kids. It seems like your husband got lucky and got you instead of a traditional Italian lady. You have been brought up in a more equal society where you think you need to contribute to the pot, and should not completely rely on your other half. You feel guilty asking for money and for the fact you dont earn much - even though you are raising kids and is living in an unfamiliar country with limited options to earn money. So your hubby is living it large, still having the patriarchal bullshit going on but without the need to support you and kids financially. You really need to stop and compare your situation with your Italian friends.

Yes, there is a bit of ‘trying to have it both ways’ going on from your DH.

My understanding is that patriarchal societies generally come with the corresponding quid pro quo that the woman should be utterly in charge of the household domain and if she says that something is needed for the house or children, then the husband should do his best to provide it - not quibble over the cost of children’s clothing and other items.

But ultimately I still think your lives would be better and more secure if you budgeted, tried to improve your income and set aside some savings.

Sorry OP, you’re still really missing the point. It’s not about saving, cost of living etc per se, it’s about you being taken advantage of. Your husband has carried on living his life while you are drowning in tasks with little money. That’s a problem with him as a person, as a husband, is it not?

I don't agree that we're as poor as PPs are saying - several of DHs colleagues, on similar salaries, are married to SAHMs and they get by

Why have you got no money for things for yourself then? If you as a family have plenty of money, why do you ‘feel poor’? That’s what you have to address.

Hi OP, I'm not going to respond re the finances other than to say I'm from a wealthier background than my DH and as far as we're concerned our standard of living is joint. I don't know what the words of the Italian marriage service say but I distinctly remember a bit in the English one covering this!

Anyway, I wanted to respond as a secondary school teacher. I'm over a decade in and I had to do a lot of work planning to begin with (everybody does) and felt low confidence.

Every year I've got more confident and have more resources I can reuse. Now I mostly spend time thinking about how to do things better, make things more efficient and doing some updating (as it's a current affairs subject). I have a ND child too and age 7 was the peak of the difficulties (so far, anyway).

If you're teaching in a second language that's even harder. I admire that.

I wouldn't jack in the teaching or skimp on planning but I would make a three year plan and increase hours gradually. Planning for parallel classes doesn't take much longer than planning for one (obviously doubles the marking).

That was exactly my dilemma and the reason I posted - I was wondering if I was doing this to myself and it was all in my head.

Well the money is either there for you to spend or it isn’t. If it’s there and you’re not spending it because you don’t feel you’re worth it, then yes, you’re doing it to yourself. If the money is controlled by your husband and he is making you feel guilty for spending it/asking for access to it then no, you’re not doing it to yourself, he’s doing it to you. If there just is no money to spend then you need to look at your incomings and outgoings and make a budget (although I’d suggest you need to do this anyway… our household income is over 5 times yours and we still stick to a budget so that we can get the most out of our money).

Just to update, I had a conversation with DH, directly as a result of this thread (he knows about it but hasnt read it). We have decided I will look for work next summer when the schools close for three months, rather than taking the time off like I did this year. So hopefully increasing my annual income without increasing the number of hours I work during the school year. We have also agreed to work out a budget together and I feel quite hopeful about all of this. Thank you everyone for commenting xx

Hi op,

so you pay everything for the kids. Yeah well that is it lol. Children are very expensive.

you should pay all bills and then split whatever is left. Don’t go on holidays you can’t afford. You need to pay for gas for you to work. All the splits he suggested are fine but he need to disclose his money. Maybe his parents help him? You are right that it doesn’t all add up.

Good luck 🌺

This is an awful solution? It just means you working even more, not getting a break, but him changing nothing!

The budget is good and the increased hours is good, but overall fairness needs to be in there too. What's he doing to change?

This would drive me nuts. Parents rarely earn the same. You doing much of the childcare should even things out. It should be one pot and both equally benefit. One month maybe a few more things for one, other times for you. As long as you both agree there should be no his and mine imo.

I think anything other than a family pot is unfair, especially since you have moved countries for him, are putting up with his family and raising your SN child.
I agree with pp upthread who said that he is reaping all the benefits of having a British wife so no joint pot, but also getting all the benefits of having an Italian wife as well, who looks after the kids and and keeps house.

Exactly. Unfortunately I don’t think Op is ready to accept that despite pages of posts telling her their current set up is disadvantageous and unfair and she is not in fact that “lucky” in terms of her housing.

I'd make a list of all outgoings then divide it so you and your dh have same leftover for personal use/saving.

I wouldn't ask him for money when you spend it on kids I'd just allocate a rough average.

Or have a joint account for bills/expenses that you both pay into again leaving you with the same amount spare.

Then you can try to save for holidays etc.

My partner earns a lot more than me. We have a joint account that we both transfer money to each month and all communal bills come out of that. We did pay the same amount into it, but last year my income reduced, so I pay less than him currently.

Then what we have left over is ours to do what we like with. He has more left than me, but will often pay for extra stuff for the house or buy me a present etc. it’s worked for us for 20+ years and means we don’t argue about money. The house isn’t 50/50, as he put more in, but it’s 60/40 on the deeds.

€10000 a year? Is that not poor? It's less than UK minimum wage

Your married, which should mean you are a team. Joint account. End of! I know from reading your post you will feel arkward asking to set this up, but it shouldn't! Shared kid, shared marriage, shared home.

His solution is for you to work over the summer. What is he planning to change?

OP lesson planning taking forever! Once a lesson has been planned it can be reused surely I.e. first year yes a lot of planning, but after that you reuse the same plans - where did you learn to teach?

I'm less shocked by the income level than some - the cost of living differs hugely from place to place. Mortgage/rent and childcare are most people's biggest bills and they don't have those. And you just can't compare the cost of rural Italy to the U.K.

But I do think the OP is in a precarious situation if anything were to happen to her marriage. And the current financial situation sounds hugely unfair. The proposed solution puts all the burden on the OP without the husband needing to change a thing. OP, you are sounding pretty naive.

its not , as it's only10 hours a week! it's actually pretty good pay for 10 hours a week.