AIBU to rehome our much loved dog?

[Fluffy2023]

I need some impartial advice before I potentially make a terrible choice so hit me with your honest thoughts please. For context, I have a dog who we have owned from a pup. He was brought home and lockdown happened the following day which meant no socialisation or training classes. This meant after lockdown, he was terrified and fear aggressive to dogs and people. We did take him to multiple training classes when things re opened, however this made him more scared. We have always managed his fear aggression by keeping him away from visitors and worked with a behaviouralist, making him slightly more calm. We have also had a baby who is now a toddler and our dog is scared and lashes out at the toddler whenever he is in the same room. We are now in a position where the dog is living in another room to the family and we feel this isn't fair on him. He gets walked and love and attention but not as much as we or he would like. We have found a possible suitable match for him (pending a home check and that the new owner wants him after initial meeting).
I'm in bits, is it more cruel to send him away, or to keep him with us but living in a separate part of the house? We have tried things with vet advice including medication but no improvement. My main worry is that even with checks, his new home might be cruel or dishonest or give him away again when we can keep him, but just not as close to us as he would like. Any advice appreciated.

Sorry but if you keep him you're an utterly negligent parent.

Putting an animal first by killing them. Of course. How stupid of me.

Yes, that often is the best case scenario.

There's a reason OP can't find a rescue to help her. Aggressive dogs are not happy dogs and are often much better off being put to sleep then being forced to live a life of fear and segregation.

Thank you for the balanced advice. We have muzzle trained him yes im in 2 minds as to keep him but keep the muzzle on

Of course you can't do that - it would animal cruelty. Muzzles are not designed to be worn for long periods of time.

Your narrative, and a few other posters, of how you think our dog became aggressive is misguided.

I'm not here to engage in arguments, I asked for advice and I am prepared for judgement etc. This is my fault for not explaining, but I only put the main points in my OP, some more detail if you have time to read:

The dog came to us at 8 weeks. He was socialised as much as possible; minimum of 2 long walks per day, gatherings in the garden with family, our circle is small.

Breed awareness. I have awareness and experience of the breed. And with this awareness, I also knew the importance of the key socialisation window. I also knew that my dog needed a high level of exposure to people and dogs as he was a nervous pup, which we couldn't give him. Also know how they can be very frightened and territorial dogs and the need to socialise to prevent this escalation. From 12 weeks old, he would bark at strangers who we could not build him up to at that time. I'm talking the same time we had to queue a metre apart to get to Tesco time.

Training: He attended his good citizen bronze dog training award at around 10 months old, again, this was in a group setting and he at this stage would bark and lunge at strangers and dogs in the class. The class could only run outside due to restrictions and again, he was kept a metre apart.

Trauma: when he was 1, he had to have an operation on his back legs for luxating patella. This reinforced his fear of humans as it was traumatic for him.

Chihuahua Rescue: I've phoned multiple and all have said he wouldn't be rehomed due to his nature. I've gone online and advertised him with full disclosure and have only engaged with this potential adopter as she has provided her details and shown me her website with past work as a dog trainer. I am also aware this could be too good to be true, she could be looking for dog bait etc.
Also aware he might not get along with another dog. Her theory is, based on her experience of rescues, in a controlled environment, he may settle with slow introductions to his new pack and this might help him feel more safe and secure. She is visiting our home and if I'm happy and she is wanting to take him we will plan a home visit to her house. It's never advisable to go online and I know this, however, I'm exhausting all options.

If you've read this far, Apologies for the essay.

@Fluffy2023 bringing home a chihuahua puppy at eight weeks of age is highly irresponsible and a sure sign that your breeder wasn't remotely reputable. I'm sure you don't want to hear that, though.

They should stay with mum until at least twelve weeks due to their size.

Your narrative, and a few other posters, of how you think our dog became aggressive is misguided.
I'm not here to engage in arguments, I asked for advice and I am prepared for judgement etc. This is my fault for not explaining, but I only put the main points in my OP, some more detail if you have time to read:
The dog came to us at 8 weeks. He was socialised as much as possible; minimum of 2 long walks per day, gatherings in the garden with family, our circle is small.
Breed awareness. I have awareness and experience of the breed. And with this awareness, I also knew the importance of the key socialisation window. I also knew that my dog needed a high level of exposure to people and dogs as he was a nervous pup, which we couldn't give him. Also know how they can be very frightened and territorial dogs and the need to socialise to prevent this escalation. From 12 weeks old, he would bark at strangers who we could not build him up to at that time. I'm talking the same time we had to queue a metre apart to get to Tesco time.
Training: He attended his good citizen bronze dog training award at around 10 months old, again, this was in a group setting and he at this stage would bark and lunge at strangers and dogs in the class. The class could only run outside due to restrictions and again, he was kept a metre apart.
Trauma: when he was 1, he had to have an operation on his back legs for luxating patella. This reinforced his fear of humans as it was traumatic for him.
Chihuahua Rescue: I've phoned multiple and all have said he wouldn't be rehomed due to his nature. I've gone online and advertised him with full disclosure and have only engaged with this potential adopter as she has provided her details and shown me her website with past work as a dog trainer. I am also aware this could be too good to be true, she could be looking for dog bait etc.
Also aware he might not get along with another dog. Her theory is, based on her experience of rescues, in a controlled environment, he may settle with slow introductions to his new pack and this might help him feel more safe and secure. She is visiting our home and if I'm happy and she is wanting to take him we will plan a home visit to her house. It's never advisable to go online and I know this, however, I'm exhausting all options.
If you've read this far, Apologies for the essay.

8 weeks was too soon with hindsight. Possibly mistake number 1 on our part.

Far too soon, and unfortunately it has likely contributed to a lot of the problems you're having now.

A nervous chihuahua puppy who has been taken from mum a whole month too early is a huge red flag for behavioural problems down the line. Any breeder who allows a puppy to leave mum in those circumstances is to be avoided - your poor puppy was on the back foot from day one.

Unfortunately this just goes to highlight how important it is for people to do their research and to pick a good breeder. Those foundations come from mum and if they're not there, no amount of training or socialisation will make it any better.

1. Killing the dog surely should not be an option
2. I missed the bit in your posts where you said he had bitten...
3. Gut instinct - go for it it is a very good chance that this lady is who she says she is. Meet her visit her home
4. Why didn't you return him to his breeder ?
5. There will be other good people out there that will adopt your dog, it takes time and word of mouth. If you lived in South Devon I would put you in touch with my dog groomer as she has rehomed several dogs for people for various reasons and she has found people looking for a dog - usually clients of many years whose dog have passed away. Small dogs are always more ' popular ' than big dogs
6. No he can't continue as he is, he will get more and more unhappy being in a different room, and muzzling is not practical nor kind for long periods of time - tho used carefully they can be useful. I fostered a dog for 3/4 months whom I had to muzzle as she would have hurt my dogs and the other foster dogs if I turned my back / left her - she was adopted by a lovely couple that had recently lost their dog of the same breed and she went as an only dog and they all lived happily ever after.

Correct, we didn't realise this at the time. The breeder had mam and dad in the home. Again, now questioning this as it could have been a front. We also read mixed advice online around taking the pup home at 8 weeks. I would now always advise people to keep pup with mum for aw long as possible.

@Fluffy2023 having both parents at home is another massive red flag.

Unfortunately it sounds like you were taken in by a backyard breeder (at best) or a puppy farmer (at worst) and your puppy has suffered the heartbreaking consequences of that.

But you claimed in a previous post you had awareness of the breed. So you should have known eight weeks was too early…

TBH your lockdown dates aren’t matching either - November/October 2020 (when you claim your dog was ten months) was basically full lock down. Only essential businesses could be open. No training classes near me were run then.

Killing the dog surely should not be an option

Why?

If this was an XL Bully, or a German Shepherd, nobody would be saying to rehome or to give this dog another chance. A chihuahua that bites and that reacts in the way OP describes is not a happy dog.

It would likely be much kinder to have it put to sleep than it would be to pass it off to someone else.

Thank you for this advice. Much appreciated and gives me some hope.

We contacted the breeder not long after for advice around reactivity and behaviour and she didn't want to hear from us. She told me to tell the dog a firm no when he bites...unfortunately we had already tried this and contacted a behavioralist who gave us loads of tips to help. They have worked to an extent, he is a lot calmer and less aggressive than he was. Can watch on command and will ignore passing dogs. A lot more pressured for him though and stressed out in the house with a toddler, it's heartbreaking watching him not understand.

No!

@wavingfuriously why not?

This animal was badly bred and is suffering as a result. It has bite history and is aggressive to both humans and other dogs.

Would you be saying "no!" If it was an XL Bully? I doubt it.

Timeline: Dogs D.O.B Jan 22nd 2020.
Lockdown was announced March 23rd (ish) literally the day after we brought him home.
Classes were booked and cancelled as a result.
Was atleast 10 months old before we got him booked on to outdoor training classes.

I don't understand the questioning of facts here, but happy to present all the info I have.

To add...we didn't know 8 weeks was to early. There is conflicting advice on Google. But fully acknowledge yes I was totally wrong here and this has potentially been detrimental to his life.

It is the post at 10.29 before the Op has used the word bites, until that post the words bites / bitten had not been used.
The words used were growls barks lunges

and I very carefully reread every post by the Op before typing this.

This is not an XL bully, whilst yes if it bit a child or a toddler it would hurt, it would bleed and it would leave a mark
it will not do as much damage as an XL bully would ! as the child would probably be dead.

but then I wouldn't have an XL bully
and I wouldn't have an XL Bully in a home with a child

yes I am aware ' we ' don't want a child hurt at all - hence the need for this dog to be rehomed.

That’s my point. He’d have been ten months in October and November - when we headed back into lockdown. So he can’t have done it then.

Could he have a really large crate so he can at least be safely spending some time in the same room with everyone?

Poor little dude, if I didn't work and also in the middle of house renovations I'd offer to meet him. I'm older, live alone, quiet house (and as far from a dog baiter as possible to be, but of course anyone on the internet could say the same) so there must be other genuine people in the world that would feel the same. But in all honesty the rural home that takes in problem rescues doesn't sound right for an already terrified tiny dog.

If you're near NW Lancashire, I can send details of a decent rescue I used to volunteer at that often had dogs with behavioural issues, as sadly young dogs being turfed out when children come along is not uncommon.

@Fluffy2023 ypu could contact local rescue charities and ask for their help in finding an appropriate home. Also you could talk to your vet they may also know someone or a contact you can speak to. I would try and avoid giving the dog to a refuge because the time spent in a pen at the rescue centre is very traumatic for dogs; so it would be worth saying you would like to rehome with their help and you could even attempt a settling in period over some hours meeting new owner etc so it’s not such a shock for the dog. You would feel better about it aswell if you knew you’d done the best possible. It’s not an easy thing to do but given what you’ve said it would be in everyone’s best interests including the dogs - they need a family unit where they feel safe and secure and would be happier in a better suited environment.

Sorry, your right I hadn't written this. He hasn't bitten anyone since we implemented training but he most certainly has a bite history, and would continue to bite given the chance.

I personally would PTS ….this dog has had problems now for a very long time and so are likely deeply ingrained, he is also fearful of dogs plus humans so going to another home with rescue dogs who will have their own history of trauma is going to cause him even more problems. We become incredibly sentimental ( understandably ) about PTS but for the dog it is just going to sleep and passing away, they have no concept of death .

I will add @Fluffy2023 that I expect your dog will be a different dog in a different environment. Many dogs will behave like this when they are afraid- i don’t think it means he is ‘unfixable’ or that he will also be aggressive. All dogs have the capacity to be aggressive. I have had rescue dogs even with a toddler and without and I’ve seen them terrified at the rescue shelter and become totally different dogs at home or out of that environment. You need to explain to those who are helping (vets or rescue etc) that the dog is fearful and needs an experienced and calm environment. Which you already know! I wouldn’t be saying it’s unmanageable or he needs PTS because that’s a bit ridiculous at this point. He’s clearly not stable because he doesn’t feel secure in the environment he’s in. That’s all. good luck x