Female nurses have to get changed with a male. They are told to go to another room. The man keeps the female changing room to himself. Wtaf is going on?

[TealTraybake]

Female nurses ‘forced out of changing rooms’ after complaining about trans colleague

NHS whistleblowers dubbed ‘Darlington Five’ say they feel ‘humiliated and dehumanised’

Read in The Telegraph: https://apple.news/AC7RGaXTPTYe2J4CAixEvDw

My demand, by asking a question 😂 another classic deflection. I can back up my position that men are not women, time for you to back up your position that they can be.

No you want people to clarify so that you can take screenshots of supposed "transphobia" which you will then post on twitter and r ed dit for imaginary Internet points.

So again, fuck off with your faux naivety.

Trans people deserve respect and safely.
Women deserve respect and safety.

Agree.
How wonderful it could be if we could start from this basic point of consensus and then have a productive conversation about how to achieve that in a way that genuinely promotes that respect and safety for all.

Oh you are telling me to fuck off again?

Do you think people’s statements might look like transphobia?

What do you mean by fully transitioned? Even if a man chopped off his dick (they hardly ever do this, shocker) and took hormones he still wouldn't be female. So what is "fully transitioned"?

Not that it matters, he'd still be a bloke.

Even if a man chopped off his dick (they hardly ever do this, shocker)

do you think this might look like transphobia?

No they don't look like transphobia, but you know that. They look like standing up for womens rights. Which is why you hate it.

My opinion is that they're male. And should not be in female spaces. Ever!

No hth.

I'm not saying that at all, where did you get that from my post? Sexual Dysphoria exists and needs to be treated like any other dysphoria.

My position is very clear. Sex specific services and spaces need to be respected. Humans can't change sex therefore there are never going to be situations where it's justified for a man to have access to women's spaces. Extreme surgery doesn't make any difference to that (I don't refer to it as transitioning, because what are they transitioning from or to?)

Third spaces are the obvious answer for those uncomfortable with what's currently provided.

You're part of a movement which insists that trans women are women and trans men are men and some people are neither so we must refer to them as they/them. We are constantly being told we need to use non standard pronouns for people who want them, that we should declare our own pronouns as a sign of allyship, and that we must never ever ever say a trans woman is a man, a trans man is a woman or that nobody is non binary. We are required to comply with trans identifying people's requests to be referred to exactly as they wish, and not allowed to object to being labelled cis, AFAB, menstruators, people with cervixes and all the rest of it.

This is on the same level as the kind of language control we see in dystopian novels like 1984 and The Handmaid's Tale, only in this brave new world where men can be women, women can be men, penises can be female and forcing nurses to change in front of male colleagues is "kind", all of this is "progressive".

Thing is, we have been trying this for years. Most people I know would welcome third spaces so that everyone has safety and dignity, but transwomen absolutely will not entertain that at all, as one example.

So then why are you concerned about my questions?

I'm not 🤷‍♀️ and again, you know that. You've just run out of arguments.

Fair enough. I’m not sure where you’d stand legally though if you treated them as a bloke and they had a GRC.
And you do know that trans people are waiting years for treatment hence so few of them having reassignment surgery.

Women have been trying that for years, but unfortunately respect for our safety pales into insignificance next to a trans woman's desire for validation.

If it were about respect and safety the conversation would have moved on to third spaces.

My demand, by asking a question

your - and others - repeated demands that I answer your question, when I already declined and explained my reasons.

OK, here's a question.

If I'm a woman who feels, for whatever reason, that I don't want to get changed next to a male colleague, do you think it makes any difference to me whether that male colleague has a GRC or has had surgery?

I'm sure it does exist, and a percentage of trans people will genuinely be suffering from dysphoria, but at the end of the day, they are still the sex they were born and women should still be entitled to single-sex spaces that are actually based on gender, not sex.

I know two transwomen who transitioned way back in the 70s. Both are attracted to men and would be no risk at all to women. In fact, I'd have no personal problem sharing female spaces with them, but other women who don't know them, might not, whether for reasons of privacy or because they may worry about their safety around them, and that should absolutely be respected.

We can't just say, oh well these particular men pass fine, so they should be allowed to break the rules, We just can't.

Have you wondered why “ third spaces” might not work for trans people? Is it possible that this wouldn’t protect their safety and dignity? Could you think of any reasons why this might be?

A "fully transitioned trans woman" is male

Always will be male

always was male

and so should NOT be in FEMALE spaces EVER.

There is NO NUANCE

Never answers questions but always asking, in order to create a constant deflection. Another classic tactic that has been used on Twitter and Rdt for years, especially when the lobby manual was exposed in 2019, that seemed to ramp up this practice. You're well versed in this clearly.

The language does all feel very 1984 to me. So much so that I'm no longer sure how to say what I mean in a way it can be understood but I've decided to just stick with the original meanings of words before double speak took place. Because trying to double speak just twists the meaning which is exactly the point. We are no longer left with the ability to communicate in a clear way.

Sharing spaces with trans women doesn't work for women.

It's not all about trans people FFS.

They need to accept that other people aren't just supporting characters in the movie of their life.

People need to stop answering @piggletoes questions until they decide to answer the ones they've been asked. They're using a classic deflection tactic everyone.